|
|
Post by buck42 on Mar 12, 2010 17:59:57 GMT -6
Ok guys,
Here is the deal...I took over a program last year in mid-June. I hired an OC and a DC really on short notice with not much to chose from. The DC left before the season began because he got another job so I took over as the DC as well...
Then after 3 scrimmages and 2 games and we had less than 120 yards in total offense I was discussing changes I wanted to see in the offense. The OC I hired had a passing background but I felt confident that we would stay true to what I wanted to do, run the ball. Well that did not happen so I tried to get a hold on it early in the season and the OC quit.
During the summer the OC invited a guy out to practice to help coach WRs, a guy that plays for him on a semi-pro team. This coach is also the step dad of a current sophomore.
I say all of that to give you a background to help me....
This coach stayed on board after the OC left, but he RARELY made practice and would show up for games right before kickoff. (I forgot to say I am the ONLY coach that works at the school so my coaches are ALL from the community, I hate this in itself but that is an admin situation that I am working on)
This coach is constantly in disagreement with me about everything from offseason workout programs to scrimmages to formation names. I created an Offensive Playbook PowerPoint Presentation at the request of my staff in our post season meeting. I sent a text out to ask if my offensive coaches had a chance to look over it....he responds in disagreement with me about a formation name. I respond with the reasoning that I have for calling the formation what I do. His response is " U ask for help but u never listen. But u r wrong."
Also, he has told his son not to do his leg workouts because he runs the mile in track and his track workout is a better leg workout than the weight room.
I forgot to add during a game probably week 9 or so he tries to sub in a WR. I pull the WR off the field and tell him he is not making subsitutions. (He has never had that ability) After the game we get in the coaches office and he gets heated about it. I told him "Coach, during practice I get pretty accustom to making the subsitutions because you are not there, so I do them in the game too."
My gut feeling before our coaches meeting about 10 days ago was to let him go, but I figured I would see if he showed up to the meeting first and then see how he responded.
I have really no problems with my staff, they all seem on board. I hired a new DC and he is gonna to real well and he has been well recieved by the current staff especially the defensive staff.
Just need some opinions...am I way off base to tell this guy to just be a parent?
|
|
|
|
Post by coachbw on Mar 12, 2010 18:49:41 GMT -6
Let me see if I have this straight . . . you have lost both coordinators, one during the season, and have a coach who questions not only your philosophies, but your willingness to work with the staff, but you don't have a problem with your staff?
I may be reading this wrong, but it definitely sounds to me like there are issues here. I can tell you from experience that it is almost impossible to build a program if you don't have the coaching staff on board. It is almost impossible to get the coaching staff on board if they don't feel like what they do matters. I would say call the coach out on his questioning of things. You two need to get to a point where he feels his input is valued even if not followed all the time. If he is willing to work within your philosophies you can give him another shot, but if he is tearing things apart he has to go. Many times, assistant coaches will cause just as much trouble as you let them. If you call him on it, and it continues he needs to go.
|
|
|
|
Post by phantom on Mar 12, 2010 18:58:46 GMT -6
This coach stayed on board after the OC left, but he RARELY made practice and would show up for games right before kickoff. So, what exactly is his function? |
|
|
|
Post by buck42 on Mar 12, 2010 19:00:08 GMT -6
I lost my OC because he wanted to do what he wanted to do and we totaled 120 yards in 3 scrimmages and 2 games. He was unwilling to by into my program so he left (he has since called or text multiple times and asked to return...even called me about a particular play for his other team)
With the exception of the OC, I lost no coaches and have gained 3 in the offseason...
The only issue I have now is my WR coach he does not agree with much we do...he wants to throw the ball around the yard and we are not going to do that as long as I am the coach...my philosophy. He plays for the OC that quit in another league and that is they way that he made it on my staff. I did not feel that he needed to go for my OC quitting...
I have taken MANY suggestions this past year from personel to plays to meeting times etc, but he is never there to be part of it...he made exactly ONE weekend coaches meeting...
|
|
|
|
Post by buck42 on Mar 12, 2010 19:03:27 GMT -6
This coach stayed on board after the OC left, but he RARELY made practice and would show up for games right before kickoff. So, what exactly is his function? His function is the WR coach... My staff now has 10 coaches and they all work in other avenues and can not get to practice until 415, we get out of school at 215. It is an issue I discussed with my principal yesterday but with the budget the way it is, probably not going to get better this year... Suggestions? |
|
|
|
Post by cqmiller on Mar 12, 2010 19:08:12 GMT -6
I know that a few years back my buddy took over a program that had NEVER had a winning record and NEVER won more than 2 games in a season. He never would have taken the job if he did not know that I was there as the coordinator on Defense. If you do not have both coordinators (one is usually HC in HS) on the same page, then you have no chance of getting the kids to buy in.
I would suggest finding guys with less football knowledge, but are willing to learn and buy into what you are trying to do. I'd rather teach guys who are willing than fight guys who aren't. I don't care how much they think they know. If you are a "run-the-ball-and-play-solid-defense" kind of guy, you don't go hire June Jones or Mike Leach to call your offense. To much fighting within the staff.
Sounds to me that he wants the title and the respect, but wants to put in none of the work. Hope the kid isn't that way, or you may have a headache no matter what happens.
|
|
|
|
Post by buck42 on Mar 12, 2010 19:18:17 GMT -6
Oh yeah, I made a mistake with the OC hire...the old OC and the WR coach are two different people...
You are right though...they both wanted the title but didnt wanna do much work...the old OC was more interested in running new plays than technique...
I made a mistake, he convinced me that he would do what I asked and we have a mutual friend that is a well respected HC and thought we could make it work...
I am going to continue to call the O and you are right I need to get the DC on board and that is why I hired the new DC...old school mentality and he is bugging me to meet and to discuss things...he wants old films to study...so far so good on D....
My question is do I follow my gut feeling? or do I see what he does and how he reacts a little longer?
|
|
|
|
Post by unc31 on Mar 12, 2010 19:32:05 GMT -6
Buck42, you know who I am but probably not by this board's name. We are both in NC and I know where you are and the area to a degree. Here is the best advice I can give you.....SEND THIS GUY PACKING IMMEDIATELY. Do not second guess, do not look back, do not reconsider. Be very up front and tell him that he is too disagreeable and confrontational for you. If his kid is a miler, he is probably not an explosive athlete anyway, so don't worry about losing him.
You are the head coach and it is your responsibility to run it as you see fit and to give the kids the best chance for success. You have given him ample opportunity to get on baord and he has not. This guy sounds like a wannabe coach to me.
|
|
|
|
Post by coachvan on Mar 12, 2010 19:43:34 GMT -6
Buck42, I think you're past the point of a "gut feeling". Time to cut ties. I believe successful programs have a clearcut leader, and assistants who buy into the leaders vision and philosophy.
|
|
|
|
Post by phantom on Mar 12, 2010 19:58:55 GMT -6
So, what exactly is his function? His function is the WR coach... My staff now has 10 coaches and they all work in other avenues and can not get to practice until 415, we get out of school at 215. It is an issue I discussed with my principal yesterday but with the budget the way it is, probably not going to get better this year... Suggestions? So when do you start practice? If you start before 4:15 what do you do? Oh, get rid of that WR coach. He isn't coaching anything and he's just causing problems. |
|
|
|
Post by buck42 on Mar 12, 2010 20:00:34 GMT -6
UNC31, I think I have figured out who you are...I knew you were from NC but looked at some of your old posts. I dont wanna guess on here bc I do not want to give you away if you are trying to stay make sure some D-ont K-now J-ack....lol... I agree I think he is a wanna be coach and his stepson has some ability but he is a step slow and hands are terrible...
CoachVan, I agree about the clear cut leader...there is no doubt about this in our program...I am just concerned that he could start to divide the staff....I mess enough things up myself I donot want anyone to add to those issues...lol
|
|
|
|
Post by buck42 on Mar 12, 2010 20:06:49 GMT -6
Phantom, I take a 5 hour energy and get to work....Monday and Wednesday we lift and watch flim, JV and Varsity until 3.30ish...get dressed, Flex and hope assistants are there...Tuesday we have study hall/tutoring until 3.30, they get dressed and flex...Thursday we have study hall/tutoring, I get JV kids to the classroom off the weight room to eat at 3pm. The Varstiy kids are either in study hall in my room (I hope they are working) or in tutoring until 3.30 when they come down to get dressed. I have JV players in weight room sleeping /relaxing while Varsity is in classroom right beside the weight room unitl another coach arrives.
|
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on Mar 13, 2010 15:25:15 GMT -6
10 coaches...and you are worried about ONE? No brainer. Bye Bye birdie
|
|
|
|
Post by mariner42 on Mar 13, 2010 16:16:36 GMT -6
Another one of those cases where I can see that I'm not ready to be a HC... I just don't have the patience/tolerance/tact to deal with that kind of stuff from an assistant, even as 'just' a DC. I think I tend explain myself and take suggestions pretty well, but I would hate to have someone tell me "Ur wrong" (Personal dislike going back to the whole 'will kids be able to spell' thread) about something as stupid as a G-D semantic formation name. I don't have hiring or firing power, probably a good thing, but a defensive assistant pulling those kind of antics wouldn't be assisting much of anything the following year.
|
|
|
|
Post by buck42 on Mar 13, 2010 16:57:59 GMT -6
lol...mariner...you are right...I am the same way...I have a quick trigger that is why I am asking the gurus here before I act on my gut.
I have told him that "we need to talk, early next week!!"
This time he never responded...
btw, his son was at a combine today and ran a 5.06...glad he can run the 5:15 mile!
|
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on Mar 13, 2010 17:36:34 GMT -6
buck--2 things
1) I have found that MANY people don't know what being a coach entails. They think it is all about calling the trick play at the right time, and yelling/screaming on friday nights. Sounds like this is your boy (not that he is a yeller/screamer, but that he doesn't know what it REALLY means to be a coach). Unfortunately in this situation, I blame you. Have you expressed your expectations to each member of the staff, and held them accountable for it? Coach Johnson, you will have the friday night laundry done by 7pm on Sunday. Coaches Smith and Wesson, you guys will be in charge of taking down all of the field equipment after games.. Coach Douglas you will.....
If guy can't do what you need him to do...no need to keep them around.
2) I don't see what his son/and his son's ability has to do with ANYTHING.
|
|
coachriley
Junior Member
"Tough times don't last; Tough people do."
Posts: 406
|
Post by coachriley on Mar 13, 2010 17:38:01 GMT -6
Hell coach, i gotta agree with everyone else. If you got 10 coaches already, cut ties with one and get another coach to take over his position. Im a young coach and i would never expect to have a job after arguing formations and telling my HC "you are wrong".
|
|
|
|
Post by buck42 on Mar 13, 2010 17:58:02 GMT -6
CoachD...thanks for the input...first the sons ability has nothing to do with it...other than a fact that he is a dad which I anticipate will make things worse later down the road...
I blame myself for the things you mentioned...that is one of the issues that I have discussed with my staff already for the 2010 season and I have let them know that if they do not do what I ask then they will have to help someone else...
thanks for the input...
|
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on Mar 13, 2010 18:24:40 GMT -6
CoachD...thanks for the input...first the sons ability has nothing to do with it...other than a fact that he is a dad which I anticipate will make things worse later down the road... thanks for the input... I would ask the AD and principal to sit in on the dismissal meeting so you can say: "coach, thank you for your help last year in a tenuous situation at best. however, now that we are settled, i am looking for a,b,c ,x,y,z this year and based on our conversations /disagreements about football and the training methods for your son and your attendance/non attendance I feel it is best if we go in another direction. |
|
|
|
Post by buck42 on Mar 13, 2010 18:30:30 GMT -6
hey you wanna do this for me....great start...lol...no seriously, thanks...I am going to ask my AD to be present...my principal doesnt care...she doesnt know where my coaching office is...but dang if she cant find my classroom...
|
|
|
|
Post by jlenwood on Mar 13, 2010 18:33:01 GMT -6
A few things...
1)How big of a school are you that you have ten coaches? (just curious on this one)
2)Are all of your coaches paid or volunteer?
3)If you don't like the guy, and he doesn't sound like he contributes anything, what is holding you back from tossing him. Surely among the 10 other coaches you have someone else who can run rcvr drills.
4)Why don't you like coaches "from the community"? Is it because they can't get there at to watch your kids in a classroom, because it doesn't sound like you practice until after 4.
|
|
|
|
Post by buck42 on Mar 13, 2010 18:53:13 GMT -6
1) We are a 3A school...about 1000 kids
2) Only 6 coaches are paid
3) I WAS holding back because he is not the only one that has issues getting to the school for practice, but he is the only one that has been in so much disagreement.
I have no choice but to allow coaches from the community to coach. I do not have a problem with it, but I prefer to have my coaches in the building so they can help me with day to day stuff on campus and supervise and allow me to start practice before it gets dark!
I do have a couple others that can and have coached the WRs in his absence....
I intended to follow my "gut" but wanted others advise as well...because just like Mariner I know I have a quick temper and when he told me among other things that "your wrong" I went from 0 to pissed FAST!!
I have NOOO problem with disagreements and conversations that make us better...but donot like the way that was handled...
He said that I never listen...but we added few plays and changed route #s, modified angles and schemes from what I orginally had but "I never listen!"
Well, I guess I heard that loud and clear and he will to soon...
|
|
