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Post by davecisar on Apr 23, 2009 12:18:53 GMT -6
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Post by fbdoc on Apr 23, 2009 12:27:07 GMT -6
I wish him well but, does anyone want to bet that we're never gonna hear about this kid again?
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Post by touchdownmaker on Apr 23, 2009 12:33:36 GMT -6
Youll hear about him when he rolls his ankle or blows out a knee and his NBA career goes up in smoke. No education, No NBA.
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lgoody
Freshmen Member
Posts: 84
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Post by lgoody on Apr 23, 2009 13:43:42 GMT -6
This kid wouldn't get an education even if he didn't go pro. He might get a diploma, not an education.
I think its a wise decision; if you read what the kid thinks about it and how he's approaching it, it seems like he's doing it for the right reasons.
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Post by airman on Apr 23, 2009 17:37:54 GMT -6
This is very common in Hockey. Infact the best hockey players often do not play high school hockey because they are limited by the number of games they can play.
IN my high school our 3 best volleyball players do not play on the high school team. they play on a traveling team.
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Post by bulldogoption on Apr 23, 2009 19:38:28 GMT -6
All the ADULTS in this kid's life strike me like this...............  |
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Post by davecisar on Apr 23, 2009 19:39:34 GMT -6
The great hockey kids here play in the best Juniors League in the country and they are all attending HS or college and living with local families.
From there they either get taken by the NHL or a college scholarship. 90+% end up going to college.
In Nebraska all the best HS players play HS volleyball because the coaching here is very good and then the best ones play select club ball offseason and travel the country.
Guess it depends on where you live
BUT the local Junior Hockey team is full of kids from Minnesota, Ohio, Wisconsin, MI etc
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Post by coachbdud on Apr 23, 2009 21:51:09 GMT -6
this is the smartest thing for him to do really. He is so freakishly better than kids his age, there really is no point to him playing his senior year... NBA scouts say he is NBA ready right now, and they have that stupid 1 year out of HS rule in the NBA, so he might as well challenge himself, get better in Europe, make a lil money while he is doing it then come back and get drafted No1 overall in 2 years
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Post by davecisar on Apr 24, 2009 3:23:01 GMT -6
IMHO there is value in the college experience for all that attend The relationships and "growing up" in an environment of like aged and level of maurity peers is important Tons of $$$ and on the road with adults when your'e still a kid is a recipe for disaster It's a free country I guess 17 and doing this all, whats next, 16, 15? Not so far fetched if the logic still holds He wont be able to add or subtract or know any of the countries he's playing in, but I guess he can pay someone to do that for him  But cetainly not any of those following in his footsteps, they wont have an education. |
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lgoody
Freshmen Member
Posts: 84
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Post by lgoody on Apr 24, 2009 8:47:18 GMT -6
Tons of $$$ and on the road with adults when your'e still a kid is a recipe for disaster
It's a free country I guess
17 and doing this all, whats next, 16, 15? Not so far fetched if the logic still holds
He wont be able to add or subtract or know any of the countries he's playing in, but I guess he can pay someone to do that for him
But cetainly not any of those following in his footsteps, they wont have an education. Again, we're making the assumption he'd get an education in college. A lot of these kids that know they're going to be NBA talent, make the required 3 D's to stay eligible for the semester's they'll be there, and then they try and bounce. The NBA raising the age requirement was nothing more then throwing the NCAA cartel a bone. The kids doing the right thing, because his career is CLEARLY in basketball. If you walked up to a college kid tomorrow, and offered them 5-6 years of making 3-4 million dollars a year if they dropped out of school before the week, there may be a kid or two that doesn't jump on it. That's because they're already loaded, and they're just chillin' anyway. He wouldn't have an education at a University; at best, he'd earn a diploma. The kid is making money, and trying to improve his game so he'll be more preared to go to the NBA then a lot of the kids his age. |
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Post by ajreaper on Apr 24, 2009 8:57:06 GMT -6
IMHO there is value in the college experience for all that attend The relationships and "growing up" in an environment of like aged and level of maurity peers is important Tons of $$$ and on the road with adults when your'e still a kid is a recipe for disaster It's a free country I guess 17 and doing this all, whats next, 16, 15? Not so far fetched if the logic still holds He wont be able to add or subtract or know any of the countries he's playing in, but I guess he can pay someone to do that for him But cetainly not any of those following in his footsteps, they wont have an education. Dave- I agree 100% with your position. His best chance is if he is matched with an individual who can mentor and guide him on this path and it needs to be someone who's not just interested in being one of his posse but who's also willing to call him out and who can both model and demand a high standard of conduct/professionalism from him. |
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Post by fsuncensored on Apr 24, 2009 13:02:09 GMT -6
Most of the European stars now in the NBA played pro ball since 15.
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Post by coachd5085 on Apr 25, 2009 8:11:01 GMT -6
Do we have any evidence that the kid hasn't already received an education. This has been happening for years in the entertainment and sports industries...well, the "WHITE" upper socioeconomic sports such as tennis/golf etc, along with the entertainment industry.
This isn't a 9 year old saying he doesn't want to go to school. The hardwiring is mostly done. Education can't be FORCED on someone of this age. He either values it, or doesn't. He is a junior in high school. If he can't add or subtract or read or write at this point, what value would his senior year have? If he can...then what is wrong with the decision?
If he has a strong support system, and his family lifestyle is solid, why not start a profession that pays well above average wages that he enjoys and seems well suited for? If his family is WEAK, the lifestyle iffy, if he looks like someone easily led astray....well just look at the "gangs" thread and then tell me why it isn't a good idea to get him out of that environment?
What I do find interesting is the quick judgment of so many (here and on the respective news paper's websites). So quick for everyone to say "he should have done 'just like me' and gone to school" even though so few of those commenting are "just like him"
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Post by bigdog2003 on Apr 25, 2009 8:33:43 GMT -6
Lebron James was better than everyone in his age group at 14, should he have left school? I don't agree with him leaving early, and I support more than the one year in college rule for the NBA. These kids may be physically ready for the pro level, but many times they aren't mentally. I also think that every player that goes pro should have to take finacial management classes before they get there. This way they can check what their people are doing with the money. What happens to these players if they get hurt, and have the MC Hammer mentality and the money is gone? What kind of job can you get these days if you are a high school dropout? I'm not just talking about this kid but others. There was a boy from SC when the NBA didn't have the one year of college rule that everyone talked into entering the draft and getting an agent. He was good, but at 18, he wasn't NBA good. His family and friends saw money and talked him into it. He now works at Foot Locker selling Nikes. It's sad that a lot of times the parents and friends talk the players into doing something they shouldn't do.
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zbessac
Sophomore Member
Posts: 149
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Post by zbessac on Apr 25, 2009 8:38:33 GMT -6
WHERE ARE THE PARENTS?  I am amazed how little importance people and parents put on education. I am sad for this young man the he will not experience his senior yearin HS and atleast a portion of college. |
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Post by dubber on Apr 25, 2009 12:31:38 GMT -6
He is old enough make his own decisions regarding schooling and career.
Here is what I fear.
For every KG, Lebron, and Kobe, there are DOZENS of HS to Pro guys you never hear from again.
If there is an influx of kids who are being told they are better than they really are, they will end up out of pro basketball and WITHOUT a HS diploma.
It's like watching your big brother jump his bike off a home made ramp and thinking "Hey, I can do it too".
This kid seems like he is in KG and Co.'s class............I just worry about the dozen other kids who will try to follow him.
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Post by coachinghopeful on Apr 26, 2009 22:58:48 GMT -6
I think it's a bad decision, just because if the pro ball career doesn't work out for him, he won't even have a HS diploma. What's he supposed to do then? Also, I don't know if the Spanish pro league will prepare him better for the NBA than a year at a major college program will, even if that "1 year rule" is a joke to prop up college basketball's bottom line. After seeing so many touted HS to NBA players crash and burn when they got money at an early age with adult supervision, I hope he doesn't become a "where are they now?" question in a few years.
Now, aside from that, I have to say that I understand his decision. He's 17, doesn't give a crap about school, and at least he's being honest in admitting that. He sees this as a chance to make some money and have some fun in Europe for a couple of years. Perfectly understandable, and if he doesn't value education now, I can't see him really learning much in his senior year of HS or in college that would be good for his future.
Hell, one of the finest Basketball players in my college's history GRADUATED COLLEGE WITHOUT BEING ABLE TO READ OR WRITE AT ALL. You can't say he got much from his college, or even his HS, experience besides sports. God knows what he does now. I just know he still lives in this area and plays a lot of rec. league hoops after a journeyman career in Europe.
This isn't like a talented kid opting to play in a club league instead of on the HS team. This kid is dropping out of HS. That's a big decision. I guess he can always get his GED and head to college later in life when he decides what else he wants to do-- I know a few people who did that and turned out ok-- but it's not the ideal way to go. I also don't like the precedent this sets.
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Post by bobgoodman on Apr 27, 2009 0:02:01 GMT -6
IMHO there is value in the college experience for all that attend As a college teacher I saw that wasn't true. College is an amazing racket. True of schools in general to some degree, but especially colleges. |
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Post by davecisar on Apr 27, 2009 6:11:42 GMT -6
My comment had to do with much more than the "school" part of college
The peer interactions, the peer relationships, the self discipline required, the academic setting, working with outstanding well motivated instructors ( most classes) and motivated students ( most cases) learning different points of view in a setting that encourages free thought and rigorous debate/research etc
College is much more than the actual classes was my point
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Post by kelcoach on Apr 27, 2009 12:34:30 GMT -6
Just my two cents, but I think the kid is making a good decision, especially if it is Spain, where they have minor league type teams for their professional leagues. I think too many of us project our personal situation into this kid's decision. I am personally of the belief that if you want or value education, then going pro early shouldn't stop you from getting an education. Who's to say the kid won't blow his knee out in college. Those scholarships are 1-year renewable contracts, they are not 4 or 5 year guarantees. The contract does not have to be renewed. Same thing if he goes pro, if he blows his knee out, at least he gets potential cash out of the deal. Guess what, he can still go to college off his own dime! Most of us aren't scholarship athletes nor academic scholarship receivers. I paid my own way through college and I am sure a lot of you did, and so can this kid - if he values education. If he doesn't value the education and the experience that comes along with it, then he should go to work and earn a living. He'll get to travel overseas and get a cultural education that somehow translates in life. I don't think we should rag this kid for his decision, especially if it was sincerely made.
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Post by bobgoodman on Apr 27, 2009 17:30:23 GMT -6
My comment had to do with much more than the "school" part of college The peer interactions, the peer relationships, the self discipline required, the academic setting, working with outstanding well motivated instructors ( most classes) and motivated students ( most cases) learning different points of view in a setting that encourages free thought and rigorous debate/research etc College is much more than the actual classes was my point But that assumes a certain type of "college experience", and there isn't one. Some go away to college; some commute. Some college settings do encourage different POV, free thought, etc., and some positively stifle it! My students were mostly adults well above what you'd consider your usual "college age". And you also seem to assume the college experience is very different from what may be obtained outside it, which may not be true. What about the experience of living in a foreign country where they speak a different language? What about the experience of learning the operation of a certain business first hand? |
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Post by charger109 on Apr 28, 2009 13:32:40 GMT -6
To be a pro athlete in any sport, I think you should AT LEAST have to finish H.S.
This will start to become an escape for H.S. kids who have no grades to go play collge, no matter how good they are and go make money over seas.
He may just not have the grades or was not a good student and was like 'Hey, I will go make money playing pro overseas, because I can't get into college with my grade'
Sad situation.
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Post by tye2021 on Apr 28, 2009 15:57:04 GMT -6
I will never be for a kid dropping out of school even if he is the next great whatever!
Lebron James and KG are the only 2 highschool players to make an immediate impact in the NBA their rookie season. The rest including Kobe Bryant (arguabley the best in the game right now) came off the bench for 2 or 3 years before making any serious impact for their teams. Thats time they could have spent in college playing and developing into real basketball players.
Most of them are just great athletes that can dunk. Scouts mouthes start to water when they see these kids jumping out of the gym. And they enter the NBA without any real knowledge about how to play BASKETBALL. Yeah, they can jump higher than any other highschool student, most of them are taller than than the other kids anyway. But how will they perform against other college kids that were far better than the highschool students they played against?
I stopped watching pro ball when they started drafting these kids. I got tired of watching teams go up and down the court for 3-5 minutes without being able to hit a jump shot. I got tired of watching kids drive the lane without meeting any resistance because they didn't want to play defense. If they couldn't dunk they were useless. These are things they could have improved on in college. And who knows, maybe just maybe 1 or 2 of them will get and education along the way.
Just my .02
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lgoody
Freshmen Member
Posts: 84
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Post by lgoody on Apr 28, 2009 16:01:00 GMT -6
In some ways, it COULD be a sad situation. The fault lies inherently with the NCAA, not the kid himself. They're making money off him. Why let your talents be exploited when you can seize the initiative yourself?
The kid is going to get his GED. His "education" in college would have been practically non-existent anyway. In the Div. 1 level, especially with Mens basketball (and to a somewhat lesser extent, Football) you have 4-5 guys that spend a few years "staying" eligible, in the hopes they'll one day be pros. I've had B-ball players in numerous classes in the last two years. I see them about 4 times--the first day of class, two quizzes or two tests during the year, and then at the final. Depending on who it is, can you blame them?
Ty Lawson knew he was going to make money being a basketball player once he got to college. He didn't, and doesn't give a rats ass about going to "insert class here" 215, and he doesn't give a dang that there's going to be a final in any of his classes in a week since he is headed to the NBA now. The NCAA allows this to happen, because they make money.
The NCAA will continue to do *just enough* to give the pretense of academic integrity. They'll wait a year or two, and slap Memphis with sanctions. God knows they wouldn't do it while Calipari was there though.
That might take away from the bottom line.
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Post by bobgoodman on Apr 28, 2009 20:39:55 GMT -6
In the Div. 1 level, especially with Mens basketball (and to a somewhat lesser extent, Football) you have 4-5 guys that spend a few years "staying" eligible, in the hopes they'll one day be pros. I've had B-ball players in numerous classes in the last two years. I see them about 4 times--the first day of class, two quizzes or two tests during the year, and then at the final. That was more than the basketball players who were my students in Evolution. First class I was just breaking the ice with students and it came out they were on the varsity (men's & women's), and I wondered whether my course or section had gotten a rep as a jock's course. They said they might need time off and I expressed support and said they should talk to me about making arrangements, but they never did talk to me or make arrangements, they just never showed up for another class. Then they tried to take the final exam (or maybe turn in a term paper) and I wouldn't let them -- the dept. had an attendance requirement. Maybe they thought that because I was interested in sports (at a school not known for them) they'd get a free pass. |
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Post by adw30 on Apr 28, 2009 22:55:15 GMT -6
This is a good move on this young man's part. As someone stated previously there's little to no outcry when teenagers in other sports such as tennis and golf do this or when teenage pop stars like the Jonas Brothers or Miley Cyrus do silmilar things.
He's going to be paid a six figure income for the next two years to train at his future profession which is the NBA. He's a projected future lottery pick people! He's not some scrub or even a marginal player. So what if he's never heard from again by the American sports fan, the worst case for him is he has six figures in his bank account and he can pay to go to college anywhere his heart desires.
The outcry is there because fans of whatever college team are upset he's not coming to their school to play ball. Yet those same fans could care less about the tennis player or the golf player going pro mostly because they could care less about the tennis and golf teams at their university.
Since 1995 when guys were allowed to go straight to the NBA from high school, EVERY SINGLE PROJECTED LOTTERY PICK who came straight out of high school is currently in the NBA except for one (Jonathan Bender). He played 6 seasons before retiring because of chronic knee pain and cleared over $30 million in his playing career.
Kevin Garnett, Kobe Bryant, Tracy McGrarady, Amare Stoudamire, Jermaine Oneal, Dwight Howeard, Andrew Bynum, Lebron James, Kwame Brown, Eddie Curry, Tyson Chandler, Kendrick Perkins, Al Harringtong, RaShard Lewis, Darius Miles, and Shaun Livingston were all projected lottery picks coming out of high school just as this young man is. These young men have a window of opportunity to make more money than most of us combined in our lifetime. After their playing careers are over they have the rest of their lives to go to college if they so choose.
The people who are involved in talent evaluations of this type are spot on with their projections more often than not. For his future he needs to to to Europe and prepare and train against the best competition rather than some overmatched high school kid who is barely over six feet tall.
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Post by coachdawhip on Apr 29, 2009 21:31:58 GMT -6
Where was everyone when all the tennis and golf kids went pro before 18? Or what about gymnastics?
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Post by kelcoach on Apr 30, 2009 7:05:53 GMT -6
I will never be for a kid dropping out of school even if he is the next great whatever! Tye2021, I'm not a fan of a kid dropping out either, but how many kids are home schooled in this country. How many actors and athletes participate in home school/tutor programs (Tim Tebow comes to mind)? If this kid's parents want him to get an education, then he probably will. There are enough avenues for a kid to get an education without sitting in a traditional classroom. If my child was the next great thing in some sport/activity, then I might let them leave a normal schooling situation to pursue that opportunity. A person can always go back to school. There are also many non-traditional college students these days. I was one of them. I was in classes with some 50+ and 60+ year olds who were in college. If you want an education, you can get one. |
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I am amazed how little importance people and parents put on education. I am sad for this young man the he will not experience his senior yearin HS and atleast a portion of college. 
