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Post by jgordon1 on Dec 3, 2009 17:41:51 GMT -6
What are some good ideas for building relationships with individual players... I don't want to be their BFF but yet I want them to able to confide in me if there is a problem...So far I've just tried to be myself..listen to their concerns..try to empathize..Yet I am a taskmaster on the field and in the weight room..not in a negative way (i think).the players call me the squat Nazi because they know they better go parallel when i am near the squat rack..stuff like that...I do think this sometimes makes me unapproachable..I usually try to start a small conversation with one of the kids as we are leaving the field..Just small talk about school, family or friends....
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Post by gdf on Dec 3, 2009 20:00:23 GMT -6
The more you can be around in the off-season (wt. room, spring sports, etc.) the stronger your relationships will be. If they see you showing up for their other sports, being in the wt. room, etc. they'll understand that you care about them. Once they know that, the relationships will grow. If they think you only care about them during FB, they won't want to have a relationship.
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Post by brophy on Dec 3, 2009 20:48:02 GMT -6
I wish I knew. One of the rewarding aspects of coaching, for me, is the sharing. I will bust my tail to make sure I have prepared the game prep / drills / pertinent info for practice and handouts......it is rewarding to GIVE and make a difference. But on the flip side of that, I find every year getting more and more out of what the kids TEACH ME. Nothing comes before execution and success on the field, but once we've taken care of business, I have a about two dozen open-ended questions I'll throw at kids on the team throughout the season while we're waiting for something or to kill dead air (in practice), just to put them off-balance and provide insight into their life. Questions completely unrelated to the game. It is a fine line, and I think (IMO) what makes it so difficult for both the coach and player. You have to have your role established and you have to make sure boundaries are enforced. There is no clear definition of how much is too much/little, because it varies from person to person. I always found one of the best ways was to have my son around practices and such, so they can see a side of me that they wouldn't otherwise see. Another thing I've used is just to call a kid or his parents up on a weekend or Tuesday night and just thank them for the effort they are putting in. Nothing major, maybe a 2 minute call, but just to let them know you're thinking about them. A little goes a long way. But like I said earlier, I'll try to make myself vulnerable and after the season kicks off, ask some of them how to do / explain something...whether its music, or clothes, or whatever...it empowers them to instruct/school me.
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Post by gdf on Dec 4, 2009 9:36:10 GMT -6
I second Brophy's comment about having your son around (not that everyone can do that). But during summer activities I try to bring my son to everything I can. He loves it b/c he looks up to those guys, and he cracks the varsity kids up. Plus it's good for them to see me in a different light (as Brophy mentioned). Also, in an indirect way you're showing many of them HOW to be a father. Sadly, that's something many kids don't get.
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Post by ryanjmyers on Dec 4, 2009 10:56:42 GMT -6
brophy -- you wrote "I have a about two dozen open-ended questions I'll throw at kids on the team throughout the season while we're waiting for something or to kill dead air (in practice), just to put them off-balance and provide insight into their life. Questions completely unrelated to the game."
Any chance you want to share some of those questions? They sound interesting.
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Post by davecisar on Dec 4, 2009 11:29:32 GMT -6
I second Brophy's comment about having your son around (not that everyone can do that). But during summer activities I try to bring my son to everything I can. He loves it b/c he looks up to those guys, and he cracks the varsity kids up. Plus it's good for them to see me in a different light (as Brophy mentioned). Also, in an indirect way you're showing many of them HOW to be a father. Sadly, that's something many kids don't get. Sad but very true, unfortunately. Many of the young men I used to work with in the inner-city NEVER had anything positive family/male modeled for them, generations etc For many of them I made a point to take them out to dinner after games with my wife and kids. Some of them I had do work for me and made sure we got them a meal at the house with me interracting with my wife and children. When we did our character talks I rarely left out references to my wife and children.
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Post by brophy on Dec 4, 2009 11:50:28 GMT -6
Any chance you want to share some of those questions? They sound interesting. lol - i knew that would happen, but just for giggles, here goes; - who do you think you get along with better, your mom or your dad?
(this is an interesting one, and most will deliberate before they answer this)
- Make a comment BASED on an off-hand assumption of what that kid does at home, then just let it go. He will have to defend/deny/further articulate what you mentioned.....(ie. "Your dad used to spank you a lot when you were younger, right?" or "Its good you're a protective older brother to your sisters..." (whether or not you know if that kid has any siblings at all). If nothing else, it gets the kid thinking "WTF?!" and he will TRY to interact with you more because he thinks you think of him/know what he's about.
- who are you taking to Homecoming dance?
How'd you two hook up?
- What type of work does your dad do? what do you plan on doing after high school?
- Ask them what is a good place to eat/take a date/etc....like you REALLY need their advice
- (randomly) I hear the kids telling me about how bad you cheat in Madden (every kid plays it), what are you doing on that thing/what team?
- Can you show me how to do the _________(insert latest dance)
- Or just repeat whatever you hear on BET,MTV, the radio station (pretend like you know what you're talking about) to let them give their version...
- another thing I'll do to just stimulate comraderie and levity, is when in the process of intense drills, stop and ask, "who's hotter? Ciara or Lady Gaga?" (pick any current celebrity). There is no wrong answer (no matter who it is), but the inclusion of their input (no matter how trivial) makes them feel empowered (THEY are making the decision/input for once) and you get to see how they think.
It also sets up a real good joke (always good at running the endorphins and making them associate 'fun'/togetherness) later after you've asked that same scenario (with different women) a dozen or so times, by asking, "Who's hotter? Christina Aguilera (you would have run out of women to compare by now) or Earnest Borgnine?"....it is an experience the group will get to share and associate with.
This actually plays into the competitiveness you want to instill, inadvertently. We solve a lot of "whos first in a drill" with paper,rock,scissors.
- the other thing that I make sure I do, is go up to a kid and just tell him, "______, I LIKE you. You're a good guy"
(don't have to justify or explain it, just make sure they hear those 3 words) and near the end of the season, let them know that I am really happy I got to get to know them (personally) during the season.
I consciously do this, because I am admittedly horrible at projecting sensitive emotion(s) and most would mistake my aloof or intense demeanor as I don't care about people. This is why I am trying to work at creating better relationships with players in the off-season
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Post by davecisar on Dec 4, 2009 11:57:50 GMT -6
Matt, Can I just pay you to come up with the questions so I dont have to watch MTV or BET? I love coaching and love the kids, but I do have limits of what I can tolerate. I have no clue who gaga or ciara is of even if those are real people.
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Post by coachvann on Dec 4, 2009 12:45:08 GMT -6
I believe this is why many of us coach...building relationships! It is a tough line bc you see some coaches who want to be the kids best friend and then the kid gets confused when the coach jumps on his case for a blown assignment.
Kids are smart and they know if you are going to build relationship just to get them to play or if you are building a relationship because you deeply care for them. The old saying, "Kid doesn't care how much you know until they know how much you care."
Somethings we do at our place is that I have an open door policy and the kids come in whenever they can to talk about anything, we do have small group time with devotions before every practice and that has helped our position coaches and their players build up a solid relationship. The day before game day we do something call the night B4-all the players come over to the house and they hang out and have something light to eat-at the end of the night the players share what the week of practice or what the game means or just share about what is going on with each other in a group meeting...none of the coaches are allowed to talk x's and o's or even try to run the meeting...the meeting is ran by our leadership team. I believe this has grown the coaches relationships with the kids the most...the kids get to see the coaches in a different light and atmosphere...they see us with our families-and it is a great time!
The biggest thing I have seen grow our relationships between coaches and players may be the cheesiest...we all say "I love you" when we say bye to each other. From coaches to coaches and coaches to players-yesterday I even heard players saying it to players (in a way of just saying it). Those simple words have made all the difference in the world...our coaches have earned the right to yell and jump all over our boys; because our boys know that our coaches want the best for them. We have guys in the weight room now and that has never been the case at this school until we all came into this program-and I don't think it is bc we are great coaches but I believe that the boys want to go where they are loved.
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Post by superpower on Dec 4, 2009 13:14:39 GMT -6
coachvann, we are making an effort to tell our kids "I love you" more frequently as well. I don't do it often enough, but it made a difference when two of our kids were in trouble early in this past season. They both came to my house just to visit about things while they were suspended. I don't think they would have done that if the relationship hadn't been established.
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Post by jgordon1 on Dec 4, 2009 13:42:34 GMT -6
Please guys don't take this the wrong way..I am not sure about the love thing....Love is a special word for me and I don't throw it around lightly..maybe it's because growing up it wasn't a word that was used around my house alot....today, it seems like it is overblown thus almost rendering it almost meaningless..I can't even imagine a coach telling me they love me,,,I mean do you honestly really love your players..maybe their are different types of love..I certainly care and fight for my players but I am not going to jump infront of a bullet...ps..the family thing is sometimes hard for me to swallow too..Our kids ended every practice saying family..as soon as they were off the field they would be MFing each other
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Post by brophy on Dec 4, 2009 14:01:33 GMT -6
Please guys don't take this the wrong way..I am not sure about the love thing......I can't even imagine a coach telling me they love me,,, same here. I'm not looking to be their dad or pastor, just a MUTUALLY cooperative endeavor (two people can behave as adults without having power/authority over the other). I can work with people, have a relationship with them, but not establish a power heirarchy/dominance. When I think relationship, I'm thinking being accepting of who that person really is (not praising and stroking them for doing something that I want them to do / assimilating with my belief system). To each his own, and just because I don't have a taste for it doesn't mean I'm attacking or disagreeing with what was offered. All good advice and nothing I dislike more than for an idea to be presented and folks dogpile it. Good for coachvann and superpower - it works for them. I'm just not looking to start bible studies or be something I'm not (nor do I think it is necessary).
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Post by spartancoach on Dec 4, 2009 14:10:44 GMT -6
By talking to players, instead of at them, and talking in conversational tones, instead of screaming in anger or giving rah rah speeches, they seem to listen to me more then the other coaches.
Kids see through everything that is not genuine.
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Post by touchdownmaker on Dec 4, 2009 16:42:42 GMT -6
Building relationships is what its all about. I truly care about these kids and some of them...well, they honestly just break my heart with some of the very poor, self destructive decisions they make. Its then, THEN that you have to make sure you dont turn your back on them and abandon them. Thats love. Anyone can "love" a loveable kid. But can you love the "turd" who makes your life a living hell while you coach him? will you continue to try and provide guidance and structure and meaning in his life if he quits on the team? its not easy.
There were several kids who quit on us last year, these kids took more time to reach but they come to my office and talk about stuff. one kid who quit the team TWICE sat with me at a college game to talk about life stuff. The kid needs some male guidance and role modeling even if he quit. In fact, he needs it more.
In any case, "love" means different things to different people, to me, LOVE is the opposite of APATHY. you cant be apathetic about your players and students. that means you have to really care and be willing to do whatever it takes to help them achieve and find success.
building relationships means building trust, without trust theres no relationship and trust me, youll lose trust in many kids very fast if you are inconsistent or unfair in what you say and do. kids are about JUSTICE AND WHATS FAIR. adults hardly ever say "thats not fair" but a kid will say it a hundred times a day. not sure why, but they think everything has to be fair dont they?
anyhow, some kids that hated the change in coaches took time, they came around, we have a relationship now. other kids who werent sure have come around, we have a relationship...but to really take that up to where it goes way beyond football ....do you want that? does the kid want that?...not always.
find a way to care, find a way to show it, keep at it, eventually the relationship will be solid.
I had a conversation with one kid, he was brutal to coach, just brutal. I put my arm around him and said flatly "since the day I got here, you have been the guy on the other end of the rope, always recruiting others to tug in teh opposite end of things. honestly, we refer to that as being a cancer, dont be that, it spreads. " I told him that most coaches would cut him loose and not bother with him, I told him however that I thought he deserved a chance to get to know me before I made any decisions about him and he any about me. he finished the season but didnt play in the last four games. he apologized to me for being difficult as did many of the others who were in his class.
it takes time. theres an article by the u of houston coach somewhere that he discusses some issues with upper classmen.
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Post by jgordon1 on Dec 4, 2009 19:43:41 GMT -6
THX TD
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Post by mariner42 on Dec 5, 2009 1:23:25 GMT -6
I'm 24, so I have it significantly easier than most of you guys when it comes to building relationships with the kids, just because they see me as the young guy on staff. A lot of them project me as a sort of older brother role, which I'm more or less OK with.
For me, what's important is that I'm not TOO involved in their lives because I might lose the very small amount of professional distance I have (I'm literally coaching little brothers of girls I took out on dates in HS). In order to keep that distance intact, I make sure that I don't get involved in the daily gossip/drama of their lives, because if I do that, I'm officially their buddy and I'm up a river when it comes time for me to get effective cooperation when I need it from them. I make it very clear that I'm interested in helping them with important things, stuff like serious girl problems or advice, talking to them about issues with their folks, FEEDING them, anything they need that isn't gossip or scuttlebutt, etc.
As far as other stuff I do to build relationships, well, I'm mostly just me. I'm sarcastic, brutally deadpan, I tend to tease incessantly, and I have high expectations. I don't try to be 'cool' or 'hip' because I'm not, I'm a certified nerd who happens to have a passion for football. I introduce them to girls I'm seriously dating. I tell them (appropriate) stories about my dumbass friends doing dumbass things and the occasional story of dumbass me doing dumbass stuff. I dunno, I think the big thing is to be genuine, exposed, and available. How you do that is entirely for you to figure out, but it does need to be YOURS. I think there are great ideas within this thread, but the most important thing is to make them work for you! Gotta do it your way, whatever way that is.
Oh, and have fun! If you're fun, the kids will dig it and follow it.
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Post by poorbob on Dec 5, 2009 1:41:03 GMT -6
As a former HS player, which I'm sure most of you were as well, I know that the tough love approach works really well. When you have a work hard environment and act like it's in their best interest if they want to win district or whatever, then they will respond. I remember the pre-game speech one game was verbatim, "I am having a really bad day. My mom has health problems. I don't want to have to worry about this game so just win." We played with conviction and won. Just be a coach first. Don't try to talk to them about anything not football related. That's awkward and they will approach you if they want to talk about that kind of stuff. Talk about goals and looking forward to the next opponent. Reward them for good effort and go ballistic for poor effort. That kind of strategy will always work. Be fair, completely fair. I know a lot of that sounds basic and I have no more experience than anyone else, but my team had great chemistry and our coaches were great. Our senior year we went to state for the first time in school history. If you just take one piece of advice from that, don't try to talk about anything outside of football unless you're in the inner city or the kids don't have very good role models. Hope that helps.
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Post by lukethadrifter on Dec 5, 2009 11:01:38 GMT -6
Building relationships with players is a key thing. You have to be a good communicator as a coach. Always be consistent with discipline, etc... Be firm, but fair. Be a type of coach that strives to build confidence in players instead of tearing kids down. When you do have to criticize or get after a kid, always criticize the action, not the player on a personal level. A players' trust in you will grow when he sees that you know your stuff and you are organized. Show a lot of energy and enthusiasm in your coaching. Luke
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Post by kylem56 on Dec 5, 2009 11:30:57 GMT -6
I don't know how much more there is to add to the discussion because most of what is already said is dead-on correct. I once worked under a very successful coach, will be in the Hall of Fame one day, who told me to pick one kid everyday and before or after practice ask them about something completely non-football. Also told me to eventually do this with kids outside of my position group because the more coaches that the kids trust and respect the better. Like alot of you have said, little things like a phone call or just laugh & joking with them can go a long way. Just show them your human. IMO Kids have enough issues these days so why not give them one place they feel safe.
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Post by ryanjmyers on Dec 9, 2009 15:11:29 GMT -6
Thanks brophy. All good stuff, I like this comment. "I consciously do this, because I am admittedly horrible at projecting sensitive emotion(s) and most would mistake my aloof or intense demeanor as I don't care about people. This is why I am trying to work at creating better relationships with players in the off-season" I'm obviously the same way as I couldn't even come up with my own list of questions to ask the kids
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Post by mariner42 on Dec 9, 2009 15:58:13 GMT -6
I worked for a track coach who was a big believer in what he called "Taking a lap" with a kid once or twice a week. He just wanted us to pull someone aside and talk with them while taking a lap around the track. Nothing earthshattering, but just some personal, 1 on 1 time that showed them we were interested in them. Very similar to Kylem's thing and I think it really was a good thing for that program where so many kids were coming from broken homes and poor families.
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Post by coachcb on Dec 9, 2009 19:12:45 GMT -6
I will admit, I talk to the kids a lot about video games, when I can. They play the same games that I do, and not just the football ones. The violent ones that their folks shouldn't be letting them play..Lol
For me, I had to learn to replace negativity and scoldings with neutral honesty in order to develop good relationships with the kids. I am generally an upbeat/positive coach that is always jumping around, coaching and praising the kids for effort. So, if I go from that, to jumping down a kids throat, they get a really mixed message.
If a kid is playing slow/being lazy, I don't immediately jump them for it; I ask them WHY they're playing slow/being lazy. Sometimes, it's because they don't understand something, so I coach them up. Other times, they give me excuses; they're sick, or they're tired, etc,etc.. In those situations, I calmly tell them that they need to work through that stuff if they want to see the field. Now, it is hard for me to stay calm in these situations, but I do nonetheless.
By focusing on remaining positive and being honest, the kids know I have an open door policy. And, if I see that a kid is down or just acting funny, I'll pull them aside and ask them if they're alright. I try to focus on 'showing the kids that I care, before I show them what I know.'
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