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Post by brophy on Jul 27, 2005 14:00:23 GMT -6
Hey, guys....I got a quick question for ya.
I've been an assistant defensive coach / co coordinator for the past five years, last year my close friend who's been running the defense with me needed to switch sides and run the offense this year. He's a former GA and knows his stuff. Well, the thing is, THIS year we've got a new DC and he and his 'buddy' (who is a position coach on defense) are coming in to 'run things'. Now I get along with everyone, but it is clear that these guys are not watching tape of our opponents / scouting / effectively evaluting our defense....
I am very concerned that we will spoil the talent on our roster by being ill prepared and unprofessional. As a position coach, is it an afront to the DC if I lobby for most of the calls to be made / implementation schedule ?
The two guys that are 'coming up' to fill the vacancies are lifelong JV / Soph coaches, who apparently think that they can run one defense and one coverage on the Varsity all year long, regadless of the opponent. This summer in passing leagues, I was the one voicing concerns of WHAT we are running and WHY we are running it...yada yada....
I don't want the DC job, I'm not a teacher, but is there any resolution I can seek?
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Post by tog on Jul 27, 2005 14:05:40 GMT -6
if you were a co/coordinator and the other "co" went over to offense, then you should have just been named THE DC
if the hc brought in two old slappy buddies, just because they were buddies with no regard to your knowledge, hard work, loyalty to you for working for him for 5 years
then
he is an HC that I would not want to work for
period
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Post by brophy on Jul 27, 2005 14:14:12 GMT -6
I dunno...I don't know if that's the issue, but I'm jus' sayin'....the two that are coming up were new sophomore coaches last year....Did not man a spectacular defense, and only ran Cover 3 the entire year (even vs. double tight)...but they are both TEACHERS at the school (which I think shoudl mean something)....
We met the other night and as I go over scenarios and such (implementation) I'm greeted with blank faces, like;
1) they really don't know the playbook
2) they don't know WHAT we're preparing for....
It's just kinda spooky (having four coaches with you who couldn't even line up the entire 11 players correctly....)
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Post by brophy on Jul 27, 2005 14:18:09 GMT -6
lastly.... The DC, during implementation, wanted to install our ENTIRE defense in the first 4 days of camp. that would be our C3, C6 (strong side rotation), C1, C2, C4, C0 blitz package, and goal line.....  I said, WHY!?? Do you really think the kids will understand ANY of it? |
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Post by tog on Jul 27, 2005 14:19:12 GMT -6
if you must stay
teach them, or just show them on the board how it won't work
if they still don't get it, and it is that unsound and bad
then the hc should see what is going on, come in there and ask "why the hell are we running something unsound?"
if the hc doesn't get it, then what the heck is he an HC for?
If he does get it and allow two dumbasses to ruin his program, what the hell is he an HC for?
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Post by shortyardage on Aug 7, 2005 15:07:01 GMT -6
You're in a tough situation, no doubt about it. My advice to you is this:
1. Don't alienate yourself from the rest of the staff, inexperienced coacheds are very fearful that they will be exposed..and they always are exposed. Just don't put yourself in a light where you will be seen as "not being on board".
2. At no time make any public or private statements about the quality of the coaching staff, always be seen as a united front. The only place to speak up is in private staff meetings and what is said in private stays in private. If the decision doesn't go your awy then you have to live with it.
3. Make the best of a bad situation, if you're going to stay for this season. Coach your position as best as you can and take pride in making them the best players on the field.
4. YOU be prepared,even if the new guys(fans with whistles) aren't.
5. The players will spot the phoneys, they always do. They will know best who can coach and who can't. The players will talk to their parents...YOU DO NOT TALK TO THE PARENTS.
6. Once the parents see what's going on, they'll talk to the AD or principal or superintendent. Let those people talk to the parents. If it's good then it's for the good, if it's bad then it's for the good.
7. Have you talked to the head coach ? What does he say ? It's HIS program and it's HIS butt on the line.
8. Soften your landing. This is only one more season and there will be many more to come. Will these guys even be there after this season ? Will you ? Will the head football coach ? Who knows. Will you be coaching after this season ? Look at your long term goals and decide how best to handle the current situation. Tough times don't last, tough people do.
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FF/Coach
Sophomore Member
If your heart is in it, you can do it!!!
Posts: 134
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Post by FF/Coach on Aug 7, 2005 16:31:31 GMT -6
I am is TOTAL agreement with short-yardage!
Remember, #1 it's all about the kids. Teach them everything you can, they will find the phonies 1st day.
As far as the teacher part of it (hope I don't step on any toes, BUT) some of the best coaches out there are not teachers. To often teachers are only coaching for the extra pay check, and are not truly concerned with the lessons taught on the football field! Don't sell yourself short because your not a "teacher", if you are coaching football you are a TEACHER, and one the payers will remember and respect long after they forgotten, what the guy's name was that taught English!
Just me getting on my soap box.
Back to the point, why don't you want the DC position? If you've been doing it for 5 yrs sound to me like you are better suited for the position than the 2 JV guys, and probably would have been better for the kids. They never like new faces, especially if they can tell 1st day that they know more about the system than the new coach does.
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Post by Split50 on Aug 7, 2005 18:00:31 GMT -6
If you were in Texas, you wouldn't have much of a choice. You will teach if you intend to coach. At least in the public schools. Unlike many other states, the best football in Texas is still played in the public schools.
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FF/Coach
Sophomore Member
If your heart is in it, you can do it!!!
Posts: 134
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Post by FF/Coach on Aug 7, 2005 22:09:05 GMT -6
We are also a public school, and the best football in our state also comes out of the public school.
I thank almighty above that Kansas has the Rule 10 option. If it wasn't for that I would not be coaching high school because I choose a different path for a career. However Rule 10 allows me to do both.
As for the money I agree that if you do your job the way it should be done you make only pennies an hour. However the coaches I am referring to (and I am limited to the coaches in our general area) do not put in the kind of time we are talking about. They simply go through the motions during practice, do not spend time trying to make themselves better, and we get kids coming up to our level that are so far behind they cannot contribute. It's possible that they are being pressured by the ADs and Admin, but I know of several positions here that are being held just because they want that extra cash, and the kids are the ones who ultimately pay.
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Post by Split50 on Aug 8, 2005 4:54:54 GMT -6
Coach,
Using Texas as a reference, since that is the only state I have ever coached in, most of our coaches are coaches first and teach because that is what they have to do in order to have a job coaching. I am not saying we are bad teachers, just saying that coaching is our first priority. We do have some coaches who are in only for the extra money, but not very many, and they usually don't last long.
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Post by brophy on Aug 10, 2005 7:23:03 GMT -6
GOOD GRIEF!!~  Last night, our second practice....ugh....I come to find out the "guy" that I've had the most issues with is teaching a completely bast'dized defense on the JV level! This guy is all 'old-school' secondary guy (I am confident he could NOT properly align the front 8 in any of our fronts) and insists that he's going to run a 5-3 on defense (we run a 42 Nickel). I had a talk with him two weeks prior, when he said he wanted to run a 5-3. I said, "sure...fine...THIS IS HOW you would do that out of our 40 defense (front adjustments, yada yada)". Apparently it went out one ear and straight in the crapper. THIS is what one of his assistants drew up (new to the staff) that they were running (he was a little confused too). ------------------O--O--O--X--O--O--------------------------- ---C-----------S----R--T-----N-------E------------------------- -------------------------M-----W--------------------------------- --------------- $-----------------------------------------C--------- --------------------------F----------------------------------------  what?!? I said...."What coverage are you running? " ---- "uh...we're running Cover 3 and he's got them in robber sometimes"Who has the weak flat? ..... "he wants the Will to cover the flats and the weak corner would be over the top..."  Well, needless to say, WE WILL BE MEETING tonight to make this ship sails straight..... |
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Post by tog on Aug 10, 2005 9:47:18 GMT -6
so he wants to stop them running strong eh?
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Post by brophy on Aug 10, 2005 10:08:06 GMT -6
er....how could you tell (lol).....I'm sure the weak option or iso isn't a concern.....YIKES
this is gonna be one helluva year!
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Post by tog on Aug 10, 2005 10:12:06 GMT -6
so he wants to stop them running strong eh?  |
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Post by Split50 on Aug 11, 2005 5:19:30 GMT -6
Coach,
Read your own Bill Bellicheck quote. You don't want to hear this, but GET OUT!!
Regardless of why, what, or how, someone else is the boss. Do what he asks.
You came on here, I assume, expecting to get support for how bad you are being treated and how terrible these new coaches are. Bull. You keep saying how you would do it, how it should be done, etc. You may be right, but if they aren't asking you stop saying it and do it the way they want it done. If they aren't asking, it is time to stop voluntaring your opinion and become a team player.
I know a lot of people on here, especially you, aren't going to agree with me, but that is the way I feel. Right now, in my opinion, you are the problem. You are ridiculing and finding fault with every thing they are doing. It is a simple solution, GET OUT!!
NOthing personal, sir, but you asked.
What's that saying, "If you don't want to hear the answer, don't ask the question."
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Post by brophy on Aug 11, 2005 5:47:50 GMT -6
Split50,
I appreciate the candor, and you know what, you're probably right.
After our meeting last night, the defense for running 'that' defense was "There probably is a way to run a 5-3 out of the 40 defense, but to be honest, I haven't looked at the playbook....". That, coming from our returning Head Soph Coach.
I guess I don't really care what they teach or run, but if the Varsity guy doesn't know WHAT to teach (keeps asking me) and the Soph guys are teaching something fundamentally flawed, I felt I was looking out for the PROGRAM and not 'my' self-interests. If not me, then who? I should take a blind-eye to something that is detrimental to our program?
No, I don't have the "solution". What IS the solution to coaches not knowing the playbook?
Since we all have an investment in the kid's development, the long-term benefit of the athletes and program is what is at stake. Arguing 'personal philosophies' or X's & O's is nominal.
I'm not expressing these concerns to come out a "hero", it just struck me as odd, didn't know how to deal with it. But, you're right, sir....truly you are. Next year, I AM out of there. I hear ya.
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Post by tog on Aug 11, 2005 6:39:49 GMT -6
if you were a co/coordinator and the other "co" went over to offense, then you should have just been named THE DC if the hc brought in two old slappy buddies, just because they were buddies with no regard to your knowledge, hard work, loyalty to you for working for him for 5 years then he is an HC that I would not want to work for period it goes back to this for me |
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Post by brophy on Aug 11, 2005 8:42:22 GMT -6
all you guys are right...thanks for the feedback, coaches
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Post by PowerDown on Aug 11, 2005 12:03:12 GMT -6
Brophy,
I have a quote for you. My father sent me a quote from the newspaper when I was in college when I was disagreeing with some of the coaches philosophies. It was from Bob Knight- " You can learn things from every coach even if its what not to do."
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Post by brophy on Aug 11, 2005 12:24:03 GMT -6
yeah...good quote, I'll remember that.
I planned on moving since last April and let the staff know that I wouldn't be around next year. I have been friends with my current HC for the past 10 years, but we're both in our early 30s. Maybe that clouded my perception of things from the start or something.
I wanted to put it up for discussion, because I wonder if any other programs have "issues" like this or not. I've been with the staff since we took over the program and of the original staff only myself and the "other guy" (long time DC) remain on staff. We have a high-turnover rate and we can't seem to find people that want to coach, let alone high-quality people. I'm sure that lends itself for discord.
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Post by shortyardage on Aug 11, 2005 13:19:26 GMT -6
Not to be negative, but form a management stand point high turn over in any organization is a major red flag. People vote with their feet, if they don't like something for some reason they will find a way out of the organization.
I say this only because of your comments about "clouded perception". I've been a head coach a couple of times and an AD a couple of times, so I've seen it from both ends.
I left my last program in great shape, the varsity and the JV's played for the league championship for each ot the last two years that I was there and the varsity played for the division championship my last year there. The cupboard was not bare of talent and commitment and there were more than enough quality and experienced coaches in the pipeline to keep it going. The parents were all on board and the boosters were raising a lot of money. Sadly, the school hired a very inexperienced coach who was not yet a very good teacher. Many of the quality coaches left the program because of a lack of leadership.
Needless to say, after the change the team failed to make the play-offs for the first time in over 15 years. Also, the AD and principal both lost their positions, not entirely because of football, but football contributed to it.
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