Holding Clinics for Youth and MS Programs

Coach, I, for one, don't think the MS or junior high program needs to run the same offensive and defensive packages as the high school. I think if the fundamentals of blocking and tackling are the highest of priorities then the kids will be fine at the next level. Of course, I understand that the learning curve could be shorter if the feeder program used the same system as the high school. However, I am sure that the feeder program could use a simplified version of the high school's offense and defense and still be successful. I am the junior high coach in my county, and the high school head coach gives me free reign to do as I see fit. He runs wing-t, I run the I; they are a 4-3 team, I have a 4-4 team. Even though those systems are different, I still use the same terminology as he does for offensive formations, cadence, defensive front calls, defensive techniques, and all our special teams are the same. We warm up exactly like the high school does, and their are many things I do that the high school head coach will not have to go through just because I did it. Sorry to hi-jack this thread

One of our local HS put on a clinic for your youth program. Our youth program is not a feeder program because our kids end up going to 1 of 2 near by high schools, so we run our own stuff on O and D. With that being said the HC coach of the High school spoke on how they run thing at practices and what makes them succesful, ect. Then his different asst(position) coaches spoke on different drill and techniques that we could use/teach at each position. One of our youth coaches ended using there zone blocking scheme. I would say the clinc was very good for us youth coaches. I hope they put on another clinc this off season.

this is a chicken and egg argument.

which came first, synchronizing the youth - hs systems breeding championships....or winning championships leading to synchronization?

I think its a great idea if you can do it, but dont force it. Hard enough to get good help as it is. If the youngsters are learning a passion for the game, having fun, being taught how to be a good team member and tough football player who is willing to pay the price for success who cares if they call the off tackle play "power" or "smash" or whatever...

It shouldnt be too much to ask that a coach at the lower level number his backs the same and use the same hole numbering and motion terms and even formation names. It shouldnt be too much to ask that they teach some of the basic oline schemes such as power, sweep, counter, trap and iso...

for me, if and when I land a HC gig Im going to ask the youth coaches to run 5 double wing plays. sweep, power, counter, trap and wedge. thats it.

The clinc that was very well attended. It was most coaches from our youth program and then some coaches from very near by youth program and a few other coaches mixed in also from our area. Like you Phantom our middle school(s) don't have football either. Everything is youth until they get to HS.

Well then, id be willing to bet that which ever hs staff pours the most support into the youth program gets what they want. I played at a jr high that fed rival schools...guess what, we ran our own system...but years later after a state title was one by the other school (one of four) the jr high bought in and ran the state champs stuff (sort of)

so , they got their feeder program by EARNING IT not by demanding it.

I coach MS and we run the varsity's offense. Fewer plays and formations? Yes. When I attend our varsity games, I spend a lot of time with my 7th graders. I quiz them on what formation they see or what play they just ran on the field. They recognize the ones we run, and you can (sometimes) see a little light bulb come on.

Related to lochness' post, I was wondering how many perennial playoff teams have feeder programs that run their stuff, and how many don't. My suspicion is that programs with repeated trips to the playoffs do have feeders that run their stuff.

Totally agree coach! ;D

This is a great idea, I'm ashamed that I didn't think of it myself.

Thanks everyone for your ideas. I personally believe that the more linked up the Youth Programs are to the HS program the better the program and community will be.

You can win if your youth programs don't run your varsity stuff, but I think in the long run it can only help.

In terms of building a "PROGRAM" I think that it is critical that the MS and Youth leagues run a simplified version of what the HS runs. The MS is probably the easiest to get on board since they are affiliated with your district; youth leagues are bit trickier, so if you get them on board that's great. But MS should run your system, albeit significantly scaled down.

The problem, as noted above, is that a lot of the MS coaches want to run their own show. This is always a problem; as the HC of a program when you take the job you should try to get put into your deal a provision that gives you full control over your district's football programs. Although its nice if the kids win, the most important thing is for them to learn the fundamentals of your system. MS guys that are not completely on board all think that they the next Bear Bryant; they need to understand that their role is primarily teaching, that they are laying the foundation for the varsity. Ideally, when a kid metriculates up to the varsity, the varsity coaches should not have to teach him the program's terminology, language, etc.

The big problem with MS guys is that if you run a spread offense and they are not successful right away with it they will try to alter it or switch to something that they know will work at that level much more easily. Those are guys you don't want on your staff. Regardless of what the score is, they need to work the system and convince the kids and their parents that in the end this will all payoff.

One thing I would like to add coming from a middle school coach. Not only does it help the kids coming up to you it also helps the middle school coaches. I know around here most of the middle school coaches are new to coaching and would like to move up to the high school one day. I know in my case I will be at the high school in a couple years and we run a scaled down version of there stuff so in a couple years when I get there I will no a little bit of there stuff which will make it easier on me and them.

As a youth coach, if the local H.S. coach came over to my practice field and ask if I'd run his system, I'd give him a polite- but, firm- "No."
I live in a fair-sized city. There are too many variables in the timeframe between when my players leave me to when they reach HS to make it a viable way to teach my players football. The HS may switch systems. The coaching staff may leave. My players may move away, etc... Hell, as is the case of the HS team closest to where I coach, maybe their HS team just sucks. And, in Texas, that makes it even more likely that that current staff won't be there by the time my players reach HS. Why would I want to teach my players the way that they teach theirs?
I think it's way more important for a youth coach to teach youth players good fundamental skills and good attitude towards the game and coaches. I stress to the players about having the right attitude to succeed in life. I stress that they have passing grades before they even think about hitting my practice field. If they have passing grades, I challenge them to get their grades higher. Low ‘C’s & ‘D’s are just one excuse away from an ‘F’. I talk with their parents as much as possible to try to change the boys’ attitudes about commitment, team play, etc…
Relatively few kids in any given H.S. actually play HS football. If one of my players do go on to play HS ball, should the HC be upset with me because I didn’t teach his system? Or, should he be satisfied that I helped hand him a player that knows to keep his grades up to maintain eligibility, who knows to give max effort, to not argue with coaches and undermine the program, to not be selfish and whine about not being starting QB but is proud that he earned starting TE?
I do understand that it is easier to deal with kids that already have a foundation in what you are teaching. But, teaching kids that have no background in your program shouldn’t stop a HS coach from having success. Put another way, what would a HS coach do if you got a transfer from another school and that player was a honor roll, stud Power-I TB with a great attitude? Would you say, “Sorry, son. We run the Spread here. We have no place for you.”
Are HS coaches seriously telling us that a 46 Bear, man press, shut down CB can’t be taught to be useful to his 4-3 Cover 3 Zone defense?
Too many HS coaches think they inherit the local youth programs by rights. And, too many don’t know the first thing about running a youth program. It’s not the HS’s system. It’s not the HS head coach’s program. It’s the youth coaches own time that they’re volunteering. It’s the youth coaches system and program. Handing a youth coach your favorite 10 plays and a PowerPoint Slide on how you line up on defense is not contributing to that youth coach’s success. How is he to break down your terminology so that his 10yr olds can run those plays? How does he get his team to execute your play that you ‘hang your hat on’? How does he adjust when it doesn’t work for him? Did you take into account many youth leagues’ MPP rules? Did you check into whether league rules allow him to blitz, allow him to line up a NG over their Center before you handed him your 5-3 defense alignment?
There are much more important things for a HS coach to stress to a youth program. Coach Calande is already pointing the way for you. Teach the youth coach how to pick a staff, how to deal with a staff and parents, how to organize a practice(HUGE PRIORITY!), invite him to get a close-up look at what you do. Give them drills to run, etc… Most of all, invest your time and resources to youth programs, run your own successful HS program and earn the privilege of having a youth program feed into yours.
Okay, I’m off my soapbox.

But back to the question of putting on clinics I say definitely!! Put on fundamental clinics as opposed to scheme clinics.. When you have good dedicated youth coaches who study the game and put the interest of the kids first forcing a particular scheme down their throats through clinics will lead to poor turn out.. If you hold clinics on tackling, passing, catching, blocking, practice planning I tghink you'll have much better turn out..

Noones saying you "shouldn't" want it- I just don't personally think it's a deal breaker.. Here, our youth organization has 5 levels of play, each level having a minimum of 8 coaches- most have more.. If they're doing a good job why risk having them leave over something like this? At that point I would imagine the youth program would then fall on your shoulders- that's a lot more work that just fell on your plate..Maybe it's worth it, I don't know..

Our youth program is huge- you say yours is small.. In a smaller program it may absolutely be the way to go- I have no experience with that, but in a larger program I think the HS HC has to give a little, and the youth HC's also have to give a little.. In a perfect world - yeah right-LOL.. Don't forget that the youth guys don't get paid..

I'm not sure what you mean by if he's good enough to run his own system you should get him on your staff.. I will tell you that every single HC in our areas youth program is good enough to run their own system- maybe not at the HS level, but definitely at their level.. they wouldn't be a HC if they couldn't.. I don't know, maybe we're lucky, but our area has excellent youth football.. Most of the 8th grade games are very similar to freshmen level games in terms of quality of play and coaching- some are better.. Like I said, alot of those guys have no interest in coaching HS.. They have their careers set, and they love the game and the youth league allows them to be a part of it in a very competitive manner, yet still feed their families.. Practices are at night, games are on the weekends..

Hey, I understand what you're saying, and I see the logic behind it.. I certainly don't have the answers.. All I can say is that I see both sides of it- and I have respect for both the HS coaches opinion, and the youth HC's opinion.. Just kind of playing devils advocate here that's all.. This is one of those debates that will go on forever and no-one will ever be right or wrong..

I agree. Skills, skills, skills.

All I've meant to say is that we are able to run the same system and terminology throughout our youth program and I appreciate that we can do this.

I know one major difference between districts of different sizes is availability of coaches.

If your town population is 2100 and you field football for 8 football teams (4th-HS) then your pool of potential coaches is smaller. This is why I feel that if there is a really, really good coach at the youth level then I would try to get him on our HS staff. We all want great coaches at the youth level, but that doesn't do us much good if our varsity staff is watered down because of it.