|
|
Post by coachnicholson on Feb 12, 2012 13:15:52 GMT -6
How do you guys view the role of coordinators who are not head coaches? Should the coordinator have control over practice planning and game planning for his side of the ball? Or should he simply call plays on Friday nights? I know different people may have very different definitions of offensive and defensive coordinators and the trust factor will affect how much freedom you give your coordinators. I have been on staffs where the coordinators had complete control over their side of the ball and on staffs where the coordinators were basically puppets that held a title. I look forward to your responses.
Thanks.
|
|
|
|
Post by newt21 on Feb 12, 2012 13:32:04 GMT -6
IMO, the coordinator shouldn't have COMPLETE control, but very close to it. If they are not the head coach, they should make sure that what they are doing aligns with the goals and philosophy of the entire program, and if it does then that is where control begins.
Any good coordinator must plan practice and game plan, but must also get the input of the HC and make sure that the practice plan meshes with what the rest of the team is doing. I don't believe that a coordinator should strictly call plays on game night, to be successful there is alot more that must go into the job than simply calling a play. Just my .02
|
|
|
|
Post by fantom on Feb 12, 2012 13:56:16 GMT -6
If all the coordinator does is call plays on game night there's no sense having a coordinator. That's the easiest part of the job. Game planning, scout cards, practice planning, and scripting are the hard parts of the job. Obviously, all of that should be in line what the HC wants and the more experience a coordinator has the more autonomy he should have.
|
|
|
|
Post by coachorr on Feb 12, 2012 14:32:31 GMT -6
Well I think if he knows there is going to be an "inside run period" for 15 minutes on Tuesday, he should come with some plays scripted for that and possibly some fronts or vice versa and maybe some personnel groupings. If he is an OC and he is going to be no huddle, he should probably make the wrist coaches. He should probably have the game film for the opponent broke down for the opponent and a POA for the upcoming week by Sunday night to review with the HC.
Just some thoughts.
|
|
z
Junior Member
Posts: 332
|
Post by z on Feb 12, 2012 15:50:28 GMT -6
Coordinators should be able to sit down with the HC and have input into the practice plan. Ultimately, the HC will have the final call. The coordinators are there to assist the HC in the overall plan.
|
|
|
|
Post by coachwilliams2 on Feb 12, 2012 19:25:18 GMT -6
The term "coordinator" will vary from program to program. An OC working for a defensive HC will have more freedom than the DC (look at Alabama). A very successful coordinator may be brought in to a new school to run "his" system. He will have more freedom.
Ultimately it is up to the HC and Coordinator to come to an agreement about job description and duties/freedom. Once that agreement is in place, the coordinator should handle his business, while getting input from the HC.
Bottom line is, a coordinator's title is still ASSISTANT coach. HC gets the final word PERIOD.
|
|
|
|
Post by tojorich on Feb 13, 2012 9:37:48 GMT -6
I am not a HC however.........if I were King of the World or at least the HC of a HS Football program, I would insist on not only Coordinator input on all matters but everyone of my assistants would know they were free to speak their minds and offer solutions to any discussion.
I worked for a HC last season and he and the OC would meet friday night after our game and again saturday night to go over the next opponent. The entire staff would meet sunday night to "ratify" the game plan those 2 came up with. What a colossal waste of talent and brain power!! Had I known the situation going in, I would never have taken the job. I resigned 1 week after the banquet.
If I'm HC, I'm hiring a guy who knows more or something about the game that I don't know. Why the hell do I want a 'yes' man on staff?? I want discussion, conflict, arguments and, in the end, a consensus on how we're gonna beat the next opponent.
I'm currently looking for work and I have added a new area of discussion to my interview process: how much input do you like from your assistants? I want to coach. I have alot rattling around in this old head and every once in a while I have a really good Football concept. I want somebody to use my expertise.
Sorry to rant but.......
|
|
|
|
Post by coachcb on Feb 13, 2012 9:45:05 GMT -6
I put as much on my coordinators as possible.
1. Practice plan for their side of the ball and then run it by me. I may make some adjustments as I see fit.
2. Scout cards; get everything laid out and scripted. We all help put those cards together but they need to script the stuff.
3. Game planning. They are in charge of the game plan but, again, I make necessary adjustments.
4. Obviously the play calling. I generally leave them be during the game but I will throw my two cents in here and there. I make sure that we're not straying too far away from the game plan.
|
|
|
|
Post by bucksweepdotcom on Feb 13, 2012 9:58:06 GMT -6
I am not a HC however.........if I were King of the World or at least the HC of a HS Football program, I would insist on not only Coordinator input on all matters but everyone of my assistants would know they were free to speak their minds and offer solutions to any discussion. I worked for a HC last season and he and the OC would meet friday night after our game and again saturday night to go over the next opponent. The entire staff would meet sunday night to "ratify" the game plan those 2 came up with. What a colossal waste of talent and brain power!! Had I known the situation going in, I would never have taken the job. I resigned 1 week after the banquet. If I'm HC, I'm hiring a guy who knows more or something about the game that I don't know. Why the hell do I want a 'yes' man on staff?? I want discussion, conflict, arguments and, in the end, a consensus on how we're gonna beat the next opponent. I'm currently looking for work and I have added a new area of discussion to my interview process: how much input do you like from your assistants? I want to coach. I have alot rattling around in this old head and every once in a while I have a really good Football concept. I want somebody to use my expertise. Sorry to rant but....... I am curious of your situation. How many years have you been coaching? Where did you gain your expertise from? Were you an OC/DC/HC some where before? |
|
|
|
Post by bigm0073 on Feb 13, 2012 10:25:19 GMT -6
I am a current head coach and more of an Offensive Guy.. Long Time OL coach and I call the offense.
The defense coordinator on our staff is someone who coached it at the college level for 10 years and knows a lot more than I do. I give him complete control. He has put together the defense, fronts, coverages..
I will preface this by saying I would do it different than him. But he is VERY, VERY good at what he does. He gets a lot out of our kids and has a system that is flexible, adaptable and works. Part of it is he has such a strong understanding on how to run a defense.
Practice I give him an amount of time (Say 60 - 75 minutes a practice) and he breaks up his time as needed (Indy, pursuit, inside, 7 on 7, team, goaline...). It is his world.
This off season we go over stuff like personnel and basic planning but he handles the rest.
1. Cards/Scripts
2. Scouting reprots /Tip Sheets
3. Film break down via hudl. He has film sessions daily after practice and has film session "virtual" with players weekly.
4. Reviews and correct practice daily on HUDL.
5. Over the weekend he breaks down the opponent/does hit chart/ and comes in Sunday with his basic plan of attack for the defense. Outline.. What their best plays are... Where they are trying to attack/what they are trying to do..
6. I give him complete control of this. His world and I stay out of it. He gives me the updates and runs things by me... Suggestions. But it is his baby.
This is similar to how my college coach did so I guess I have kind of adopted his philosophy.
|
|
|
|
Post by coachcb on Feb 13, 2012 10:50:23 GMT -6
I am not a HC however.........if I were King of the World or at least the HC of a HS Football program, I would insist on not only Coordinator input on all matters but everyone of my assistants would know they were free to speak their minds and offer solutions to any discussion. I worked for a HC last season and he and the OC would meet friday night after our game and again saturday night to go over the next opponent. The entire staff would meet sunday night to "ratify" the game plan those 2 came up with. What a colossal waste of talent and brain power!! Had I known the situation going in, I would never have taken the job. I resigned 1 week after the banquet. If I'm HC, I'm hiring a guy who knows more or something about the game that I don't know. Why the hell do I want a 'yes' man on staff?? I want discussion, conflict, arguments and, in the end, a consensus on how we're gonna beat the next opponent. I'm currently looking for work and I have added a new area of discussion to my interview process: how much input do you like from your assistants? I want to coach. I have alot rattling around in this old head and every once in a while I have a really good Football concept. I want somebody to use my expertise. Sorry to rant but....... Ah, yes, we should take in the opinion of a lower level assistant because he resigned because he disagreed with the HC and coordinators doing the majority of the game planning. The coordinators and the HC are the ones whose a$$es are on the line if the sh-t hits the fans. They are also the coaches with the experience in the offense and game-planning around it. It sounds to me like you have been shut down in meetings because you don't know how to keep your "expertise" in control. It also sounds to me like the HC and OC are very deliberate in what they do. It sounds to me like they have had enough arguing over things on Sundays because some of the assistants don't have constructive input to provide. Or, maybe they wanted to keep staff meetings short because they didn't want to take up too much of the assistants' time. I do emphasize CONSTRUCTIVE INPUT. What suggestions did you make on Sunday nights? Did they revolve around the finer details of the game plan or were they all about Xs and Os? I am more than happy to discuss tweaking some blocking rules to accommodate a certain defensive front. I will discuss running more option that week because we don't feel we can block their force players consistently. I will not discuss installing a new plays. I will not discuss a complete departure from the game plan. |
|
|
|
Post by gapshoot76 on Feb 13, 2012 11:44:04 GMT -6
I am not a HC however.........if I were King of the World or at least the HC of a HS Football program, I would insist on not only Coordinator input on all matters but everyone of my assistants would know they were free to speak their minds and offer solutions to any discussion. I worked for a HC last season and he and the OC would meet friday night after our game and again saturday night to go over the next opponent. The entire staff would meet sunday night to "ratify" the game plan those 2 came up with. What a colossal waste of talent and brain power!! Had I known the situation going in, I would never have taken the job. I resigned 1 week after the banquet. If I'm HC, I'm hiring a guy who knows more or something about the game that I don't know. Why the hell do I want a 'yes' man on staff?? I want discussion, conflict, arguments and, in the end, a consensus on how we're gonna beat the next opponent. I'm currently looking for work and I have added a new area of discussion to my interview process: how much input do you like from your assistants? I want to coach. I have alot rattling around in this old head and every once in a while I have a really good Football concept. I want somebody to use my expertise. Sorry to rant but....... Wait a second, you want discussion, conflict, arguments, and a consensus, but you don't like having meetings that "ratify" a game plan that they oc and dc came up with... hmmm... Also there becomes a time where there is too much talking and not enough actual planning with all that discussion, conflict, and arguments. As a head coach I WANT input from my staff. Does that mean in my mind it makes something better, NO! Just because a freshman coach says something doesn't mean I'm going to put it in. Also as a head coach, my coordinator and I are currently together finishing up our playbook so everything fits both our liking. I will give the final check mark on it, but it has to be something he is knowledgeable on, and comfortable in calling on Friday nights. Next step is we TOGETHER will be teaching the stuff to our entire staff in staff meetings this spring. During season: My OC takes care of all offensive responsibilities. 1. Game planning is done primarily by him. I don't have time to scout 2 sides of the ball on the weekend. If there is something in his game plan I do not like, or question, him and I will discuss it. Remember he did the scouting so he should know more about what he put on paper then I do. 2. After both our game plans are put together, we will come together in our staff meetings, which I am moving to Sunday evenings this year to allow for more film watching. Our staff will divide in half, and we will discuss the game plan together with our half of the staff. Some things may change, but 90% of the time nothing does. This gets everyone on the same page. 3. I will give him time slots in practice, and send it to him, and he will fill it out and get it back to my in a reasonable time so we can post practice for the next day. He is responsible for all things related to offensive practice, scripts, scout cards, wrist cards, ext. 4. Of course, game night is all his. I do not question what he does during a football game. EVEN IF I think it is a stupid call at the time, I will never discuss it until later. Confrontation among staff during a game is deadly! That's my method. Doesn't mean it's perfect or right for anyone else, but it works for me. Our staff works extremely well together in this set up. |
|
|
|
Post by coachorr on Feb 13, 2012 23:31:59 GMT -6
I am not a HC however.........if I were King of the World or at least the HC of a HS Football program, I would insist on not only Coordinator input on all matters but everyone of my assistants would know they were free to speak their minds and offer solutions to any discussion. I worked for a HC last season and he and the OC would meet friday night after our game and again saturday night to go over the next opponent. The entire staff would meet sunday night to "ratify" the game plan those 2 came up with. What a colossal waste of talent and brain power!! Had I known the situation going in, I would never have taken the job. I resigned 1 week after the banquet. If I'm HC, I'm hiring a guy who knows more or something about the game that I don't know. Why the hell do I want a 'yes' man on staff?? I want discussion, conflict, arguments and, in the end, a consensus on how we're gonna beat the next opponent. I'm currently looking for work and I have added a new area of discussion to my interview process: how much input do you like from your assistants? I want to coach. I have alot rattling around in this old head and every once in a while I have a really good Football concept. I want somebody to use my expertise. Sorry to rant but....... Wait a second, you want discussion, conflict, arguments, and a consensus, but you don't like having meetings that "ratify" a game plan that they oc and dc came up with... hmmm... Also there becomes a time where there is too much talking and not enough actual planning with all that discussion, conflict, and arguments. As a head coach I WANT input from my staff. Does that mean in my mind it makes something better, NO! Just because a freshman coach says something doesn't mean I'm going to put it in. Also as a head coach, my coordinator and I are currently together finishing up our playbook so everything fits both our liking. I will give the final check mark on it, but it has to be something he is knowledgeable on, and comfortable in calling on Friday nights. Next step is we TOGETHER will be teaching the stuff to our entire staff in staff meetings this spring. During season: My OC takes care of all offensive responsibilities. 1. Game planning is done primarily by him. I don't have time to scout 2 sides of the ball on the weekend. If there is something in his game plan I do not like, or question, him and I will discuss it. Remember he did the scouting so he should know more about what he put on paper then I do. 2. After both our game plans are put together, we will come together in our staff meetings, which I am moving to Sunday evenings this year to allow for more film watching. Our staff will divide in half, and we will discuss the game plan together with our half of the staff. Some things may change, but 90% of the time nothing does. This gets everyone on the same page. 3. I will give him time slots in practice, and send it to him, and he will fill it out and get it back to my in a reasonable time so we can post practice for the next day. He is responsible for all things related to offensive practice, scripts, scout cards, wrist cards, ext. 4. Of course, game night is all his. I do not question what he does during a football game. EVEN IF I think it is a stupid call at the time, I will never discuss it until later. Confrontation among staff during a game is deadly! That's my method. Doesn't mean it's perfect or right for anyone else, but it works for me. Our staff works extremely well together in this set up. With all due respect gentlemen it doesn't seem to me that this coach was included in any of the "game planning" rather the plan was made and then laid out and said, "here it is". "Ratifying" a plan is not the same as being included into the plan and being allowed to speak your mind. |
|
|
|
Post by newhope on Feb 14, 2012 18:17:48 GMT -6
As head coach, I run the offense. The defensive coordinator is in charge of the defense. I trust him. He gameplans it, he decides what he's going to do with his practice time, he decides who plays. I have input, I know what he's going to do, but it's his show. I won't have a DC I can't trust to get it done.
Staff meetings are pretty wide open. Everyone is allowed input and encouraged to give input--even if it's not what I want to hear. I know when to put a stop to discussion and I make it clear what's not up for discussion. I generally ask---"What do you think we need to do about so and so" or "any ideas on this?".... I don't need a bunch of yes men, I need people who have ideas--and who don't mind being told "no".
|
|
