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Post by Coach Bennett on Dec 26, 2007 9:53:43 GMT -6
I was just reading the "Rodriguez Spread Offense: from the beginning to now" thread (great read) and was wondering how many of you agree or disagree with the idea that if you play many cold weather/sloppy games that the power game is ultimately more effective than the spread?
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Post by brophy on Dec 26, 2007 10:10:33 GMT -6
wind would be the only concern with throwing the ball.
temperature and field conditions are moot.
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Post by theprez98 on Dec 26, 2007 10:15:33 GMT -6
In the slop-bowl at Heinz Field between the Steelers and Dolphins a few weeks back:
Miami 159 total yards, 49 rushing Pittsburgh 216 total yards, 84 rushing
Miami was 14-24 passing Pittsburgh was 18-21 passing
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Dec 26, 2007 11:55:05 GMT -6
Interesting topic. Just read Joe Tiller's take on this today.
["When I got to Purdue, they told me that there was no way the spread would work here because of the weather," Tiller said. "That never made much sense to me, because I had just been having great success with it in Wyoming. Maybe they didn't know what November is like in Wyoming."
While Tiller was one of the coaches to bring the spread offense - a system using four or five receivers on many plays, and a quarterback in the shotgun formation on most snaps - to a wider audience, it has now become the latest trendy scheme. Tiller, though, doesn't consider it some kind of unstoppable attack.
"It's one of those cyclical things. Right now, the spread is the hot offense," he said. "In a few years, the pendulum might change again, and everyone will be playing the wishbone again."[/i]
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dgs
Junior Member
Posts: 295
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Post by dgs on Dec 26, 2007 12:13:30 GMT -6
I believe wind is the only true weather problem for spread teams. I am a d coordinator and the thing I love to see the most is a good side wind when we play passing teams. The cold is an issue only if the QB has small hands; makes it tougher to grip the ball.
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Post by coachd5085 on Dec 26, 2007 12:23:17 GMT -6
I would argue that in H.S...teams that are used to executing plays with as few possession switches and changes of direction AND ARE CAPABLE of controlling the LOS have a decided advantage.
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Post by rideanddecide on Dec 26, 2007 14:14:21 GMT -6
I would disagree with the cold not being a factor.
Cold hurts. Try catching a ball when you can't feel your hands. You can always make the case that it also hurts to tackle, and block, and everything else and yada yada yada....
But, I strongly feel that when it is cold it is easier to hand off and run than make and accurate throw (with a cold arm and hands you can't feel) and then a catch (with hands you can't feel).
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Post by spreadattack on Dec 26, 2007 14:40:59 GMT -6
It makes a difference. How much? Good coaching and discipline can overcome it. Hence Tiller, etc. But of course it's easier to throw the ball in nice weather. Side wind can be a problem, cold can be a problem, a slicked rain can be a problem.
Again, how much? QB hand size is important, as is overall discipline. I mean, even sunny weather can present problems with the QB and/or receivers looking into the sun and cant see the ball. The elements are part of the game. I think "moot" is too strong a word, but evidence shows they can be overcome.
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Post by goldenbear76 on Dec 26, 2007 16:09:06 GMT -6
Cold, Rain, etc...that stuff doesn't matter to the extent that you can throw the ball accurately imho. Wind on the other hand..is the great passing game killer. A good 25mph wind can make 5 yard passes tough to throw. IMHO, if your dealing with wind...you run the ball, and when you throw..you throw deep.
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Post by coachd5085 on Dec 26, 2007 17:43:04 GMT -6
goldenbear--I would agree with you that cold and some degree of frain doesn't affect the ability to THROW the ball. Catching the ball on the other hand...
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Post by airman on Dec 26, 2007 18:36:39 GMT -6
one has to define cold weather games? if you are talking the cold weather game that the bears and the packers played then yes, I will say the conditions did effect the level of play.
however, most high school playoff games the temps are in the 30s in the upper midwest. if that is cold then you clearly are a southerner.
most teams who fail throwing the ball in conditions failed to practice those conditions.
1. do not let kids be ball boys. this is a very important job and leaving it up to young kids will only hurt you. look for volunteer parents. the big key to keeping a ball dry on a rainy night it not letting it touch the ground to often and using plastic bags not towels to cover the ball.
2. using volunteer parents you can have a few of them drying the ball off on the sideline with a heater. the more the better. they have to be willing to come to practice on thursday evening however. most will find away.
3. using volunteer parents helps the no huddle attack. they understand the concept of hurry on and hurry off. ballboys tend to be slow cause they are kids.
4. particing with a wet ball. this has to be done once per week all sesaon long. got this from a option guy who was tired of players fumbling in wet conditions.
5. flood the field. teach wr how to run in a flooded field so they have experienced running on mud. do it early in the season during two days then ever other week.
6. bring 16 dry balls to each game. place them into 4 rubbermaids. one for each quarter. the rubbermaids keep them dry on the sidelines.
7. wr and qb need to play catch every day. if you want to throw the ball and you do like most teams, practice o and d on opposite days you will fail in the passing game.
8. ball dry. it exsists, so use it. a passing team who fails to use ball dry is planning to lose.
9. have small plastic garabage bags for skill players to put gloves and extra gloves in. during warmup do not let your skill players wear their gloves. start the game with dry gloves. extra gloves in bags staying dry.
10. for cold conditions get hand warmers. most ever kid has a hand warmer to go hunting with. bring it to the game. camo is fine. a package of handwarmers is like 3 bucks for 10 of them. you break the hand warmer open, expose them to air and they generate heat for hour on end. insert them into the handwarmer pouch and your hands stay warm.
11. rainy nights equal big play nights or big cushion nights. big cushion, you throw short passes. make them tackle. big plays when the db falls down.
12. as the season goes on, put balls in a plastice bag, put them in a cooler with ice surrounding them and use them at practice as it gets colder. it is all about concentration and expperience.
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Post by kurtbryan on Dec 26, 2007 23:12:48 GMT -6
These are great notes, what best ideas do you all like in Rain if you do not see it a lot for throwing the football other than the ones posted?
KB
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Post by goldenbear76 on Dec 26, 2007 23:53:38 GMT -6
In wet weather games..one of the things we do is put towels on the back of both our guards, so if the qb needs to dry..he has two options. We change towels each quarter. Its been helpful, and QB doesn't have to deal with the towel during the center snap..also good for shotgun. (no hanging towel).
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Post by lionhart on Dec 27, 2007 10:20:20 GMT -6
airman..... that was tremendous. some of those ideas you listed, i had never thought of! will definitely apply next year. thanks again for what its worth, i feel that those who frown upon the "passing offenses" try to find any way possible to point out why it wont work. (you ALL know the typoe of people im talking about) the bottom line is this... weather affects the outcome of a game sometimes, period. it can affect a shotgun snap as well as an under center snap. it can cause wr;s to drop passes as well as rb's to fumble or slip. if you really want to overanalyze this, then wind affects the punting/kicking game just as much as the passing game. a game played in 25mph winds or more... there many things that will be affected... not just the passing game.
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