nvoc
Freshmen Member
Posts: 65
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Post by nvoc on Feb 2, 2010 8:34:47 GMT -6
I know there have been similar messages on this subject before but I am going to ask it anyway.
We have around 23 seniors coming back next season, but none of them have really become leaders. Is there anything I can do to help some kids to become the leaders? We do have a couple fo them that are on the edge of becoming great leaders.
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Post by touchdownmaker on Feb 2, 2010 9:14:04 GMT -6
Id pick the best kids and lay it out, tell them, show them, tell them what you told them and tell them what you showed them, teach them to be leaders and hold them accountable to it.
ie have a captains training session, make in an hour long or so, teach them what it means to you to give someone the title captain.
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Post by Juliath on Feb 2, 2010 9:40:13 GMT -6
This is tough, but if a kid doesn't see being captain as an honor, he won't be able to lead anybody an will be a negative influence. Only make him captain if you can tell he cares. If he goofs off, relieve him of his duties, he probably hates being captain anyway and will resent it.
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Post by Coach Goodnight on Feb 2, 2010 22:02:33 GMT -6
I saw an Idea from the glazier website where one of the coached talked about making the kids apply for the position just like they were applying for a job, go thru the interview process, supply a resume, the whole thing. I think its a great idea and the ones who really want to be a leader will apply and go through it!
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Post by touchdowng on Feb 3, 2010 8:55:56 GMT -6
I saw an Idea from the glazier website where one of the coached talked about making the kids apply for the position just like they were applying for a job, go thru the interview process, supply a resume, the whole thing. I think its a great idea and the ones who really want to be a leader will apply and go through it! I tend to agree with this. I never did the application because I had kids ready to step up when voted on by players. Once a player was voted on, I'd meet with him and go through the criteria just to make sure this was what HE wanted. If you have nobody willing to do the application, you'll have to switch strategies. Maybe open it up to seniors and juniors - that may get the seniors to do a double take. If not, there's nothing wrong with relying on juniors if they are up for the job. you may just have a stealthy senior class who wants to fly under the radar and just play football. I wouldn't consider that a negative if they're good kids. Some people just don't want to step up. The forced leadership model (Son, we're going to make you a leader) isn't authentic and you'd put kids in a tough spot. Then you get to deal with another issue. Keep it simple and keep it real.
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Post by illiniwek on Feb 21, 2010 6:39:14 GMT -6
I agree with you completely on the forced leadership model. The application process idea is interesting. I've never heard that suggestion before.
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Post by oldindian on Feb 21, 2010 6:47:40 GMT -6
I'm thinking of trying to have ways to change captains during the year. We 've had years where our captains do a great job in the off season and then as we get into the season they aren't doing what is needed. I want to be able to change if needed, to keep the captains hungry and also to give the others a chance to be a captain.
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Post by touchdowng on Feb 21, 2010 9:52:22 GMT -6
Even when you have some natural leaders or you're cultivating some kids with leadership skills you must also educate the rest of the team with "followership".
We spend an hour, or so, discussing the laws of influence. Everybody in our program; from the team manager to the starting middle linebacker to the HC are not waivered from the laws of influence. This is the ONLY thing they cannot do. Everybody influences the whole, every minute of the day. Every person in our team's structure cannot be neutral with this they are either a negative or a positive and it is always their choice. Sometimes negative choices need to be pointed out because it may not be intentional.
As you "develop your leaders" be sure to develop the followers as they are all leaders in their own way. You can use ANY action as an example and explain how it could be a detriment or a support for your organization.
Such as: Being late to 1st period Telling a classmate that you don't think your team will win Not eating lunch Helping a teammate with an assignment Complimenting your backup
In ALL situations the kids can easily see where the scenarios could possibly go and how to nip those in the bud (negatives) or to encourage the behaviors.
Pretty soon, kids are much more consciencious about leading themselves and recognizing negative and positive behaviors.
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Post by jlenwood on Feb 21, 2010 11:51:52 GMT -6
One of the first things I think coaches need to realize is that there is a distinction between captains and leaders. I am sure everyone has been around a kid that has been named a captain only to later watch him turn into a world class a-hole, not really someone you want your players following. Sometimes this is just a popularity contest if not monitored closely by the HC.
I think the worst thing you can do is try to "make" someone step up and be a leader, most of the time they either "have it" or not, and like touchdowng said..some kids just want to play ball. What a leader is to me is the kid who works his tail off on the practice field, playing field, weight room, classroom etc. and is the kid who in a tough situation can walk into the huddle and everyone looks at him for what to do.
I read something not to long ago that was the best idea I have heard about how to sort out the leaders on your team. Challenge them to think back to when they were freshman and what do they remember about the seniors who were on the team. What was their work ethic and so on. Now think, how do the freshman this year view you. Are you going to inspire them to do great things (ie: leadership), or are you setting the example of just getting by and being average.
Sorry to ramble, but this is crucial to a teams success I think, and is often overlooked by so many.
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Post by jgordon1 on Feb 21, 2010 14:07:45 GMT -6
well, I am not sure someone becomes leader after listening to a coach, parent or anyone else talk for an hour....I was a two-time captain of my football team in college one of only a few in the history of the program, I was a leader by "example" or so I told everone..here is what I know..I was never told what a leader was supposed to be or do..I was thrust into the situation..after 2 years of being a captain and winning a big leadership award..when I graduated, I still knew exactly...nothing..It is my belief that becoming a leader is a PROCESS, not something that is done in an hour or signing a sheet of paper or given a lecture..I think the kids need to be taught how to be a leader, what is their idea of a leader..how do you approach someone...how do you solve conflict...I don't think anyone has a true answer but here is what I am doing..I am the "interim" HC of our football team right now and expect to get my first shot at a full time gig by the middle of next week (I also interviewed at another school)..I am having meetings approx 10 days apart (tomorrow is meeting 2) in the first meeting I explained why we were meeting, talked about our program and then had the kids define leadership and what it meant to them..IMHO there is really not a true answer here..I also asked then who was the best leader on the team (we did not discuss this outloud) BTW we had 7 kids there and 4 said the team had NO leaders ..pretty sad... any way the next meeting we will focus on characteristics of a leader using the Be..Know..Do..Model used by the US Army....I threw a kid (cancer)out of the weightroom last week and a senior approached me and said he wanted to talk about it at the leadership meeting..I thought that was a HUGE step forward cuz that would have festered before..meeting 3 (if I am stilll there ) will focus on the topic of what it means to be a servant-leader..also at these meetings will also ask them about workout times..allowing them to pick the time they workout at and also which day they want to have off..trying to give them a little ownership.... I have the meetings in the morning in my classroom and any player is allowed to attend
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Post by touchdowng on Feb 21, 2010 18:41:00 GMT -6
well, I am not sure someone becomes leader after listening to a coach, parent or anyone else talk for an hour....I was a two-time captain of my football team in college one of only a few in the history of the program, I was a leader by "example" or so I told everone..here is what I know..I was never told what a leader was supposed to be or do..I was thrust into the situation..after 2 years of being a captain and winning a big leadership award..when I graduated, I still knew exactly...nothing..It is my belief that becoming a leader is a PROCESS, not something that is done in an hour or signing a sheet of paper or given a lecture..I think the kids need to be taught how to be a leader, what is their idea of a leader..how do you approach someone...how do you solve conflict...I don't think anyone has a true answer but here is what I am doing..I am the "interim" HC of our football team right now and expect to get my first shot at a full time gig by the middle of next week (I also interviewed at another school)..I am having meetings approx 10 days apart (tomorrow is meeting 2) in the first meeting I explained why we were meeting, talked about our program and then had the kids define leadership and what it meant to them..IMHO there is really not a true answer here..I also asked then who was the best leader on the team (we did not discuss this outloud) BTW we had 7 kids there and 4 said the team had NO leaders ..pretty sad... any way the next meeting we will focus on characteristics of a leader using the Be..Know..Do..Model used by the US Army....I threw a kid (cancer)out of the weightroom last week and a senior approached me and said he wanted to talk about it at the leadership meeting..I thought that was a HUGE step forward cuz that would have festered before..meeting 3 (if I am stilll there ) will focus on the topic of what it means to be a servant-leader..also at these meetings will also ask them about workout times..allowing them to pick the time they workout at and also which day they want to have off..trying to give them a little ownership.... I have the meetings in the morning in my classroom and any player is allowed to attend Another HUGE step towards leadership it to take focus of yourself and to put it on the task at hand. Too many people want to "steal the thunder" and put themselves before the hard work.
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Post by hlb2 on Feb 22, 2010 7:03:01 GMT -6
This may be a little off topic, but how many of you select your captains, and how many of you let the players vote. I have always selected 3 captains and then every week we have an honorary captain that is a player who had the best week of practice. I have always been afraid to let the kids choose a captain, because of the popularity issue. Us as coaches have always selected the kids we felt had the best leadership skills to offer. Just wondering you ya'll do it?
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Post by senatorblutarsky on Feb 22, 2010 7:51:38 GMT -6
We have a leadership seminar every spring. I try to change it up depending on needs of that particular class.
We also do a lot of activities for seniors only early (through March).
RE: captains, we have an application process- which includes a formal letter of application, and interview, if necessary.
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mcrsa75
Sophomore Member
Posts: 116
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Post by mcrsa75 on Feb 22, 2010 8:23:40 GMT -6
I am putting this question out to everyone. WHY DOES YOUR LEADERSHIP HAVE TO COME FROM THE SENIOR CLASS?? This is one of those popular "coaching beliefs" that I am starting to challenge. I refuse to allow dysfunctional players (seniors or otherwise) dictate the character of my team. Just my thought
MCRSA75
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Post by blb on Feb 22, 2010 8:42:24 GMT -6
We let players vote on captains at end of first week of two-a-days after a process.
They have 40 votes - I have 41. But I have not had to overturn a decision they've made (yet) because I felt it was a bad one.
"Leaders" don't HAVE to be seniors, any more than seniors have to be starters. But since they're a year older, have more experience, have had more coaching - you expect more out of them initially.
"Those that have the most have to give the most". If they can't or worse yet, won't - find somebody that will.
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Post by jgordon1 on Feb 22, 2010 9:31:11 GMT -6
I am putting this question out to everyone. WHY DOES YOUR LEADERSHIP HAVE TO COME FROM THE SENIOR CLASS?? This is one of those popular "coaching beliefs" that I am starting to challenge. I refuse to allow dysfunctional players (seniors or otherwise) dictate the character of my team. Just my thought MCRSA75 EXACTLYHad that same discussion in our leadship meeting this am
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Post by gunrun on Feb 22, 2010 10:46:27 GMT -6
I read something not to long ago that was the best idea I have heard about how to sort out the leaders on your team. Challenge them to think back to when they were freshman and what do they remember about the seniors who were on the team. What was their work ethic and so on. Now think, how do the freshman this year view you. Are you going to inspire them to do great things (ie: leadership), or are you setting the example of just getting by and being average. Sorry to ramble, but this is crucial to a teams success I think, and is often overlooked by so many. I like those questions--makes them think. It also helps them to realize that leadership is influence.
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Post by hlb2 on Feb 22, 2010 19:33:43 GMT -6
In my experience, seniors generally lead better. Not always true, but for the most part that year of experience over everyone else usually pays off. I have had junior captains, but never lower than that class.
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sooner
Freshmen Member
Posts: 88
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Post by sooner on Feb 23, 2010 13:50:34 GMT -6
We do a ten week leadership course in the spring during their junior year. Do one chapter a week until we are finished. Really was helpful last year to us and is helped our young leaders realise the benefits and prepare for the pitfalls of being a team leader.
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bgj
Sophomore Member
Posts: 154
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Post by bgj on Feb 23, 2010 16:27:52 GMT -6
This is something that we do to increase our pool of leader/captain candidates.
We use the "huddle" group approach, divide the entire program in to groups, each huddle group as two/three captains. That way you have more than just the regular 2 or 3 guys that are natural leaders doing everything. We do a variety of things in the off-season, like those listed above. Which include everyone, and others that only include the huddle captains.
To be a captain for the season, one of the prerequisites is to be a successful huddle captain. Those that are interested apply, they go through a checklist etc. During the "application" process they are to deliver a short speech to the rest of the team. They also are interviewed by the a select group of the coaching staff.
When it comes down to it... the players still vote and the coaches still have influence, but the process build a lot of character and we find the the rest of the team really respects those that can put themselves in front of the team and speak about certain things.
This was the short version...but it might help you think of other things to do.
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bgj
Sophomore Member
Posts: 154
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Post by bgj on Feb 23, 2010 16:32:31 GMT -6
The reason we decided to go with this approach was to give the opportunity to become a leader to those on the fringe overshadowed by that one great kid.
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Post by bluecrazy on Feb 27, 2010 11:27:09 GMT -6
OK, had the leadership discussion with my A.D. I was thinking about taking some kids to the Michigan State university Leadership conference for high school kids. He believes kids have to be born a leader, and can't be taught to be a leader.
What do you think?
My feeling is, if you can take good, dedicated kids to a leadership conference, it can help them grow in this area.
Leaders are born, but can also be taught.
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Post by jgordon1 on Feb 27, 2010 15:44:10 GMT -6
I think leadership conference is good but i think you need to add and reinforce it
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go42
Sophomore Member
Posts: 147
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Post by go42 on Feb 28, 2010 7:00:32 GMT -6
I don't agree with the being born a leader belief. I think the best thing a coach can do is eliminate the premise that your captains are your best players. Your captains are your best leaders, the ones who do things the right way on the field and off the field. I don't believe your captains have to be your best players. i believe you should find the kids you can trust the most and talk to, work with those kids - reinforce the positive things you want your program to be about. You may be amazed how well that works. Coaches make major leadership/captain mistakes because they choose captains based on who will look the toughest at the pre-game coin toss
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Post by blb on Feb 28, 2010 8:36:38 GMT -6
I don't agree with the being born a leader belief. I think the best thing a coach can do is eliminate the premise that your captains are your best players. Your captains are your best leaders, the ones who do things the right way on the field and off the field. I don't believe your captains have to be your best players. i believe you should find the kids you can trust the most and talk to, work with those kids - reinforce the positive things you want your program to be about. You may be amazed how well that works. Coaches make major leadership/captain mistakes because they choose captains based on who will look the toughest at the pre-game coin toss I don't believe that any one posted earlier they choose only their best players as captains. As I said, we don't choose the captains - players vote after a process. Coaches can make mistakes by picking kids they think they can trust, are the "right" kind of kid - some young people act differently around adults than they do around their peers (Eddie Haskell syndrome). You could really do damage to team morale by designating a kid as a captain because of what you perceive his character to be and the team will not follow him - you cannot "force" leaders on the squad simply by dint of your authority as coach.
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Post by jackedup on Feb 28, 2010 9:16:49 GMT -6
Great discussion... My question is for those who do some type of leadership training program regardless of whether it is formal/informal, for all grades/specific grades, etc.. How much of it do you think is actually taken in by the players? Or how much of it do the players give any real value and attention to?
I love the idea of having some type of training program but I am fearful of losing their focus by dragging it out. And at the same time I want to make sure to touch upon all the major areas.
Maybe people can discuss their programs.
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Post by blb on Feb 28, 2010 10:05:36 GMT -6
That is a good question. I think it would be very difficult to evaluate or quantify the effectiveness of a "Leadership Program" in terms of how much it improves kids' abilities in the area (as opposed to how much was innate) and how much they actually internalize and use.
Because I am the head coach I deal primarily with varsity players, although do have some sub-varsity in off-season conditioning.
I talk to ALL of them as a group after each workout about something related to either Commitment, Responsibility, or Self-Discipline as appropriate, and give them handouts every two-four weeks on one of those areas.
At our Spring sign up meeting I announce anyone that wants to be considered for varsity team captain needs to pick up our questionnaire and list of captains' qualities.
To be considered they must attend the MHSFCA Leadership Seminar, complete the questionnaire (which is posted on locker room bulletin board for teammates to read), and stand up in front of squad to tell them what they learned at the seminar, why they want and deserve to be captain, and what type of leader they will be, i.e. how they will lead.
Players then vote on Friday of first week of two-a-days and we announce results the next day at our "Meet Your Team" Day.
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Post by jackedup on Feb 28, 2010 16:05:17 GMT -6
blb, I like what you have them do. What type of questionnaire questions to you list? We don't necessarily have access to a seminar but the questions and speak part look interesting.
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Post by huthuthut on Mar 3, 2010 21:23:43 GMT -6
Make sure your players have opportunities to lead. It's hard to develop leadership skills if the coaches run EVERYTHING.
I like to let the players lead warmup drills in the offseason (weight room, agilitiy stations, etc.)
Sometimes I'll purposely get to the weight room a few minutes late. If they've already started warming up (without the weights), I know I've got some leaders. If they're all standing around looking at each other I'll question them on what they're waiting for. The next time I'm late you'll find out who your leaders are or want to be.
I'm also especially hard on non-followers whenever a player is trying to lead and in the right way. It's very discouraging when young leaders are disrespected by turds who don't want a peer telling them what to do.
Just some thoughts....
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Post by coachdbs on Mar 4, 2010 14:58:39 GMT -6
OK, had the leadership discussion with my A.D. I was thinking about taking some kids to the Michigan State university Leadership conference for high school kids. He believes kids have to be born a leader, and can't be taught to be a leader. What do you think? My feeling is, if you can take good, dedicated kids to a leadership conference, it can help them grow in this area. Leaders are born, but can also be taught. Coach - You hit it right on the head. There are some people who were born leaders but there are many others who are taught and coached to be leaders. Last time I checked, most successful organizations incorporate some type of leadership training. If it was as simple as being born with leadership skills....there would be no need for leadership training, classes, etc. I am taking a graduate leadership course right now and it has been incredibly helpful in all aspects of my life. There is no doubt in my mind that my leadership skills have and will continue to improve as a result of this class. Why would we not provide the same opportunities for our student athletes?
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