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Post by oleballcoach on Mar 21, 2011 12:53:23 GMT -6
We are currently looking at how to handle coaching responsibilities for our varsity team. We don't have as many coaches as we would like but we have 7 varsity coaches. We're also going to have a little depth on our team so we'll have some kids playing both way. My question is, what are your thoughts (pros & cons) on coaching a position on both sides of the ball or just having one side with one position? To me, it seems preparation & game planning would be difficult having to be responsible for both sides. Making adjustments would be difficult especially for coordinators because you may be asked to talk with defensive players and still be responsible for your offensive players on the field. How does your staff work out the coaching details?
That's just off the top of my head. Thanks in advance for sharing.
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Post by leighty on Mar 21, 2011 13:09:05 GMT -6
Seems to me you could coach a team up pretty good with seven varsity coaches.
QB
RB
WR
OL
DL
LB
DB
Seven position groups, seven coaches
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Post by JVD on Mar 21, 2011 13:19:27 GMT -6
We have 2 coaches for varsity (A few volenteers, but with work, they can't always make it...so count on 2)
I take the OL and the HC takes backs (Sometimes ends go with him for pass skelly, sometimes they come with me to block)
On D I take the D-line and LB's, HC takes the DB's.
He runs/calls the O
I run/call the D
We rarely have over 18-20 players....so it works out okay.
I would like some more 1 on 1 time with the DL and the LB's by themselves....and I do on the side sometimes, but overall it works alright.
JVD
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Post by stackattack on Mar 21, 2011 16:40:18 GMT -6
The problem (as we have encountered) with coaching one side of the ball on a team where players play both ways is coaches having nothing to do when their side isn't practicing. You have to do one of two things under this scenario to prevent idle coaches.
1. You have a side of the ball that is your "speciality". Game-planning and gameday responsibilities are ONLY dealing with that side of the ball. You would have to meet with the other side of the ball before the week to get the adjustments they have made. Then you "help" a position coach on the other side of the ball during practice like running drills. Someone is always assigned to the run the scout team and if you aren't assigned to do that, then you watch the position on offense during team drills that you helped out with during drills. The coordinators are often held out of helping with another position, as they have more responsibilities as it is, but they are usually the ones running the scout teams.
2. After your practice is complete, you go up and watch more film and adjust gameplans, etc.
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Post by coachsky on Mar 21, 2011 17:57:12 GMT -6
There are mostly pro's and a few cons.
If you have the tools(enough staff) and a larger group of players (60 or more) I think you really have to move to coaching one side.
Pro's:
- It allows for in depth specialization
- get better time for film study
- closer relationship with your guys
- Guys dedicated to scouting
- Staff to coach up the scout teams and make sure we are always getting the best look possible
- meetings and planning session are way more efficient
Con's:
- Feels like two groups of coaches sometimes
- Making sure guys are busy and or helping when it's not their indie time
- little more stress/angst in determining player assignments
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Post by lochness on Mar 21, 2011 18:02:08 GMT -6
18 years, and I've never NOT coached on both (actually all three) sides of the ball.
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Post by Coach Huey on Mar 21, 2011 18:22:42 GMT -6
example 1:
primary position / secondary position
i.e. WR coach... coaches WR when practicing offense. helps the DB coach when practicing defense
OL coach, assisted by the DL coach ... vice versa.
practice half the time on offense & half the time on defense.
scenario 2:
coach 1 side. coach both jv & varsity
JV is on offense - being coached by the offensive coaches while Varsity is on defense, being coached by the defensive coaches.
switch - jv to defense & varsity to offense.
scenario 3:
coach 1 side of the ball
most players play 1 side of ball
have periods within practice where 2-way players switch over to other side (doesn't have to be the same period.)
say, period 5-7 the offense gets who it needs for a specific grouping/package of plays. defense stays doing whatever
then, period 8-10 the defense gets who it needs, etc.
may not switch every package every day.... i.e. only need goalline offense personnel on wednesday. work 5 wide personnel on tuesday. nickel defense is wednesay, etc.
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Post by michwags19 on Mar 21, 2011 18:34:01 GMT -6
I have coached both as a strictly LB coach and on O and D at the same time. I had been coaching both sides for about 8 years before we made the switch. I was slightly apprehensive about the change but once i realized exactly how in depth i could get with the LBs, I was all in. here is how we set it up....
while varsity was on D with those coaches, the JV was on O. about halfway through the practice the kids would switch. Just like the post above, there were some pros and cons.....
Pros - became a specialist, very knowledgeable, dealt with all LBs in 9-12th grade, was able to see who the best in the entire program were, etc....
Cons - felt like a split staff, during games, coaches were not in touch with what was happening when their side of the ball wasn't on the field
We used that type of setup for a few years and have gone back to coaching on both sides of the ball for reasons other than the pros/cons. if you have all 7 coaches for just the varsity team you could REALLY coach 'em up. we used to have time set aside for the varsity offense to run against the best of the rest. as DC i'd take that time to coach up the defense some more while the offensive coaches were running against us. even though we were running the opposition's defense, we could still work and harp on technique. it worked wonders especially for the kids who were just defensive guys. if, like mentioned, you could get in some extra film work or something when the other side of the ball has the kids, i'd think you could be ultra productive.
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Post by wingtol on Mar 21, 2011 18:49:25 GMT -6
18 years, and I've never NOT coached on both (actually all three) sides of the ball. About the same here....coached a biggest class state championship team/national top 5 team where everyone coached both sides...coach in the smallest class now and everyone coaches both sides. You have to be organized and trust your other coaches that's for sure. We have done it both ways where you break down the film as a total staff or you have you DC/OC breaking down film with a few coaches and then they communicate what needs to be done that week. Something to think about is how complex are your scheme's if you are coaching both sides of the ball, for example we are more of an offensive staff where our O is more complex than our D. Not to say our D isn't good but we don't get to crazy with it. Finally I think if you are worth anything as a coach you can feel comfortable coaching several positions so coaching both sides of the ball shouldn't bother a good coach. |
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Post by gapshoot76 on Mar 21, 2011 19:33:27 GMT -6
Fellas I would love to have the staff to do that. We have six paid coaches program wide with a freshman soph and varsity team(about 65-70 kids total every year). We put freshman on their own most days and have the sophs with the varsity. I'm the DC so I have LBs and RBs. Our OC takes his QBs and also coaches our DBs. Our soph head and DC coaches our line both sides and our soph OC does the WR and floats with LBs and DBs depending on the day. We have a volunteer to help with varsity line and a volunteer that helps with the freshman. That's about it. I as the head coach also am the special teams C.
The good thing is there is no coach in our program that is out of touch with any of the 3 phases of the game. Also every coach knows every kid and has a possitive relationship with himThe bad thing is there are only so many eyes that can see and so many mouths that can coach.
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Post by Coach Huey on Mar 21, 2011 19:46:32 GMT -6
We have six paid coaches program wide with a freshman soph and varsity team(about 65-70 kids total every year). We put freshman on their own most days and have the sophs with the varsity. I am now at a "small school" (mid-sized in the classification level). We have 6 football coaches plus the Head Coach. We also run 3 teams - FR, JV, Var. We coach one side of the ball. Freshmen workout before school. They play both offense and defense. When they are on offense, the defensive staff is usually helping out with drills, running scout team, etc. Same thing when they switch to practice defense. Varsity & JV practice together. 1 year, we did the Varsity on offense while JV on defense thing .. then switch. The last 2 years we've been fortunate to have most of our guys play one way.. we do have periods where some guys switch during practice. The point about coaching one side is more about taking a burden off a coach during the season. It is a long season. Game planning, watching film, coaching, correcting, both can get very tiresome by the end of the year. Just like a tired player is less of a player, so is a tired coach. So, we try to eliminate where we can. Game planning is much more efficient because I'm not watching film both offensively & defensively. I can get real good at what I do ... because I'm focusing solely on that. There are definite pro's to coaching one side. And not that there aren't pro's to coaching both sides ... some of the negatives aren't really about coaching both sides: not a cohesive staff - that's more a problem of the men involved, not in the fact that one coach's OL while another does DB's. An A-hole is an A-hole, whether he coaches 2 positions or 1. offense vs defense mentality - again, this is something that can rear itself in any situation. it's a product of kids being selfish. it must be nipped regardless of whether kids play 1-side, or coaches coach 1-side. out of touch with the kids - i don't know about that. i haven't coached defense since the late 90's. i have a great relationship with most of our players. those that i'm not all that close with - it ain't because of what position they play, that's for sure. building a relationship is about the coach. how does he show he cares about all the kids. if having guys coach both sides fits your style, or your program ... go for it. there is plenty of merit in it. I for one, prefer for our guys to focus on a position - get real good at it. pour their undivided energy into that. just my way. one way to look at it - we go to colleges for ideas on how to run certain schemes (look at how they do it), we get various drills and practice ideas from them (look at how they do it), why not evaluate how they divide up their coaching responsibilities (look at how they do it). merit in that too. again, we have 7 total football coaches. |
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Post by TMGPG on Mar 22, 2011 5:32:41 GMT -6
I coach both side of the ball as do all of our coaches on staff. When it comes to the game planning we will split up and half will go to the offense and the other half will go to the defense. Then we will get together and figure out what we need to do during the week to get better. Really does work pretty well.
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Post by cnunley on Mar 22, 2011 5:59:21 GMT -6
This year, we plan on implementing Coach Huey's 2nd scenario. There will be 3 paid offensive staff and 3 paid defensive staff.
While Varsity is on offense JV will be on defense. Special Teams will be divided up amoung offensive and defensive time.
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Post by coachhart on Mar 22, 2011 7:50:53 GMT -6
We coach 1 side of the ball V/JV. HC is the DC/DB, OL is the OC, WR is the JV HC/OC, DL is the JV DC. We do all of our indy together then utilize Huey's second scenario.
As far as relationships with players go, I think I'm just as close with the guys on D as I am with the guys on O. Coaching WR's, I work very closely in practice with the DBs both in our combatives period as well as in the return game so I develop relationships there. I develop relationships with the linemen and LBs in the weight room. A LOT of coaching is the relationships you build so you work on it whether the player is in your position or not.
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Post by mattharris75 on Mar 22, 2011 9:12:06 GMT -6
Here's how it is broken down for us:
5 coaches, 47 players. (Varsity & JV practicing together)
Coach 1: OC & TE's, Spurs (OLB's) - Offensive game planning
Coach 2: RB's, ILB's - Offensive Game planning
Coach 3: OL, Scout team Offense
Coach 4: WR's, DC & DL - Defensive game planning
Coach 5: QB's, DB's - Defensive game planning
We're a relatively small school, and it's not uncommon for coaches to coach both sides of the ball, just like most players are learning positions on both sides of the ball.
Personally, I love being involved in both offense and defense. But, certainly I see the benefits of being able to coach just one position. At many schools that's just not realistic, and for most it seems to work out just fine.
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