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Post by mental311 on Nov 10, 2010 10:50:23 GMT -6
So I am trying to figure out what this means and entails.
I am also trying to see if that is within my capabilities.
What are you thoughts on the subject?
Are you a "leader of men"?
BIG QUESTION: What traits are necessary to be a leader of men that are different than basic leadership skills.
Thanks fellas! Good luck in the playoffs!
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Post by blb on Nov 10, 2010 11:01:28 GMT -6
Has a vision for where group-organization needs to go
Has a plan on how to get there
Can communicate the whys and hows of the vision to all concerned
Is a good listener, has best interests of group and its members at heart
Can Adjust and Improvise ("mid-course corrections"), deal effectively with adversity
Is Positive but Demanding - provides constructive feedback
Takes responsibility for the individuals and group
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Post by mental311 on Nov 10, 2010 11:04:07 GMT -6
I agree, But how is that different from any other leadership?
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Post by rcole on Nov 10, 2010 11:05:43 GMT -6
Leadership is influence. The measure of leadership is follower-ship. A man with a title who has no influence will have no one following him. If you are a leader by title and no one follows you, you are just out for a walk. Do people follow in your footsteps, do they look to you for guidance and advice, do they look to you in adversity, do they do things because you want them to and not because they have to? When you change directions, or change jobs, do people want to follow you? Do the people you mentored/coached come back over time for more contact and therefore leadership? Do your former players want to become like YOU? Leadership IS NOT being in charge, it is not being the biggest ego. Leadership is servant-hood (check out my signature). This is vague I know. Be what you wish others to be, and be that consistently. Help them in any way possible to become that too. More theoretical crap, but hey, it works and its true.
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Post by blb on Nov 10, 2010 11:12:30 GMT -6
Leadership is influence. The measure of leadership is follower-ship. A man with a title who has no influence will have no one following him. If you are a leader by title and no one follows you, you are just out for a walk. Do people follow in your footsteps, do they look to you for guidance and advice, do they look to you in adversity, do they do things because you want them to and not because they have to? When you change directions, or change jobs, do people want to follow you? Do the people you mentored/coached come back over time for more contact and therefore leadership? Do your former players want to become like YOU? Leadership IS NOT being in charge, it is not being the biggest ego. Leadership is servant-hood (check out my signature). This is vague I know. Be what you wish others to be, and be that consistently. Help them in any way possible to become that too. More theoretical crap, but hey, it works and its true. Good stuff, rcole. Lou Holtz has said, "You can get anything you want in this world IF you help enough other people get what they want first." 311, guess I don't understand what you're getting at-looking for. What makes you think "being a leader of men" differs from "basic leadership skills"? |
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Post by Coach Huey on Nov 10, 2010 11:30:35 GMT -6
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Post by ajreaper on Nov 10, 2010 11:35:59 GMT -6
Leadership, regardless of where it is exercised changes little. I know I have often come away from a clinic session where a well known college coach has spoken and thought to myself "that guy could lead an army or a fortune 500 company he just chooses to be a football coach". My guess is most of you have thought the same a time or two. It's many things and the ingriediants differ from leader to leader- Patten and Omar Bradley were both great leaders but had a much different approach to it. I think the simple test is this- if you have followers you are leading if not, as stated above already, you are just out for a walk.
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Post by dubber on Nov 10, 2010 11:40:47 GMT -6
What is different between a "leader of men" and just a "leader"
Guys are giving you some solid stuff on overall leadership.
However, if you have a definitive difference between a Leader and a Leader of Men, then we need to hear it.
Is it possible this is merely rhetoric?
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Post by mental311 on Nov 10, 2010 11:45:05 GMT -6
blb - My question also - Is there a difference or is it just an overused term that means just being a leader...
From what the few have said, sounds the same to me....
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Post by cc on Nov 10, 2010 12:04:56 GMT -6
But aren't most of us leader of Boys / young men?
That is a different world in several regards....
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Post by blb on Nov 10, 2010 12:23:57 GMT -6
But aren't most of us leader of Boys / young men? That is a different world in several regards.... As opposed to those who are "Leaders of Women"? What if it's a woman who is in charge of a group of men? |
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Post by brophy on Nov 10, 2010 12:24:59 GMT -6
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Post by blb on Nov 10, 2010 12:29:31 GMT -6
brophy, didn't you ever see "Wildcats"?
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Post by brophy on Nov 10, 2010 12:31:36 GMT -6
obviously, you're not a golfer
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Post by blb on Nov 10, 2010 12:35:38 GMT -6
obviously, you're not a golfer That's true. But I have seen "Caddyshack" many times. As Twain said, "Golf is a good walk spoiled...usually by poor mathematics." |
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Post by mariner42 on Nov 10, 2010 15:29:32 GMT -6
[Wildcats] is not the issue here, Dude...
To contribute, I would say they're one and the same. Leader of men has a feel of a something from a religious perspective (like a paraphrasing of the "fishers of men" from Mark in the NT), but really, being a leader is both secular and sacred, imo.
This being said, I'm not gonna be able to say much more that improves on Rcole's response. Dude friggin' nailed it, imo. Very similar to Darin Slack's message for QBs, albeit minus the fervor/delivery of Coach Slack.
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Post by blb on Nov 10, 2010 15:45:22 GMT -6
[ Wildcats] is not the issue here, Dude... "Dude" - get your Sense of Humor up and running. |
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Post by brophy on Nov 10, 2010 16:33:55 GMT -6
[ Wildcats] is not the issue here, Dude... "Dude" - get your Sense of Humor up and running. leadership isn't a title, its a duty born out of service. "Making a Man" has little to do with 'instruction/compliance', but nuturing independence.....roles that ultimately should be gender-neutral. The 'masculine' connotation (imo) gets added when you want to sugar-coat compliance ("do this because I said / because its 'tough'). Delayed-gratification, which is what "sucking it up" (i.e. masculine idea) is about, doesn't have to be sold that cheaply. Frame it in a mature context (i.e. self-efficacy), and "leadership" becomes me spearheading peak performance for US ALL (I am doing my best / I want to enable you to do your best) |
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Post by jpdaley25 on Nov 10, 2010 20:23:13 GMT -6
The connotation of that title to me is that a real honest to gawd man won't follow a weak leader, so if you are a "leader of men," you are a strong leader that wins over the hearts and minds of other strong men who wouldn't follow just anybody.
Great posts on leadership!
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Post by dsqa on Nov 12, 2010 20:03:17 GMT -6
Leaders make other men feel important
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Post by jgordon1 on Nov 13, 2010 14:25:15 GMT -6
Leadership is influence. The measure of leadership is follower-ship. A man with a title who has no influence will have no one following him. If you are a leader by title and no one follows you, you are just out for a walk. Do people follow in your footsteps, do they look to you for guidance and advice, do they look to you in adversity, do they do things because you want them to and not because they have to? When you change directions, or change jobs, do people want to follow you? Do the people you mentored/coached come back over time for more contact and therefore leadership? Do your former players want to become like YOU? Leadership IS NOT being in charge, it is not being the biggest ego. Leadership is servant-hood (check out my signature). This is vague I know. Be what you wish others to be, and be that consistently. Help them in any way possible to become that too. More theoretical crap, but hey, it works and its true. John Maxwell talks alot about this stuff in his books..very good |
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