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Post by wingtol on May 10, 2009 8:05:09 GMT -6
We have just found out that we have a major problem when it comes to our two-a-days this coming season. Our school, a private one that sets it's own schedule, has decided to start school Aug 24th this year. Which just happens to be our second week of two-a-days (and the second week of official practice for all sports not just us). We have always had two weeks of practice before school starts for as long as I can remember in fact I will say always have had that. The best part is no other school in our county/district starts till at least the next week or after Labor DAY. So now we are looking at a whole week of pre-season work being wiped out. I know some of you have had to deal with schedules like this and am looking for your input on to what works and what does not.
We are thinking of going a real early session before school 6:30-8:00 then a night session from like 5-7:30. I have never had to deal with this where we practice, send the kids to school, then practice again after school. I am worried about how the kids will be physically and mentally.
This has really thrown us for a loop and has us scrambling for ideas. I am just happy we switched our week of overnight camp to the first week or we would be taking a major finical hit if it would have been the second week.
Thanks for any advice. Like I said this is the first time we have had to deal with this and don't want to sound whinny about it since some of you deal with this on a yearly basis. It just has us shocked that the school had no idea it would affect us and seems not to care.
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Post by powerdog on May 10, 2009 8:09:42 GMT -6
Last season our school started the wed before we could start practice. We normally only go 4 days of 2-a-days so no big deal.
but we did notice kids were exhuasted so we told them wed night if we have a crisp sharp practice then no morning practice on Thursday. all we do is condition in the am anyway.
THis year schools starts the same day as practice probally the same deal.
What do you do for 2 weeks of 2-a-days?
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Post by mitch on May 10, 2009 8:09:52 GMT -6
Once school starts, we just get into a regular practice schedule.
During the pre-season weeks we do skimp a little on special teams during the week, so we come up for about an hour on saturdays.
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Post by rpetrie on May 10, 2009 8:29:19 GMT -6
In Suffolk County, NY (Long Island), we have what's called the "10-5 rule." We cannot practice past 10AM or before 5PM any day preceeding Labor Day. Our doubles then are scheduled from 7-10 & 5-7:30PM. I hate the structure because the early mornings keep some kids away...that being said it can be done. My suggestions are...
1. Start your first week with the early schedule so they get used to the time. After about the 3rd AM practice (hump day) things are in a groove and they don't mind the early AM's
2. Don't double every day...2 days double, 1 day single rotation
3. If you want to double every day, make the AM's non-contact and work on formations, plays on air/bags, defensive recognition, skelly, etc.
4. Make the afternoon/evening practices based on contact fundamentals (blocking, tackling, etc.) and then go into more live team/group stuff (1/2 line drills, inside fits, etc.)
Just some thoughts. We've been doing this for 10 years now.
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Post by wingtol on May 10, 2009 8:32:50 GMT -6
I should be a bit more specific on our schedule, the first week we are away at camp M-Thrs. We go 2 a day M-W, Thrs morning light Thrs afternoon and break camp. Fri of the week we walk through for our scrim. Sat morning. The next week, where school starts, we have 2 a days Mon-Wed. Walk through Thrs for Fri Night scrimmage. So really the only days that are screwy from us are tue and wed of the second week when the kids will be in school.
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Post by fbdoc on May 10, 2009 13:00:23 GMT -6
So it sounds like you're on the same schedule/start date as the rest of your league - could be worse! Don't stress out about the lost days. It is what it is. Become as efficient as possible with your time - maybe go 3 hours instead of 2 or 2 1/2 to help make up for lost time.
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Post by wingtol on May 10, 2009 14:39:14 GMT -6
So it sounds like you're on the same schedule/start date as the rest of your league - could be worse! Don't stress out about the lost days. It is what it is. Become as efficient as possible with your time - maybe go 3 hours instead of 2 or 2 1/2 to help make up for lost time. That's the problem, we're not on the same schedule as everyone else in our region/distirct. Our state association says ok Aug 17th is the first day you can practice. Every other school starts school on Aug 31 or later so they all have a full two weeks of practices with no school while we only get one. It's hard not to stress out because we have never and I mean never had this problem before and our whole insertion/two weeks of two a days is planed out. Now we are looking at loosing several practices. Basically just a vent for me since the school never even looked into athletics when they scheduled the first day of school and how it would impact them based on past years and also because no one else starts anywhere close to Aug 24 in the area. Sorry thanks for listening  |
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Post by rpetrie on May 10, 2009 14:40:44 GMT -6
You can inter-squad scrimmage another team on Day #6...Interesting? We have to have 11 practices before the first scrimmage can be played. What are your requirements for practices...days with helmets, helmets & shoulder pads, full gear, etc?
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Post by touchdowng on May 10, 2009 14:49:07 GMT -6
Sorry, I didn't read all of the posts but we have tried two-a-days during spring ball.
We start at 6am and finish at 7:15am. Just helmets & Shorts. We do our install and some agility.
Then we go a little longer 2:45 to 5:30 in the afternoons and suit up full.
We had to do this due to sharing many kids during this time. We go M/W/F and the other sports get them Tu and Th after school.
If I was in your situation and felt it essential to run two practices once school begins, it can be done.
In my state (Washington) we are only allowed 5 multiple practice days once our official season begins - Must not be this way in Pennsylvania?
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Post by wingtol on May 10, 2009 16:25:10 GMT -6
You can inter-squad scrimmage another team on Day #6...Interesting? We have to have 11 practices before the first scrimmage can be played. What are your requirements for practices...days with helmets, helmets & shoulder pads, full gear, etc? That's what I love about PA, it's basically first official day is Aug 17 (this year) have at it! No restrictions on gear or practices per day. They set a date for the first regular season game that's about it. We have two scrimmages, one a week during our first two weeks before the first game. We are full pads with no restrictions other than we have to give them one day off Sun-Sat. We also are allowed to wear helmets during our summer workouts which we start July 1. No dead periods either. |
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Post by rocketcoach on May 10, 2009 16:54:00 GMT -6
We have run into this problem before. We have done some in-school 2-a-days after school for a few days of the first week to get some extra time in. The first session right after school from 3-5:15 full-pads. The parents come in and feed the kids lunch meat sandwiches, pbj, fruit, etc., it's a bit of a team bonding time. I limit the number of kids from each class that can sit at each table. Example: at least 2 from each class at each table and I have questions they have to ask each other. The evening session is 2 hrs either just helmets or helmets and shoulder pads. Not a lot of contact. Has worked well for us when we have been forced into it. Not ideal but it has helped. We only do it the first week of school because after that first week the homework starts becoming more regular. The first week there usually isn't a lot of homework.
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Post by op4shadow on May 10, 2009 18:32:38 GMT -6
i played in pa, and we did 3 a days for both weeks of camp. this would be a good way to catch up on missed time. we arrived at 7 for roll call, followed by a skull session, then session 1. break for lunch, skull session, session 2, break for a snack break, skull, then session 3. session 3 was always shorts shoulder pads and helmets, and it was primarily special teams, and alot of play review. as for exhausting your players, we always finished each practice with 20 40 yd. sprints (we started at 12 and added on 2 every session until we hit 20). we were usually done by 530. takes some planning, and clock management, but it will work.
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Post by tothehouse on May 11, 2009 8:31:00 GMT -6
Since I've coached at my current school (season 11 this fall) I've never had one two-a-day practice. We start school August 15th this upcoming year. This means that every other team in the region that starts after Labor Day gets two-a-days.
A couple things.....
1. Our school has a full blown football PE class 1st period every day of the school year. Weights and football...all year. EXTREMELY beneficial.
2. Make your summers extremely important. We go to a couple camps, but our workouts in the summer need to be great due to the lost time at the end of the summer.
3. Rest - we hammer our players over the summer and have a dead period from July 19th till we start practicing. Almost 3 weeks off. At first I thought that was crazy and that our players would be behind. Then...something crazy happend....it actually helps us! Kids are primed and ready for everything we throw at them when they come back.
I think we are NOT the norm as things go. I think you figure out a way to make things work and it will be fine.
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Post by overthetop on May 11, 2009 9:30:54 GMT -6
You can inter-squad scrimmage another team on Day #6...Interesting? We have to have 11 practices before the first scrimmage can be played. What are your requirements for practices...days with helmets, helmets & shoulder pads, full gear, etc? That's what I love about PA, it's basically first official day is Aug 17 (this year) have at it! No restrictions on gear or practices per day. They set a date for the first regular season game that's about it. We have two scrimmages, one a week during our first two weeks before the first game. We are full pads with no restrictions other than we have to give them one day off Sun-Sat. We also are allowed to wear helmets during our summer workouts which we start July 1. No dead periods either. I read about a program in Pa that does 5 a days. Its all about the kids being a real part of something big. |
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Post by gunrun on May 11, 2009 10:05:24 GMT -6
quote] I read about a program in Pa that does 5 a days. Its all about the kids being a real part of something big. We did that last year, but I wouldn't recommend it. The kids don't have much time to rest. I would rather do two or even three-a-days. The worst part was that you had to go through five or six pairs of underwear to keep from getting a rash. That's a lot of laundry in a week. |
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Post by struceri on May 11, 2009 11:50:33 GMT -6
we start school the 1st official day of practice, most of the other teams in the state start school a week to two weeks later so we get as much out of our summer camps as we can and we go about 3-4 days of two-a-days during the 1st week, either a morning and afternoon seesion or two afternoon sessions, and scale back the last couple days of the week.
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Post by calicoachh on May 11, 2009 12:23:12 GMT -6
our section regulates how many practices you can have before the start of school. our school has also started earlier the last couple of seasons, so we have not had any two-a-days. it really has not made any difference.
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Post by wingtol on May 11, 2009 14:08:55 GMT -6
I think we are going to go with a 6:30-8 am and a 5-7:30ish schedule for the couple of days that the kids will be in school. That was almost our reg schedule but the morning was a few hrs later. I am just concerned how it will be with them sitting in school all day for those days. I guess we will live and learn.
Just out of curiosity how many of you guys who don't do two a days are two platoon? We have a ton of kids go both ways and the two-a-days really help us get everything in.
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Post by touchdownmaker on May 11, 2009 15:10:39 GMT -6
Jenks Olka doesnt even do two a days from what I read. One of best programs in the country but they do go about 4 hours straight.
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Post by CoachCP on May 11, 2009 21:26:16 GMT -6
I believe in the 4 hours straight as well. I am going to try and convince our HC to do it.
It would probably go from 7 till 11/11:30 or so. That way if kids need to work a job for money out of want/need, they have the whole afternoon, and so do the coaches. I'd probably make the kids do a half-hour of practice film to get us till 12.
If school became an issue like that, I don't know what I'd do. Probably do some before school and after school work like suggested. That would be awful for the kids and us, because that means staying inside the school for more than 12 hours, and when that happened to me in HS as a player, the team and myself hated football and wanted no part of it.
I would probably do doubles 2 days a week, and the days without doubles I'd have practice last an hour longer if possible. I would give them a shorter Friday if possible so they can still enjoy that and not burn out. Regardless, its a lot of time to be in a school building, and these are kids, not pro's. Only so much time before negative returns set in.
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Post by powerdog on May 12, 2009 8:34:00 GMT -6
Jenks Olka doesnt even do two a days from what I read. One of best programs in the country but they do go about 4 hours straight. but that counts the athletic period |
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Post by coachwilley on May 12, 2009 11:42:58 GMT -6
We used to go 7 to noon with a 45 minute break for 2-a-days. Last season school started the same day as practice could start. We went 6-7:45am and regular practice after school. It worked out fine. We did this until Thursday of the second week. That Thursday we put in our pregame and then had a simulated game with regular season times on friday for our scrimmage. It worked out fine.
I'm sure your district had a lot to think about when scheduling the first day of school besides how it would effect your practices...
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Post by senatorblutarsky on May 12, 2009 12:06:37 GMT -6
Jenks Olka doesnt even do two a days from what I read. One of best programs in the country but they do go about 4 hours straight.
I believe in the 4 hours straight as well. I am going to try and convince our HC to do it.
That's what we do...it's what we have done for 15 years or so. We draw from 40 miles away- 2 a days do not make sense for us.
I like the 4 hr. pre-season practice better. We take a 20-30 min. break in there, take pads off, have popsicles, gatorade, etc.
Some years we start school a week after football- some years we've actually started school before football practice started... (This coming year, we start 2 weeks after FB, but we'll keep the same schedule)
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coachy
Sophomore Member
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Post by coachy on May 12, 2009 12:17:13 GMT -6
A lot of okla schools do the 4 hour practice...the last time I was apart of an actual 2-A day was in middle school
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coachy
Sophomore Member
Posts: 219
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Post by coachy on May 12, 2009 12:19:28 GMT -6
go to a three-a-day that first week...you can make up some time that a way
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Post by lsrood on May 13, 2009 6:33:49 GMT -6
Wingtol,
We are having a similar problem as Monday thru Wednesday of the that second week are the in-service days for teachers and I will lose half my staff. In addition the first day for the students is Thursday. Here's what we are planning on doing: 3 a days the first week of August 17th Monday thru Thursday, then a single practice on Friday and scrimmage on Saturday. Week 2 we are going to have a regular after school practice on Monday thru Wednesday followed by dinner provided by our boosters and a second practice under the lights from 7-9 PM. This will only impact their school day on Thursday the first day. Then we'll have a regular after school day practice on Thursday and we have a night scrimmage on Friday.
Also, I moved to a different, smaller Class A school so we will be close to a 1 platoon team just because of numbers and the extra work we'll get from the 3 a days will hopefully make up for what we lose that second week.
And PA definitely needs to re-examine its start dates and the notion that we just pad up and go at it. There should be an earlier start date and some time in just helmets & shorts prior to padding up and going full tilt. With school starting earlier and school districts adding more in-service dates for teachers, the athletes are being shortchanged and a potential safety issue is just around the corner. All it is going to take is a major injury and some lawsuit happy parents to make it happen.
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nexthc
Junior Member
"The Golden Rule"
Posts: 439
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Post by nexthc on May 13, 2009 8:48:06 GMT -6
We have one two-a-day this year!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2009 11:45:55 GMT -6
I've never been in a situation without any two-a-days but only having three has been more rule than exception in the programs I've been with. We normally have two-a-days Weds, Thurs, and Friday. A Wednesday is always the first day of practice in IL. We do a longer (three hour or so) practice on Saturday which is also the first day full pads are allowed. Then, in most cases, the first day of school is that next Monday and we don't two-a-day during school.
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