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Post by husky44 on May 13, 2011 21:18:32 GMT -6
Coaches, I am preparing to take over a program that has won two games in the last three seasons. I want to focus on the process of winning and not wins itself. I would like to set tangible goals that are attainable and if achieved, can lead to success (wins). If you have been in a similar situation before, please share what you did with regards to goal setting.
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baler22
Sophomore Member
Posts: 120
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Post by baler22 on May 14, 2011 4:05:11 GMT -6
Goal setting shouldnt be concrete but attainable goals that rise as you progres. Concentrate on praise success of these goals. It could even be daily goals. Try and create a culture of success this way rather than focusing on big goals
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Post by fballcoachg on May 14, 2011 6:04:21 GMT -6
I do like the setting daily goals, such as "wing the day" and set some benchmarks. Also, talking about winning, you may want to redefine winning, if the team has only won 2 games in 3 years setting a win total may not be the best thing. Define winning as being competitive, cutting down on mistakes, playing hard through the final whistle, etc. When you have accomplished those you can start setting actual win total expectations.
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Post by ehartman on May 14, 2011 6:39:09 GMT -6
Check out Jim Tressel's book. He does a good job of discussing the process of helping athletes set goals for themselves and for the team. He emphasizes that WIN is the ultimate goal, but it's not enough to make it the only goal; how do you win? So he sets goals like "rush for 200 yards, pass for 200 yards" that, if accomplished, will usually result in a win. Something like that might be good - emphasize the steps and processes toward winning, but don't make winning the only criteria for success.
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kyle
Sophomore Member
Posts: 200
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Post by kyle on May 14, 2011 9:52:22 GMT -6
Coaches, I am preparing to take over a program that has won two games in the last three seasons. I want to focus on the process of winning and not wins itself. I would like to set tangible goals that are attainable and if achieved, can lead to success (wins). If you have been in a similar situation before, please share what you did with regards to goal setting. My first year coaching I took over a team that did not win a game the year before. That year we didn't win a single game, or score a single point (I wasn't the OC thankfully). Then I took over the next year as HC, and I made practice all about winning. I think that mentality changed everything. That... and I learned quite a bit about football in the off season. I think that mentality has a large factor.
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Post by thehoodie on May 14, 2011 10:36:23 GMT -6
Like Kyle, I like making everything a competition. It's what boys respond to the most. The ultimate goal is to win the ship, but if you make everything you do a competition, whether it is drills in practice, or lifting in the weight room, that will slowly change the culture.
Speaking of culture, you'd be surprised how much influence us coaches have on players. The coach who isn't very organized, doesn't have a very clear plan, and isn't "competitive" as compared to his peers (ie. the cross-rival down the street), will find that his players will respond accordingly. Players aren't dumb, they talk to their friends at other schools.
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Post by Coach.A on May 14, 2011 10:59:46 GMT -6
I would focus heavily on attendance goals (weight room and practice attendance). Also focus on strength and conditioning benchmarks, for example:
- All senior OL bench press over 240 by training camp - All defensive backs vertical over 24" by training camp - etc.
Set some clearly defined, attainable and measurable goals. Put a timeframe or deadline on those goals. And clearly communicate the goals to your team.
I would also recommend that you try to identify the leaders as soon as possible. If you can find a few strong leaders on your team, this process becomes easier.
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Post by fantom on May 14, 2011 11:43:08 GMT -6
I would focus heavily on attendance goals (weight room and practice attendance). Also focus on strength and conditioning benchmarks, for example: - All senior OL bench press over 240 by training camp - All defensive backs vertical over 24" by training camp - etc. . What do you do if they don't make it?
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Post by davishfc on May 14, 2011 11:51:04 GMT -6
Also, talking about winning, you may want to redefine winning, if the team has only won 2 games in 3 years setting a win total may not be the best thing. Define winning as being competitive, cutting down on mistakes, playing hard through the final whistle, etc. When you have accomplished those you can start setting actual win total expectations. "Redefine success" is the way I referred to this same issue when I took over a program in shambles four years ago. Take the word winning out of the vocabulary of your program. This is the most important step to setting and accomplishing goals in this situation. I'm sure "winning" has been the focus for that program in the past and with two wins in three years, it obviously has not been effective. So it's time to take a different approach which means removing the term. I'm talking coaches, players, parents, administration, and community members. Obviously there's only two groups there you have absolute control of which is the coaching staff and players. But eliminate the word "winning." I'm ecstatic that Charlie Sheen put this negative aura around the term "winning" with his rants. He's such an idiot and he's using the term "winning" which in my opinion has helped to cheapen the term. It's probably the single greatest contribution that will ever be made in the world of competitive team sports. Don't get me wrong, I'm a very competitive person particularly when it comes to football and it permeates our football program. But when you take over a poor program, winning doesn't happen as often. Humility tends to occur more often especially if winning continues to be the focus. I believe in replacing the term "winning" with "success" because your team may come in this year and not win a game but that doesn't mean the program wasn't successful. Maybe the team competed with schools that they never competed with in the past. That's success. You didn't WIN but you were SUCCESSFUL. Develop and communicate your blueprint for success to everyone involved in the program. Your position is that you want the program to be successful but, more importantly, you're going to show them how to go about being successful. Our Pillars of Success are the values of our program. They include: Commitment, Discipline, Effort, Toughness, and Pride. We believe that if we follow through on that process from start to finish that the program will be successful. The thing about goals when taking over a poor program is making them realistic and achievable (even more so than you would in an established program). You certainly want your kids to dream big but with where your program is at, big is...being competitive on every snap, cutting down on mistakes, playing hard through the final whistle. "Control the controllables" is the phrase that comes to mind here. Get your players focusing on the process rather than the end result. They have control over whether or not they are successful and they need to understand, embrace, and take responsibility for it. Then once your players in the program understand how to go about being successful, if they do it consistently enough they will have the opportunity to win games. You understand that it probably won't happen right off the bat. If it doesn't it's still important to let those early teams know that they laid the foundation of success for teams of the future. They showed them what the process of success looks like. More importantly, they showed the up and coming players what your program's blueprint for success looks like in action. If your blueprint is an effective one and you do a great job of communicating what it is and motivating those around you to make decisions and take actions toward it, it's only a matter of time before the emphasis on "success" translates into "wins." Turning a program around is certainly one of my favorite coaching topics because I live it everyday. I hope something in here helps you. Good luck to you husky44.
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Post by davishfc on May 14, 2011 12:14:39 GMT -6
I would focus heavily on attendance goals (weight room and practice attendance). Also focus on strength and conditioning benchmarks, for example: - All senior OL bench press over 240 by training camp - All defensive backs vertical over 24" by training camp - etc. . What do you do if they don't make it? I was just thinking the same thing. Well, if they're the best you have and they don't make it then they still play...a lot. So I don't know what message that sends. Actually I do and it's not a positive one. I agree about setting expectations in the weight room. Control the controllables and a commitment to showing up and exerting great effort in the weight room are definitely controllables. We have clubs for our players to achieve in the weight room. But we've never said "ALL linemen will..." or "ALL skill players will..." I think this is setting up a disconnect between expectations and players meeting them or not because if they don't there is still a good chance that kid could play. What do those expectations mean then? This is why we stick to clubs and just get our players to compete with one another to be the best each of them can possibly be. Reach their full potential is all any football player can do. We want that and try to bring that out of every player we coach.
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Post by Coach Huey on May 14, 2011 12:41:03 GMT -6
you better dust off any and all speeches you have regarding "commitment". define what it is... point it out at EVERY turn... "men, what joe here has just done shows great commitment."... "mark, that is not what we are looking for, that is not being committed."
you need to teach them how to commit before you can teach them how to compete. can't learn how to win, if they can't learn how to compete. you get the cycle.
put forth your expectations. raise the bar on the expectation level regarding commitment - i.e. work ethic, attendance, training performance, effort, punctuality, hustle, attentiveness, respect.... model it, point out the good & the bad DIRECTLY right when it happens. don't worry about taking someone "off to the side" to let them know they aren't committed.... public display of what the expectations are. raising expectations of what the players expect of themselves means they have to get committed or get on with something else.
what do you do with the "uncommitted"? with those that can't meet expectations? well, let's just say sometimes you gotta shoot a hostage. i mean, hey, been losing with 'em ... why not try winning without 'em?
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Post by fballcoachg on May 14, 2011 12:48:38 GMT -6
davishfc,
I like the idea of saying successful instead of winning and the rest of your post gets to the point I was trying to make, you just said it more efficiently.
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Post by davishfc on May 14, 2011 12:59:39 GMT -6
you better dust off any and all speeches you have regarding "commitment". define what it is... point it out at EVERY turn... "men, what joe here has just done shows great commitment."... "mark, that is not what we are looking for, that is not being committed." you need to teach them how to commit before you can teach them how to compete. can't learn how to win, if they can't learn how to compete. you get the cycle. put forth your expectations. raise the bar on the expectation level regarding commitment - i.e. work ethic, attendance, training performance, effort, punctuality, hustle, attentiveness, respect.... model it, point out the good & the bad DIRECTLY right when it happens. don't worry about taking someone "off to the side" to let them know they aren't committed.... public display of what the expectations are. raising expectations of what the players expect of themselves means they have to get committed or get on with something else. what do you do with the "uncommitted"? with those that can't meet expectations? well, let's just say sometimes you gotta shoot a hostage. i mean, hey, been losing with 'em ... why not try winning without 'em? Yes! Yes! Yes! Awesome post Huey. The teachable moments when you inherit a losing program are constant. Taking advantage of each and every, as you stated, "public displays of the expectations" is extremely important. These may be positive moments and there will be some negative moments as well but that comes with the territory. It's the culmination of those teachable moments that will communicate to the players what it takes to be successful. You're right, commitment must occur before they are ever able to compete. We believe our other four pillars in that order also have to occur before a team can compete. If our players choose not to do things our way and instead do things their own way then it's time for them to move on. We tell our players that our program is a boat heading in a direction toward success. We've got guys rowing but if one wants to put an anchor in the water and hold the group back, well then it's time to throw him and his anchor overboard. But I have to admit, I love the "shoot the hostage" bit. Reminds me of an old school flick...
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Post by davishfc on May 14, 2011 13:11:44 GMT -6
I love that Deer Hunter homage ;D. The guy definitely made some poor choices, but I do think that his book has a lot of good ideas. I thought it was hilarious when I found it also. Don't get me wrong. I like Tressel's book The Winner's Manual. I'm not a hardcore Michigan fan like some because no die hard is going to touch that book let alone read it. I'm a football coach trying to learn something new everyday so I read the reviews, gave it a chance, and read it. I liked the book even though it was slow in parts. It was just real difficult for him to maintain a level of credibility with me personally when the truth came out. It's not right, I know, but that's what happens when someone makes poor choices. They lose people's confidence.
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Post by coachcb on May 14, 2011 13:17:45 GMT -6
I have found that you need to lay the foundation for winning without overly emphasizing winning. Drive home all of those things that make a team successful but stay away from directly talking about winning.
Like many have pointed out, you need to redefine success... For us, it was as simple as picking up first downs.. Much less scoring points and winning football games.
Personally, I stray away from "stats discussion"; I try not to set team goals for yardage, points, etc. It all boils down to the win or loss, regardless of the stats you put up. You can win some very tight games against good opponents and not hit a single stats goal. On the flip side, you can lose a game and meet every single one of your stats goals. So, it can become very hypocritical. These are goals that coach think lead to overall success (winning) but, in all reality, they might not show much.
Plus, in my situation, we need to beat the individuality out our kids with respect to football. I have more than a few kids that weren't too broken up about a loss last year if they got their "numbers". They got a good dose of reality when I gave a lineman the only individual award we have. The kid came to practice every day, worked hard, and blocked his a-- off for the lil prima donnas. We had a back that would have been in line for it but he missed two practices the week before we lost a game where he fumbled he fumbled the ball into the end zone twice.
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Post by fantom on May 14, 2011 13:20:58 GMT -6
you better dust off any and all speeches you have regarding "commitment". define what it is... point it out at EVERY turn... "men, what joe here has just done shows great commitment."... "mark, that is not what we are looking for, that is not being committed." you need to teach them how to commit before you can teach them how to compete. can't learn how to win, if they can't learn how to compete. you get the cycle. put forth your expectations. raise the bar on the expectation level regarding commitment - i.e. work ethic, attendance, training performance, effort, punctuality, hustle, attentiveness, respect.... model it, point out the good & the bad DIRECTLY right when it happens. don't worry about taking someone "off to the side" to let them know they aren't committed.... public display of what the expectations are. raising expectations of what the players expect of themselves means they have to get committed or get on with something else. what do you do with the "uncommitted"? with those that can't meet expectations? well, let's just say sometimes you gotta shoot a hostage. i mean, hey, been losing with 'em ... why not try winning without 'em? Yes! Yes! Yes! Awesome post Huey. The teachable moments when you inherit a losing program are constant. Taking advantage of each and every, as you stated, "public displays of the expectations" is extremely important. These may be positive moments and there will be some negative moments as well but that comes with the territory. It's the culmination of those teachable moments that will communicate to the players what it takes to be successful. You're right, commitment must occur before they are ever able to compete. We believe our other four pillars in that order also have to occur before a team can compete. If our players choose not to do things our way and instead do things their own way then it's time for them to move on. We tell our players that our program is a boat heading in a direction toward success. We've got guys rowing but if one wants to put an anchor in the water and hold the group back, well then it's time to throw him and his anchor overboard. But I have to admit, I love the "shoot the hostage" bit. Reminds me of an old school flick... I agree with all of this but that's why I asked what you do with kids who don't meet those goals. Keeping in mind that it's mid-May you may not get great improvements in S&C testing. So, you have a kid who has bought in but was way behind. Now he's showing great commintent. He's doing exactly what you want. Do you get rid of him because he can't lift a certain amount in the weight room. All I'm saying is that you need to be careful about painting yourself into a corner when you're making goals.
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Post by Coach Huey on May 14, 2011 13:37:47 GMT -6
I agree with all of this but that's why I asked what you do with kids who don't meet those goals. Keeping in mind that it's mid-May you may not get great improvements in S&C testing. So, you have a kid who has bought in but was way behind. Now he's showing great commintent. He's doing exactly what you want. Do you get rid of him because he can't lift a certain amount in the weight room. All I'm saying is that you need to be careful about painting yourself into a corner when you're making goals. commitment isn't about how much weight you lifted, or how fast you ran your 40, or how good you run a route, etc. it isn't the tangible items. it's the intangibles. address that first. how often they lift - set that as a goal. "we will lift 3 days a week" or whatever... not how much - how often. "we will run this many sprints on these days", etc. address the effort. if they rise up to the heightened expectations with their intangibles, then we all know the tangible/testable things will rise as well. they've been losing. something has to change. it isn't going to be their "bench press" that gets them to the next step, it's going to be their commitment. those that don't take the next step (those that won't commit) should be removed - as they're never going to get it. it's not painting yourself into a corner if a kid doesn't get stronger or faster because that wasn't the criteria you set... it's removing those individuals that aren't making the required EFFORT to get better. how important are they if you are losing already?
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Post by Coach.A on May 14, 2011 13:41:44 GMT -6
I would focus heavily on attendance goals (weight room and practice attendance). Also focus on strength and conditioning benchmarks, for example: - All senior OL bench press over 240 by training camp - All defensive backs vertical over 24" by training camp - etc. . What do you do if they don't make it? Good question. I guess I didn't word my response the best way. They are goals, not be all end alls. If your team is achieving all of its goals, then you probably aren't setting goals that are challenging enough. We tell our players that if we can reach those benchmarks, we have a greater opportunity to be successful. The strength standards are something to shoot for. They give our players a sense of purpose for their work outs...they clearly define our expectations. If you don't know where you're going, it's much harder to get there. We've also found that these position group standards help bond our athletes and develop some accountability with our players (e.g. one O-Linemen isn't coming to all of the work outs and is preventing the OL from achieving their position group goal...he will feel some peer pressure from his team mates to get in the weight room). If you've spent enough time training high school athletes you have a pretty good understanding of what is attainable with regards to strength numbers. I like to set team goals, position group goals and individual goals as well. In the off-season, the greatest emphasis is placed on individual goals. When dealing with team or groups goals for strength numbers you have to take other variables into consideration like school population. We don't kick kids off the team or take away starting positions if they aren't attaining these goals. There are too many variables that could prevent an athlete from achieving these goals even if the athlete is committed to the program (e.g. injuries, multi-sport athletes not be able to lift as often as other players, illness, family issues, etc.).
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Post by Coach Huey on May 14, 2011 13:48:20 GMT -6
The Tough Work of Reestablishing a Program
Rule One: Make it clear from day one that you’re in charge. • People are people o Keys to motivation and performance to the fullest potential is essentially the same whether playing on a football field or working in an office.
• Be honest with people o The only way to change people is to tell them in the clearest possible terms what they’re doing wrong.
• Taking Charge o To lead, you’ve got to be a leader. o Show everyone that losing will no longer be tolerated.
• What the team is all about: o Achievement---that comes only with relentless effort and commitment.
• Communicate o Talk to them as a group: establish your credibility as a leader o Talk to them personally: deliver the message to each member individually o Explain exactly what is expected from each of them o Look for team strengths; look for team weaknesses
Rule 2: Confrontation is healthy • To get the most out of people, you have to apply pressure o Push the players to perform at a high level
• To create pressure, it requires confrontation o Confrontation does not mean to put someone down or humiliate them o Confrontation allows you to get to the sources of their behavior and motivation
• Criticize by putting it in a positive context o i.e., “I don’t think you’re performing up to your potential; you can do better.” “I think you’re better than you think you are.” o My goals are your goals. “It’s in your best interest that you succeed, and it’s in my best interest that you succeed. We really want the same thing.”
• Use the direct approach o Be clear and open
Rule 3: Set small goals and attain them. • Success generates success o Build a culture of success o Accentuate the positive at every possible opportunity
• Establish a clear set of goals that are within immediate reach o Be a smart team and have pride o Well-conditioned and play hard
• Emphasize the next goal that needs to be fulfilled o Set small, visible goals o Break the habit of losing and begin to get into the habit of winning
Rule 4: Develop a staff and continue with the plan • Use care in selecting the right people o Put the right people in the right spot. o Don’t limit your search for people.
• Be solution-oriented o Be problem-specific: do not attempt to generalise a solution to other problems. o Be non-optimal: find a solution, not all solutions, and maybe not the best solution.
• Develop a sense of who will likely work out and who will not. o Look for the person who understands what it will take to succeed and is committed to making the effort. o Look for people that share the same goals and the same passion as you.
• Push and challenge them to achieve the highest goal. o Strive to win and be a champion.
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Post by husky44 on May 14, 2011 13:49:37 GMT -6
These are some great responses. I like the reminder to use positive and negative teachable moments on a daily basis to teach the characteristics of a winner. Focusing on dedication, determination, discipline, etc... is important but what about tangible goals like rushing yards, passing yards, 3rd down defense etc... How many of you see relevance to that in a situation like this?
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Post by davishfc on May 14, 2011 14:06:56 GMT -6
I agree with all of this but that's why I asked what you do with kids who don't meet those goals. Keeping in mind that it's mid-May you may not get great improvements in S&C testing. So, you have a kid who has bought in but was way behind. Now he's showing great commintent. He's doing exactly what you want. Do you get rid of him because he can't lift a certain amount in the weight room. All I'm saying is that you need to be careful about painting yourself into a corner when you're making goals. commitment isn't about how much weight you lifted, or how fast you ran your 40, or how good you run a route, etc. it isn't the tangible items. it's the intangibles. address that first. how often they lift - set that as a goal. "we will lift 3 days a week" or whatever... not how much - how often. "we will run this many sprints on these days", etc. address the effort. if they rise up to the heightened expectations with their intangibles, then we all know the tangible/testable things will rise as well. they've been losing. something has to change. it isn't going to be their "bench press" that gets them to the next step, it's going to be their commitment. those that don't take the next step (those that won't commit) should be removed - as they're never going to get it. it's not painting yourself into a corner if a kid doesn't get stronger or faster because that wasn't the criteria you set... it's removing those individuals that aren't making the required EFFORT to get better. how important are they if you are losing already? Commitment, Discipline, Effort, Toughness, and Pride = SUCCESS
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Post by davishfc on May 14, 2011 14:15:30 GMT -6
These are some great responses. I like the reminder to use positive and negative teachable moments on a daily basis to teach the characteristics of a winner. Focusing on dedication, determination, discipline, etc... is important but what about tangible goals like rushing yards, passing yards, 3rd down defense etc... How many of you see relevance to that in a situation like this? Understand the negative teachable moments will probably outweigh the positives for awhile. You have to expect that, they've been losing for a reason. Most likely because those involved with the program haven't consistently demonstrated commitment, discipline, effort, toughness, and pride. Those values are what lead to success and the program has clearly been lacking them. So when the positive teachable moments do occur, be twice as emotional and pumped up about those to bring the teachable moments back to balance in terms of enthusiasm. You need to be emphatic about discouraging characteristics that do not lead to success. However, you need to be twice as enthused when reinforcing the characteristics that your players are displaying that you know lead to success. Show them you're proud of them. "That's it...right there! Great effort Johnny! That's what we need to do boys!!!"
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Post by coachwoodall on May 16, 2011 8:47:03 GMT -6
Echo the above about 'success'.
When you do talk to them about 'winning', tell them winning won't be determined for 15-20 years. They'll be winners when They're: - productive workers in their business or trade - deacons in their church - good husbands and fathers - show up for their kids' PTO meeting/parent conferences/etc - helping in the community and volunteering - donating lots of money to the TD Club ;D
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