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Post by Deleted on Feb 14, 2009 9:58:52 GMT -6
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Post by CoachA21 on Feb 14, 2009 20:09:24 GMT -6
I actually do hope that he gets back into the NFL. I think that he learned from his mistakes and will bounce back.
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Post by mariner42 on Feb 15, 2009 1:54:29 GMT -6
Just as long as the Niners stay the hell away. We need a QB, but not that bad.
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Post by airraider on Feb 15, 2009 5:46:48 GMT -6
Just as long as the Niners stay the hell away. We need a QB, but not that bad. lol.. you beat me to it.. |
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Post by touchdownmaker on Feb 15, 2009 6:51:44 GMT -6
I actually do hope that he gets back into the NFL. I think that he learned from his mistakes and will bounce back. you mean he had to get caught before he realized he was doing something illegal and immoral? gimme a break. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2009 9:22:02 GMT -6
I actually do hope that he gets back into the NFL. I think that he learned from his mistakes and will bounce back. you mean he had to get caught before he realized he was doing something illegal and immoral? gimme a break. Oh you didn't hear...It wasn't his fault..that's the way he was brought up accrding to Whoopi Goldberg. Despite the fact he made HUNDREDS of millions of dollars, he shouldn't be criticized because it was his environment. Animal cruelty is an accepted practice, in poor communities...and oh yeah Serial Killer culture...What an A$$hole |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2009 9:23:22 GMT -6
I actually do hope that he gets back into the NFL. I think that he learned from his mistakes and will bounce back. Yeah he'll hide the dogs better next time. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2009 9:23:23 GMT -6
I actually do hope that he gets back into the NFL. I think that he learned from his mistakes and will bounce back. |
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Post by coachdawhip on Feb 15, 2009 18:58:34 GMT -6
If I was an owner and needed a QB. I would sign him, I believe he he still will be an effective QB. I don't know about trading for him though
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2009 19:20:51 GMT -6
If I was an owner and needed a QB. I would sign him, I believe he he still will be an effective QB. I don't know about trading for him though To be honest I don't know if I'd take the risk. As an owner I 'm not sure I want my team drowning in negative publicity |
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Post by khalfie on Feb 15, 2009 19:27:22 GMT -6
I'd take him in a minute... We have deer killers, fox hunters, and duck murderers playing QB, RB, and OLine... I'm supposed to be condemn Mike forever, because his animal of cruelty was dogs?  Hope he finds his way to Chicago. |
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Post by phantom on Feb 15, 2009 20:07:39 GMT -6
So when exactl will he have paid his dues enough to come back?
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Post by khalfie on Feb 15, 2009 21:31:37 GMT -6
Because, as you obviously know, hunting is the exact same as torturing a pet to death That's how serial killers start. Wouldn't touch Vick with a 100 foot pole, unless it was to beat some {censored} sense into his demented head. Hill Larry Us! Let me see if I undersand you correctly... Dressing up in camouflage (sp?), with deer urine on... so that Bambi comes close enough so that you can shoot her with your high powered rifle, then cut her throat with your Bowie knife, isn't torture, but being sporting... How about the guy, on his boat, with his high powered fishing equipment, that uses a lure to drive a hook through the fishes mouth, and as the poor fish, struggles and swims for its life... you toy with its last moments of life... giving the fish a little thread, reeling him in, letting him go... til he tires, and is fried with some butter, batter and beer. How about the guy with the shotgun, that uses the duck whistle, to get the ducks to come close, shoot them, and while the duck lays their bleeding and dying to death, send his dog to crush the duck between his teeth as he retrieves said sporting participant... Un huh... lets just call it what it is... people like dogs, so there are laws protecting them... fine... he broke that law, did his time, let the man play football. I think if Mike would have ate the dogs, people wouldn't have said a word. Serial killer? Really? Just say anything... huh? |
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Post by eickst on Feb 15, 2009 21:44:43 GMT -6
Could you imagine if instead of dogs it was an illegal panda fighting ring? Oh man he would have been strapped to the table and injected with liquid death.
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Post by khalfie on Feb 15, 2009 21:49:02 GMT -6
Could you imagine if instead of dogs it was an illegal panda fighting ring? Oh man he would have been strapped to the table and injected with liquid death. Hill Larry... Now that there is funny!  |
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Post by fort on Feb 15, 2009 21:50:32 GMT -6
Because, as you obviously know, hunting is the exact same as torturing a pet to death That's how serial killers start. Wouldn't touch Vick with a 100 foot pole, unless it was to beat some {censored} sense into his demented head. Hill Larry Us! Let me see if I undersand you correctly... Dressing up in camouflage (sp?), with deer urine on... so that Bambi comes close enough so that you can shoot her with your high powered rifle, then cut her throat with your Bowie knife, isn't torture, but being sporting... How about the guy, on his boat, with his high powered fishing equipment, that uses a lure to drive a hook through the fishes mouth, and as the poor fish, struggles and swims for its life... you toy with its last moments of life... giving the fish a little thread, reeling him in, letting him go... til he tires, and is fried with some butter, batter and beer. How about the guy with the shotgun, that uses the duck whistle, to get the ducks to come close, shoot them, and while the duck lays their bleeding and dying to death, send his dog to crush the duck between his teeth as he retrieves said sporting participant... Un huh... lets just call it what it is... people like dogs, so there are laws protecting them... fine... he broke that law, did his time, let the man play football. I think if Mike would have ate the dogs, people wouldn't have said a word. Serial killer? Really? Just say anything... huh? I hate even the thought of hunting; it disturbs me, but I won't get into that. What he did was of a deranged mind. It is going to be an absolute PR nightmare for anyone who takes a chance on him. A lot of teams are in an economic pinch (layoffs, new stadium financing, etc); he can't be a positive for them. Completely outside of the fact that he's a psycho, he's been out of football for a while now, wasn't a great QB to begin with, and comes with a $9.5 million base salary and a $6 million bonus due. You can't trade for this guy. They'll have to cut him loose and someone will sign him for the vet minimum and the nightmares that follow. |
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Post by outlawjoseywales on Feb 15, 2009 21:54:43 GMT -6
Hold it, are you telling me it's illegal to shoot cats?  OMG, why didn't anybody tell us. OJW |
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Post by los on Feb 15, 2009 22:12:50 GMT -6
In some cultures "fighting animals" and betting on the outcome, is pretty normal behavior......co- ck fighting.....dog fighting....ram head butting contests.....bull fighting(man vs animal)......just not legal or socially acceptable in our main stream American society.....One of my buddys who trains and hunts with birddogs once told me, after I asked him what they do with all the dogs, when they get too old, sick, crippled up or just aren't very good(had a fairly large kennel)......well, he didn't get into the specific details......but more or less said...."well, we aren't gonna keep feeding them"......sounds like some hunting dogs getting snuffed to me? I agree with Khalfie = eat more dog.....then you'll be a guest on bizarre foods....not in prison.....The guy paid for his mistake.....now he can go back to his normal life(if the extremists will let him) = thats playing football!
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Post by phantom on Feb 15, 2009 22:32:20 GMT -6
In some cultures "fighting animals" and betting on the outcome, is pretty normal behavior......co- ck fighting.....dog fighting....ram head butting contests.....bull fighting(man vs animal)......just not legal or socially acceptable in our main stream American society.....One of my buddys who trains and hunts with birddogs once told me, after I asked him what they do with all the dogs, when they get too old, sick, crippled up or just aren't very good(had a fairly large kennel)......well, he didn't get into the specific details......but more or less said...."well, we aren't gonna keep feeding them"......sounds like some hunting dogs getting snuffed to me? I agree with Khalfie = eat more dog.....then you'll be a guest on bizarre foods....not in prison.....The guy paid for his mistake.....now he can go back to his normal life(if the extremists will let him) = thats playing football! I have no use for dogfighting. The guy did prison time, though, and deserves another chance. |
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Post by 19delta on Feb 15, 2009 23:30:32 GMT -6
Once the guy gets out, he still has to petition for reinstatement. Even though he is out of prison, it will be up to the commish if he gets a chance to play again.
He did a really bad thing, no doubt. But when you consider that guys who have gotten all sorts of second chances after beating up women, getting DUIs, "making it rain", killing a guy at the Super Bowl...if those guys all got second chances, I think Vick deserves one, too.
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Post by tye2021 on Feb 16, 2009 0:07:50 GMT -6
A Serial killer starts killing animals as kid not a 20 something year old adult! So please stop making dumb claims!
If you grow up in an area where murder happens on a daily basis you become desensitized to it. It doesn't bother you as much as it would if you grew up in an area where murder was a rarity. This dog fighting thing is similar to that. I'm not making excuses for the man. Just saying there is some validity to the argument of growing up in a culture where this kind of behavior maybe seen as normal. Its easy to judge a person life from your front porch but it becomes more difficult to do so after you have seen it from theirs.
I love dogs. I HAD TO HAVE my dog put down that same year, and I can't begin to tell you how upset I was to find out what Vick was doing. Some of the emotion I was feeling could have been because I just lost my 13 year old dog. I still have the last raw hide we bought him. It was the first one he actually found a descent hiding place for. I don't agree with dog fighting, c--k fighting, or anything else. But I do believe in second chances. I believe when a man pays his debt to society he has the right granted to him by this country to work in the field in which his is trained.
A reminder:
You have a man in the NFL right now that killed a woman in a car crash because he was driving drunk. NOT HIS FIRST DUI. Where is the outrage for that. Some of you probably cheer for him every Sunday w/o a thought about him only spending 90 days in jail and 1000 hours of community service for death of this woman.
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Post by touchdownmaker on Feb 16, 2009 4:34:31 GMT -6
Man, after reading this I completely understand why some of you dudes irritate the heck out of me. many of us have completely different values and our views of what is acceptable behavior and what is not can be completely different. I think its amazing that some of us are permitted to work with kids. wow. maybe we should stick to football.
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Post by coachdawhip on Feb 16, 2009 7:57:58 GMT -6
Man, after reading this I completely understand why some of you dudes irritate the heck out of me. many of us have completely different values and our views of what is acceptable behavior and what is not can be completely different. I think its amazing that some of us are permitted to work with kids. wow. maybe we should stick to football. Ummm. He broke the law and has paid his debt to society. Let he who has no sin throw the first stone. I'm passing one to you. He should be forgiven, however we should not forget. That is the lesson I teach my kids. |
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Post by brophy on Feb 16, 2009 8:27:51 GMT -6
wow......no one has even touched on his (lack of) ability as a quarterback in this thread.
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Post by khalfie on Feb 16, 2009 9:29:58 GMT -6
wow......no one has even touched on his (lack of) ability as a quarterback in this thread. Probably because that's like the biggest myth in the NFL... Mike Vick not being a good QB is about the same as their being a big foot or a lochness monster. He may not have been the best QB... but he's never been the worst... And if the monichar of success are victories... there should be several teams vying for his services. |
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Post by tye2021 on Feb 16, 2009 9:54:33 GMT -6
Man, after reading this I completely understand why some of you dudes irritate the heck out of me. many of us have completely different values and our views of what is acceptable behavior and what is not can be completely different. I think its amazing that some of us are permitted to work with kids. wow. maybe we should stick to football. No one is saying his behavior is ecceptable! At least I'm not. What he and the guys around him did was deplorable. And it deserved the outrage felt by most. I'm not a fan of Michael Vick the PERSON. I have no love for anyone that could do what he did to an animal that trust you in away that no other animal other than another human could. No matter how vicious a dog is toward other dogs or people on the outside of its "pack", it still wants to please its owner more than anything else. And Vick and his crew betrayed those animals in the worst way. And seriously how could you be a fan of a man that speaks of himself in the 3rd person.  What I am saying is that he committed a crime.... he was punished for said crime....whether you think the punishment fit the crime is irrelevent. He has the RIGHT to work. I don't think he was that good of a QB. But a good football player who I believe will have better success as a WR. IF he makes it back into the league. |
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Post by phantom on Feb 16, 2009 9:55:01 GMT -6
wow......no one has even touched on his (lack of) ability as a quarterback in this thread. OK lets do that. He has the physical tools although he may be an inch shorter than ideal. He's also not a dumb guy. His problem has been decision making. Maybe this experience will help him mature and he'll be a smarter player. Maybe he'll end up a better player than he was before he went to jail. Would I pay him nine million dollars? Hell, no. I don't have nine million dollars. If I was running a team and needed a QB I'd see if I could get Vick at the right price. |
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Post by coachdawhip on Feb 16, 2009 10:09:54 GMT -6
wow......no one has even touched on his (lack of) ability as a quarterback in this thread. What is his winning % again as a QB? |
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Post by phantom on Feb 16, 2009 10:20:30 GMT -6
wow......no one has even touched on his (lack of) ability as a quarterback in this thread. What is his winning % again as a QB? 35-28. 56%. |
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Post by brophy on Feb 16, 2009 10:30:33 GMT -6
You have a couple of dynamics at work here.
1. Unquestionable athletic skills as a 'playmaker' - problem is, he's now out of the game 2+ years, in a unspectacular 'training environment', and pushing the wrong side of 30. Even Deion Sanders had met the kryptonite of AGE. EVERY year, a new improved playmaker prototype is established - bigger, faster, stronger (meaning, wait your turn in the draft, you'll find one).
2. Questionable throwing mechanics - inconsistent delivery and, what we've seen up to this point, a lack of desire to improve in that department (see Vince Young). Mr. Vick severely benefited from a dominating Alex Gibbs run game and was a killer on boot-action. If you watched enough Falcon games, you might be able to attest to the hot-and-cold streaks the quarterback postion experienced for no apparent reason (inconsistent delivery).
3. Questionable decision making skills - coupled with #2, this is a "coach-killer" combination for a quarterback. Mr.Vick isn't stupid in any regard, but reliance on physical tools over mechanics and settling for 3rd & 2 rather than a TD (or INT) has hindered his performance in being able to manage a (passing) game consistently.
I wish nothing but the best for Mr.Vick, and I have no concept of what it takes to succeed at the NFL franchise level, but from where I sit, I don't see the upside of this investment, that will reshape your fan base, team chemistry, and coaching staff
With regards to Mr Vick as an "undesirable" returning to the league, what is to be made of Adam Jones?
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