grotto
Freshmen Member
Posts: 15
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Post by grotto on Aug 14, 2011 8:04:43 GMT -6
It is hard when your son does not have the same passion for football that has been such a positive part of your own life. My son played as a freshmen, went to summer workouts, but after 3 days of practice he wants to quit. He is not the most aggressive or self-confident kid, but has the size and strength to be a lineman. The sophs practive w/ varsity and right now he feels he is just there to be a blocking dummy for the varsity. I tried to get him to give it more time (doubles are the worst part of football IMO), continue on with his commitment, etc. I WON'T force him to play if doesn't want to. Any thoughts on what I can discuss with him to try to up his confidence, etc? He likes football, just not sure he wants to play it. Thanks.
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Post by 19delta on Aug 14, 2011 8:22:20 GMT -6
The sophs practive w/ varsity and right now he feels he is just there to be a blocking dummy for the varsity. Is this true? Do other boys feel the same way?
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grotto
Freshmen Member
Posts: 15
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Post by grotto on Aug 14, 2011 10:49:58 GMT -6
Yes, at least 2 of his friends that are also soph linemen feel the same way and also want to quit. I know the whole season won't be this way, but a 15 year old can't always understand that.
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Post by bobdoc78 on Aug 14, 2011 11:25:56 GMT -6
soph year is not easy. If your on a freshman team you might be starting or in the mix. When you go to varsity your low man on the totem pole. This is a varsity team and the priority is getting ready for the varsity season. The players who dont start will have their time in jv. Its not perfect but this is how it is in most programs.
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Post by 19delta on Aug 14, 2011 11:53:02 GMT -6
I guess my point is that it sounds like these boys are not being actively engaged...
If it is true that all they are getting to do is to hold bags for the varsity, I don't blame those kids for being discouraged. I understand the concept of "earning your stripes" and "paying your dues" but, if this is the way this program does things, I can understand why kids want to quit.
Most sophomores would accept that the juniors and seniors need to get the most reps. But the coaches need to find a way to make those sophs feel that their presence is valued.
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Post by jerbyrd72 on Aug 14, 2011 13:52:11 GMT -6
I wanted to quit three times...
jr. high - I was getting hammmered by some bigger kids; The coach called me the "worst center in the city of Shreveport". I felt like I had to play because my father was a sportswriter. He told me that I did not have to play, but that kind of changed my whole prespective. I kept playing for me....I wasn't out there for him anymore. That made a big difference
high school - going into my jr. year. I was not starting and thought that I would be that kid that did not start until his senior year. I had made fun of those guys coming up through the deal...and now I was going to be one of them. My dad said he thought that I should keep playing because guys with my size were getting scholarships - just based on size. He was right. I got my first start midway through my jr. year at TE. I guess we didn't have another TE that could block.
College - This was stupid. I didn't want to play my Senior year because I was going to graduate at the end off the summer quarter and I thought that the head coach was going to be run out of town. I didn't feel like being yelled at and blamed for his firing. This is what I thought he was going to do. He was more laid back my senior year than any other......I went to my position coach. He said "BS...Your not quitting." And that was that.
I know you didn't ask for all of this, but i shared because....
1. I think it is not unnatural 2. May help into relating with how he feels 3. That just because he doesn't share your passion NOW...he may later
I am two weeks into my 15th year of coaching football and have NEVER been more juiced about going into a season than I am now.
I don't know. Maybe share a Poem with him....."Don't Quit" ...."The Race"....or "The Road Not Taken"
But in the end ....and we all know this....football is not for everybody.
Hope this helps.
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Post by fantom on Aug 14, 2011 14:12:08 GMT -6
When my son was in the 8th grade he came to our spring camp and decided after one day that he wanted to quit. He simply looked at the other players his age, realized that he had inherited my (lack of) athletic genes, and decided that he'd never play here. He was right.
I told him that he didn't have to play if he didn't want to but that he had to do something. Another sport, school newspaper, chess club, whatever. He was NOT just going right home after school and playing video games.
Fortunately we have an outstanding kicker's coach and Gregg went to him and worked at becoming a kicker. It's tough on young kids. Their friends are just hanging out after school while they get hammered at practice. If your son understands that he will NOT be one of those kids who just play X Box from 3 until dinner maybe he'll decide that he's better off sticking with football.
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Post by blb on Aug 14, 2011 14:31:47 GMT -6
When my son was in the 8th grade he came to our spring camp and decided after one day that he wanted to quit. He simply looked at the other players his age, realized that he had inherited my (lack of) athletic genes, and decided that he'd never play here. He was right. I told him that he didn't have to play if he didn't want to but that he had to do something. Another sport, school newspaper, chess club, whatever. He was NOT just going right home after school and playing video games. "Thou Shalt Not Vegetate."
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Post by Defcord on Aug 14, 2011 14:52:28 GMT -6
There were a couple great points made...my favorite was the fact that kids need to do something even if it is not football...HOPEFULLY NOT SOCCER! (JK).
My perspective is that once you start a season you can't quit until the end of the year. I will be honest I wanted to quit football every year during two a days. I love the game and would not be the person I am without it and glad I didn't quit. Being a scout team guy is no fun and two a days are suck wait til game night...The Lights...The Anthem...The First Whiste!!! There is nothing like it.
This also reminds me of my first job. I had to work during the summer in the factory where my mom had worked for years. It was hell. It was hot. It was boring. I told my mom I wanted to quit. She said wait til the first pay check. After I got that first check and pumped up the gas tank and took my girlfriend out I knew my mom was right. I volunteered for overtime. The work sucked but the pay was great. Practice sucks but the games are great!
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Post by blb on Aug 14, 2011 15:25:10 GMT -6
My perspective is that once you start a season you can't quit until the end of the year. I will be honest I wanted to quit football every year during two a days. Have been in The Game since 1967 and still feel that way. Have given in (or up) at least three times. Actually like Two-a-days better than the competitive season because it's just me, coaches, kids - teaching-learning, playing Football, having fun without worrying about winning and losing and all that goes with that. 28th year as head coach and still game nights can be the worst three hours of my week, win or lose. Been many a Friday game night (or in-season Sunday) I've vowed I'm never going to do this again, once season is over. And, yet - here I am again. Must be a "Me" problem.
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grotto
Freshmen Member
Posts: 15
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Post by grotto on Aug 14, 2011 15:42:38 GMT -6
Thanks for all of the feedback. It helps! I am going to have another talk with him - he told his grandfather he might stick it out. I've told him every year I played (thru college) there wasn't one year when I didn't at least once think that maybe the games weren't worth it. But I never quit, and yes it was all worth it. Now just to be able to explain that to a 15 year old!!!!!
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Post by blb on Aug 14, 2011 15:58:37 GMT -6
There are two reasons most teenagers play Football:
1) It's fun
2) For the camaraderie with their friends (and hopefully with coaches who have their best interests at heart, and get their egos satisfied somewhere else).
Not talking about the players who most like what being a Football player can give them (name in paper, adulation, scholarship, etc).
When you have your talk with him, focus on those two points.
And gently tell him that hard work can be fun, too.
HS Football is not, or shouldn't be, a "Zero Sum" game - that only ones who benefit are stars or starters.
So he thinks about what he might be missing.
Bottom line, his decision for his life - not Dad's.
But as earlier poster wrote - tough for kids that age to think long-term (most can't focus past next meal) and even if he doesn't play this year, he could still give it a go next.
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Post by airman on Aug 14, 2011 16:22:09 GMT -6
I am not sure you can do this anymore but many, many years ago, i mean back in the late 90s I had a bunch of kids who wanted to quit. I took them to the run down part of the town where the drunks and homeless gather. I told them, those people quit on life along time ago because when you quit the first time, each time it gets easier. none of the quit.
several years later one of the players who has become a successful business man in the area told me that day changed his life and he never quit at anything again. the image of drunks passed out in the alleyway is what he thinks about when he wants to quit.
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Post by airman on Aug 14, 2011 16:22:33 GMT -6
I am not sure you can do this anymore but many, many years ago, i mean back in the late 90s I had a bunch of kids who wanted to quit. I took them to the run down part of the town where the drunks and homeless gather. I told them, those people quit on life along time ago because when you quit the first time, each time it gets easier. none of the quit. several years later one of the players who has become a successful business man in the area told me that day changed his life and he never quit at anything again. the image of drunks passed out in the alleyway is what he thinks about when he wants to quit.
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Post by airman on Aug 14, 2011 16:24:48 GMT -6
I got this idea from Lou Holtz when his children and wife complained he was not home. He took then to the run down part of little rock arkansas and told them if he did not work hard this is where we would live and there would be hand me down clothes for school and no barbies @ christmas or new baseball gloves. His wife and kids never complained again.
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Post by blb on Aug 14, 2011 16:28:57 GMT -6
I am not sure you can do this anymore but many, many years ago, i mean back in the late 90s I had a bunch of kids who wanted to quit. I took them to the run down part of the town where the drunks and homeless gather. I told them, those people quit on life along time ago because when you quit the first time, each time it gets easier. none of the quit. several years later one of the players who has become a successful business man in the area told me that day changed his life and he never quit at anything again. the image of drunks passed out in the alleyway is what he thinks about when he wants to quit. Once when they were adolescents our two daughters started whining about me not being home enough, spending more time with them, etc. I did similarly to what you describe - drove family through worst part of town. Told them I could be home every afternoon and evening from now on, but we were going to have to live there. After that if I was home early they kept asking me if there wasn't someplace I was supposed to be - practice, meeting, clinic, etc.
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Post by airman on Aug 14, 2011 17:00:20 GMT -6
I am not sure you can do this anymore but many, many years ago, i mean back in the late 90s I had a bunch of kids who wanted to quit. I took them to the run down part of the town where the drunks and homeless gather. I told them, those people quit on life along time ago because when you quit the first time, each time it gets easier. none of the quit. several years later one of the players who has become a successful business man in the area told me that day changed his life and he never quit at anything again. the image of drunks passed out in the alleyway is what he thinks about when he wants to quit. Once when they were adolescents our two daughters started whining about me not being home enough, spending more time with them, etc. I did similarly to what you describe - drove family through worst part of town. Told them I could be home every afternoon and evening from now on, but we were going to have to live there. After that if I was home early they kept asking me if there wasn't someplace I was supposed to be - practice, meeting, clinic, etc. Lou told his children similar things. Lou's wife said if they ever made a movie of Lou's life it could be G rated because there was no sex. Woody Hayes wife had similar thoughts. Coaching football is like have a mistress on the side.
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Post by superpower on Aug 14, 2011 17:11:58 GMT -6
It is hard when your son does not have the same passion for football that has been such a positive part of your own life. My son played as a freshmen, went to summer workouts, but after 3 days of practice he wants to quit. He is not the most aggressive or self-confident kid, but has the size and strength to be a lineman. The sophs practive w/ varsity and right now he feels he is just there to be a blocking dummy for the varsity. I tried to get him to give it more time (doubles are the worst part of football IMO), continue on with his commitment, etc. I WON'T force him to play if doesn't want to. Any thoughts on what I can discuss with him to try to up his confidence, etc? He likes football, just not sure he wants to play it. Thanks. Don't allow him to quit. The season has started, and quitting is the easy way out. If he doesn't want to play next year, no problem - but do not allow him to quit now.
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grotto
Freshmen Member
Posts: 15
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Post by grotto on Aug 14, 2011 17:13:19 GMT -6
We talked about how many times in life, not just in sports, things will suck and you won't be able to quit and walkaway from your job, family, school, etc. If this was later in the season, I would not have allowed him to quit, but at this point I will not try to force him to keep playing, or threaten to take away privileges (phone, driving, etc) to make him play.
We just talked again and he doensn't have any one thing he doesn't like, just that he doesn't like it enough to keep playing, or that he can give it his best effort. I told him as long as he was being honest with himself, and was at peace wtih his decision I could accept it. He did work to prepare for the season, and gave it a shot before confirming he doesn't like it that much. Other kids did not even give it that much of a chance.
It is hard for me, but I have to trust that this is part of God's plan for his life, and that he made decision God wanted him to make, even though I can't understand that right now.
Thanks again for eveyone's thoughts. Another reason why this is a great board, even for a former coach (and hopefully will be again in the future! ) For now I'm enjoying my own kids endeavors, sports or otherwise.
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Post by blb on Aug 14, 2011 17:18:02 GMT -6
Lou told his children similar things. Lou's wife said if they ever made a movie of Lou's life it could be G rated because there was no sex. Woody Hayes wife had similar thoughts. Coaching football is like have a mistress on the side. Knew I got that from somebody wiser than me. Well, either Beth Holtz was foolin' around or Lou was 4-for-4 then because they had four children - "All boys," Lou was fond of saying, "except two." Anne Hayes was once asked if she ever considered divorce. ''Divorce? No," she replied. "Murder - yes!" Only way coaching is like having a mistress is you get screwed regularly with very little lovin' in return.
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Post by blb on Aug 14, 2011 17:27:07 GMT -6
How do you accomplish that? How would that help him or the team? Trying to be Tommy Tough Guy to your son and taking such a "moral" stand will only sour your relationship and not teach him a dam thing other than you're an unreasonable, uncaring SOB - more "Coach" than Dad. Kids find out at different times, in different ways where their aptitudes and interests lie. "Allow" him to do that.
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Post by airman on Aug 14, 2011 17:38:58 GMT -6
Lou told his children similar things. Lou's wife said if they ever made a movie of Lou's life it could be G rated because there was no sex. Woody Hayes wife had similar thoughts. Coaching football is like have a mistress on the side. Knew I got that from somebody wiser than me. Well, either Beth Holtz was foolin' around or Lou was 4-for-4 then because they had four children - "All boys," Lou was fond of saying, "except two." Anne Hayes was once asked if she ever considered divorce. ''Divorce? No," she replied. "Murder - yes!" Only way coaching is like having a mistress is you get screwed regularly with very little lovin' in return. a reporter asked Mrs Paterno if she wished Joe Paterno would retire. She responded " I would not know what to do with him wandering around the house with nothing to do" and " Joe would die if he did not have Penn State football to get up for every morning"
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grotto
Freshmen Member
Posts: 15
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Post by grotto on Aug 14, 2011 18:01:23 GMT -6
Blb, I agree with your response. I'm not saying my reaction and decision with my son is the right or wrong way for anyone else to choose with their own child/players. I'm just doing what I think is best, and it won't be long before he will be on his own and having to make decisions and deal with whatever the consequences of those may be.
Again, great thing about this board is that everyone tries to help each other, even though we don't always agree on just how that should be done!
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Post by fantom on Aug 14, 2011 18:07:13 GMT -6
When I hear guys say that a kid shouldn't quit after practice has started I always wonder how else they were supposed to find out that they didn't like football. I have no problem with a kid deciding within a few days that this isn't for him. Football is a hell of a commitment: three or four months of five or six days a week. If a kid decides early on that he doesn't want to do it why hold him to it?
Now, if they want to quit after games start, that's a different story. He's quitting for a different reason.
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Post by k on Aug 14, 2011 19:28:23 GMT -6
When I hear guys say that a kid shouldn't quit after practice has started I always wonder how else they were supposed to find out that they didn't like football. I have no problem with a kid deciding within a few days that this isn't for him. Football is a hell of a commitment: three or four months of five or six days a week. If a kid decides early on that he doesn't want to do it why hold him to it? Totally agree. I tell kids to come out for spring practice and freshmen to come out in the fall and to give it either the entire spring or until the first scrimmage. If you don't like it then you can leave the team and we'll consider it a trial and you didn't quit.
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Post by Defcord on Aug 14, 2011 21:15:05 GMT -6
When I hear guys say that a kid shouldn't quit after practice has started I always wonder how else they were supposed to find out that they didn't like football. I have no problem with a kid deciding within a few days that this isn't for him. Football is a hell of a commitment: three or four months of five or six days a week. If a kid decides early on that he doesn't want to do it why hold him to it? Now, if they want to quit after games start, that's a different story. He's quitting for a different reason. I don't think you should quit after the season starts even if you don't like it, just don't come out the following year. I wouldn't let my own child quit until it was over. I don't care if others let their kids quit but it just doesn't seem right to me. I wouldn't quit the school I am teaching at after starting the school year because I feel like once you start the school year you have made a committment. Even if I don't like it I feel an obligation. Again not saying their is a right or wrong in this situation but my family will at least finish the season.
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Post by fantom on Aug 14, 2011 21:37:09 GMT -6
When I hear guys say that a kid shouldn't quit after practice has started I always wonder how else they were supposed to find out that they didn't like football. I have no problem with a kid deciding within a few days that this isn't for him. Football is a hell of a commitment: three or four months of five or six days a week. If a kid decides early on that he doesn't want to do it why hold him to it? Now, if they want to quit after games start, that's a different story. He's quitting for a different reason. I don't think you should quit after the season starts even if you don't like it, just don't come out the following year. I wouldn't let my own child quit until it was over. I don't care if others let their kids quit but it just doesn't seem right to me. I wouldn't quit the school I am teaching at after starting the school year because I feel like once you start the school year you have made a committment. Even if I don't like it I feel an obligation. Again not saying their is a right or wrong in this situation but my family will at least finish the season. I want to make it clear that I'm only talking about kids who haven't played before. I think it's too big of a commitment to ask a kid to do what we do if they realize early that they don't like it.
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Post by 42falcon on Aug 14, 2011 21:54:21 GMT -6
That is part of coaching you need to make it enjoyable for all kids. Some are going to want to quit early on sometimes that involves you making a sell job to keep them. You never know how good a grade 10 kid is gonna be.
Kids need to get to try sports plain and simple if they are not interested so be it. My parents made me try to play an instrument I chose the guitar it lasted 1 round of lessons maybe 3 months I played the darn thing a dozen times and just wasn't interested. However when I tried it out and took lessons (our equivelant of practice of camp) the instructor did not give me a "no quit" clause.
If your boy isn't into it ask him why? He is telling you he wants out but his buddies also want out, that probably has more to do with it than anything else. Talk to him about that VS the confidence or any of that stuff.
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Post by teddymac44 on Aug 15, 2011 1:42:05 GMT -6
I don't get why programs put Soph's on varsity that aren't ready or practice with varsity when you have a JV team? Makes no sense to me really! How are you developing your Soph's by having them get the snot knocked out of them every fricking day!
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Post by 19delta on Aug 15, 2011 7:09:58 GMT -6
I don't get why programs put Soph's on varsity that aren't ready or practice with varsity when you have a JV team? Makes no sense to me really! How are you developing your Soph's by having them get the snot knocked out of them every fricking day! My point precisely. It seems that most of the responses in this thread so far have focused on the player's attitude. Maybe the focus should be on the coaches because the way they are doing things is driving good kids off.
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