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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2008 10:58:23 GMT -6
(LONG POST ALERT SORRY)
Our HC had to cancell, our pre-season game last Friday because we didn't have enough kids to field a team. I'm becoming increasingly alarmed that the rumor about his reputation that drives kids away, may be true. Now I know for a fact that 2 of my old players left the team because of this, 1 returned to our organization after winning a championship with another team..
However, there's another situation that is also driving us (particularly me) nuts. The HC (my old team) of the team in the weight class below us is refusing to allow his son to move up, although due to his weight, and our policy, is supposed to. He is the star on their team, and I've heard thorugh the rumor mill that he doesn't want his kid under our HC, even if I'm coaching.
He has had that kid practice in August heat in a sauna suit, to try to get him down, last week we were advised by our administrators that he was weighed, he is too heavy to play down on our younger team, and would have to move up.
This week I hear that my old OC (still on their team) weighed him, with NO witnesses, to it, and claims hat he is within the acceptable weight range set forth by the rules.
What bothers me is that they accepted that, but I know for a fact he is lying, because I weighed him myself 9 pounds over. We are ripping our hair out, trying to find kids, we cant even field a team, and some A hole is hoarding kids, because, he either wants to win a championship, or doesn't like the coach.....and our admins. are allowing it.
Anyway, he told me that he is planning on a losing season ( I told him I'm not) and he wouldn't take it as a slap in the face if I decided to leave, he said "When you were head coach, kids came here to play for you, they came from across the city, parents wanted their kids to play for you. Kids leave rather than play for me, even if kids want to play here, their parents, don't let them, you don't deserve to deal with that bullsh!t, you are one of the best coaches that ever came through this organization, you can move on if you want, I woundn't blame you"
What we get, is kids who never played before, we get those kids who are looking for anyteam hard up enough so they can be a star, and we get a few athletes. Kids don't like what they see, a cant' be a star..they dissappear.
Now I'm not going to leave, I'm no quitter, but i wonder is this what our organization has become, that one coach's word is more than another, when it's already been proven untrue..
I wonder maybe I should've (or should still) move on, maybe that offer was some kind of sign
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Post by coachtabales on Aug 27, 2008 12:13:34 GMT -6
Perhaps it wouldn't be a bad thing to call it like it is in front of everybody. To the other coach, "Your a liar", to the admins, "You are all cowards for allowing this". To the head coach, "You are killing this team and organization", and do it all in one room where there is a clear understanding on how you feel. You can do this and still be diplomatic, but you're running out time. You put the ball in thier court and let them respond, then make a decision. At least let them respond to the insults. Better than bottling it up inside and just "dealing" with it. Don't forget to thank the Academy though. They are sensitive.  |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2008 13:48:22 GMT -6
I had it out with my old OC, last week, he say's that no what, it's parent's prerogative as to where (and whether) his kid plays, as long as he CAN make weight. But the problem is that he can't, or at least he hasn't. He said that his son will not play for our HC period. But I don't beleive his bullsh!t , he want's the kid to stay, he's hiding behind that parental choice sh!t come on, he's one of the best backs in the league. Hell all I want is 11 kids to coach.
The problem is , he's ABSOLUTELY, right, for whatever reason, the parent has the last say again provided he can make the weight, and isn't over a certain age. I said that then the shouldn't be allowed to play in this organization, I used the nepotism card, but the problem is that my old OC is in tight with the administrators, he's been there for 17 years. He used to send my kids up without even asking me 1st, I would come to practice, and boom, 3 kids (starters no less) gone. But I dealt with it, that was the name of the game, heavy you move up itwas only fair, now he's carrying the torch for this a$$hole. I can only wonder if sending those kids up with out telling me 1st was done intentionally.
Oh yeah thanks to the academy
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Post by coachtabales on Aug 27, 2008 14:22:07 GMT -6
I can't speak for anyone else but myself, but if my organization was going to play favorites due to loyalty and break rules in doing so, then it is time to go. I have seen the rules get bent, sometimes more than it should, but not straight out broken. If the OC can't look at his buddies in the eyes and say "This head coach is an idiot and has to go, or my kid will be breaking rules to stay away from him", then there is something wrong with the system on far too many levels. I can see three major problems already, and that's just what you have mentioned. The rules are in place to protect the kids, and there has to be a rule that says that if a coach has players quitting specifically because of him, then at a minimum, an investigation has to ensue. If you end up with not team then someone is going to have to take responsibility. If they don't, then my friend it's time to move on. What state are you in?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2008 14:56:51 GMT -6
I can't speak for anyone else but myself, but if my organization was going to play favorites due to loyalty and break rules in doing so, then it is time to go. I have seen the rules get bent, sometimes more than it should, but not straight out broken. If the OC can't look at his buddies in the eyes and say "This head coach is an idiot and has to go, or my kid will be breaking rules to stay away from him", then there is something wrong with the system on far too many levels. I can see three major problems already, and that's just what you have mentioned. The rules are in place to protect the kids, and there has to be a rule that says that if a coach has players quitting specifically because of him, then at a minimum, an investigation has to ensue. If you end up with not team then someone is going to have to take responsibility. If they don't, then my friend it's time to move on. What state are you in?[/quot I agree but that benefits them 2 ways...I can't beleive I'm in a war with another coach in our own organization. If we cant field a team, next year we get moved down to the middle league, where we dominated. They 'll dominate too. I think you are right, I'm going to talk to the president of the org, in private, and see what she says. I coach in PA |
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Post by coachdoug on Aug 27, 2008 21:34:48 GMT -6
I gotta agree with coachtabales on this one. If the organization is not even following it's own rules, is allowing kids to stay in the wrong age/weight division, and is protecting a coach that obviously should be let go, well ... I don't see any good coming out of your sticking around.
Loyalty is great, but you shouldn't be loyal to an organization simply because that's where you happened to land. They have to earn your loyalty by treating you right, running the organization properly and good examples to all members of the organization. It doesn't sound like this organization has done any of those things.
It sounds to me like it's definitely time to move on. Also, keep in mind that poorly run organizations are lawsuit magnets. All it takes is one kid to get seriously hurt, and when the attorneys find out that rules weren't being followed, EVERYONE gets sued - you don't want to get caught in the middle of that. Even if you're not found liable for anything it'll cost you $15K - $20K just to defend it. (BTW, that alone is a good reason to join NFHS, which gives you substantial - $1MM or $2MM, i think - general liability insurance.)
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2008 5:29:42 GMT -6
See what gets me is that it's not a poorly run organization, it's one f the best. We're always have at least 1-2 teams make the playoffs, we almost have to stop registration withn 3 weeks of opening it, because we get inundated with kids. Our eputation stands alone, amongst the other teams in the league.
As for the coach, I don't think they are protecting him, like I said he's not bad, just really tough on the kids, calling our "heavies" kids that are slightly over the weight limit "fatties", and things like that. But he's been coaching in our organization for 30 years, which alarms me a little. I told him he needs to drop a few things from his vocabulary when dealing with people's children.
That being said, they are also NOTORIOUSLY unconfrontational, I could tell you a story here that would only piss you off. But they don't like to ruffle fathers...a few years ago, I had a parent accusing me of teaching my kids to injure other players....complete BS, she's a friggin loon, she went on the league web page, and blasted me, they tld me I was not to respond. It wasn't until she started blasting the entire organization that they threatened her with a slander suit ....the crazy b!tch still posts stuff today.
I have a meeting with the coach, and the president Monday We'll see how it goes, I also just emailed the other organization to see if they'd still be interested
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Post by coachdoug on Aug 28, 2008 8:41:09 GMT -6
Well, just because the teams win on the field, does not necessarily mean the administration is doing a good job. In fact, that kind of on-field success makes it easy to make excuses for poor management ("Well, we must be doing something right - we had the best overall record in the conference, so don't us how to do our jobs..."), but it seems pretty obvious that they are not doing things properly. The Board's job is to enforce their organization's rules & policies - if the are non-confrontational they are NOT doing their job.
Likewise, just b/c a coach has been coaching for a long time, does not make him a good coach. If kids are staying away from him to the point where you're having a hard time fielding a team, it's pretty clear that he either needs to change his ways or move on.
Good luck to you coach, you've got yourself in a pretty tough situation there.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2008 9:25:01 GMT -6
Thanks, this may turn out to be an easier decision than I thought, I'm being told he's thinking of taking over the offense, that his "nice"coment was just a hint, another assistant told me this morning
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2008 6:13:23 GMT -6
Well yesterday was quite the revelation, After winning our 1st pre-season game 21-0, we got decimated yesterday,28-0 found out everything I suspected (about the lower team) was correct they are hoarding players.
They had 21 kids on their sideline, with 4-5 kids too heavy to play, the HC's son, their star runningback, didn't make weight either...he's the one, all the controversy is about, the one running around in a sauna suit.
Even worse the kid looks sickly, I'm not the only one who has noticed, like he's about to pass out, from trying to lose weight all the time, I'm actually worried about him. There's nothing to him.
It's so bad parents, other players from our org., and even the opposing coaches were asking why they just don't move kids, especially him, up.
We found out he (the other HC) told his parents deliberately not to move their kids up, he badmouthed us so severely, that parents still don't want to move them up...though our VP found us 2 lids, he told them to stay down no matter what, because thety were going to win a trophy...he got mauled yesterday 30-0. Even a team loaded with talent can't win with idiots at the helm
We had to play half a game with 10 kids, started with 12, so the other team ramped it up on us, OSk when they were up 28 points, 10 man blitz when we were backed up....that earned them a spot on the payback list. We did OK defensively until they found our 1st year kids
we went in with
No starting OT/DE-too heavy 4 lbs
No starting Center/DE-to heavy 1 lb
No staring HB/SAM-MIA no one has seen, nor heard from him since Tuesday, his house is abandoned, of course no working phone#'s-most likely gone for the year
No starting Guard/DT-away on vacation
Starting TE/LB possibly out for the year with what apprears to be a seperated shoulder...didn't want to come out but we made him
Backup Guard possibly, out with a sprained wrist
Had to shuffle players around, to positions, they've never played, within the time frame between the coin toss and the kickoff.
I'm also starting to suspect (police senses tingling) that they are the ones that perpetuated the rumor about his reputation, as we never had this problem till I left
We were told, somehing was going to be done about it...all the while my cell phone was blowing up with the HC of the other team that wanted me to coach for them.....you think that was a sign???
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Post by davecisar on Sept 14, 2008 9:00:41 GMT -6
Those are the type of weight loss problems I think are a travesty, Mid Sept and kids still cant make weight, arent fat and arent moved up. Thank goodness our league weighs once.
Thats why I NEVER tell parents or players what the over/lighter weight is, I dont want anyone starving anyone.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2008 10:52:18 GMT -6
Dave, this guy's insane, I really think something's wrong with him. This kids almost as tall as I am and is walking around looking like Nosferatu. This is crazy...but I guessed that when in 97 degree heat he has the kid in a rubber suit.
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Post by raiderpirates on Sept 15, 2008 8:18:01 GMT -6
Holding someone back to develop an unfair competitive advantage is not going to work in HS when you cannot artificially cultivate such an advantage.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2008 16:45:14 GMT -6
Oh they don't care about High School, almost all our kids go on to do very well..one's starting RB at Syracuse, they learn alot while they are here. There's no doubt the kid (HC 's son) is talented, but we never -or I should say that I never kept kids just to win a ship.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2008 13:18:03 GMT -6
Soap opera continued:
Today the head coach pulls us over and tells us that today is his last day, last week we got destroyed, 25-0 had to fininsh the game with 10 kids, while the team below us, has 8 kids that are overweight. Including their star RB, who is the HC's son.
Their parents won't move them up because the HC told them we didn't stand a chance, this season, and was looking at a championship. He hasn't won a game either
Today, another embarrassment, we lost 28-0, we had to start 4 kids that just came up to our team today. I got to rep them for 30 minutes prior to game. And had to start the new kids because we didn't hve enough.
I was immediately, offered the HC spot but turned it down, then our pres. asked me to take it over next year, again I told him no. an important sidenote here was that last week they wanted me to take over the older kids next season, (the team I always wanted to coach) now they are in a bind, I told them that this is my last season with the org. and would never return as long as the younger teams HC is there.
Starting RB is nowhere to be found again , this was after his father swore he'd be there, then called us 12 minutes before game time to tell us he would't ...I'm just impressed he called.
So now everyone but our backfield are 1st time athletes.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2008 17:03:47 GMT -6
Those are the type of weight loss problems I think are a travesty, Mid Sept and kids still cant make weight, arent fat and arent moved up. Thank goodness our league weighs once. Thats why I NEVER tell parents or players what the over/lighter weight is, I dont want anyone starving anyone. Man what I 'd give to have you running the team under us. |
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Post by davecisar on Sept 21, 2008 21:06:35 GMT -6
Coach,
Under those circumstances 25-0 is quite an accomplishment.
Finish out and do the best you can, the kids are fortunate to have you.
Wise choices you have made.
BEst of luck, you can coach with me anytime.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2008 16:49:38 GMT -6
Dave, I'd be honored, beleive me. I'm looking forward to the end of this season.
The only good thing is that it now puts the younger teams coach on the spot, we can now calll his bluff about not liking our HC, and using that as the basis for not moving his son up. He said he has "personal" issues with him, It'll be interesting to see if he moves him up now he's gone. If he doesn't he'll be exposed, although it's already been confirmed what he's doing
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Post by raiderpirates on Sept 26, 2008 13:39:42 GMT -6
I was glad to have only lost 29-6 last week. We were down 23-0 at halftime and I asked my guys to score first in the second half, aim at outscoring them in the second half past that.
We scored and were trying to make it a two score game for the fourth and we had a turnover. They scored back and we did well to set a goal line stand after a blown punt coverage set them up.
Just have to try and set short goals for them right now and move up by incremental degrees.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2008 19:16:26 GMT -6
I hear you coach, sometimes you just have to hope it'll just hurt a little less. We're WAY beyond that right now..there's so much going on with our team, it almost sounds too much to beleive. Right now we're just making it fun for the kids,
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2008 10:46:15 GMT -6
First off I want to personally thank everyone here who gave me advice this season as how to handle the situation with this team. I repect the hell out of everyone here on this board, and hold every coach in the highest reagrd.
Last night I made a decision, going to the field with full intentions to quit, but when I got there there were no coaches, there, 2 of us are cops and work weird schedules. I asked them to line up on offense, they said which one and there I decided that I was taking over the team as head coach, after the guy who was HC decided he was too tired to go to practice, knowing I was going in for surgery this morning, and he had all the equipment (this is the guy who changed the entire offense on us while I was in Disney) ..the kids deserve better, the assistant coaches deserve better. And I couldn't stand it anymore, we picked as a 40 point underdog this weekend and he doesn't show....bullsh!t
I'll finish out this season, and re-evaluate from there. I spoke to the head coach of the team below us, and found out that he did tell kids not to move up, but only because the HC was bad. Now he say's he'd even send his own son up.
So the stunning conclusion: I'm a head coach again....again thanks for all the advice.
PS sorry if anything's mispelled I'm still a little high from the anestesia
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Post by burtledog on Oct 10, 2008 13:44:23 GMT -6
Coach Kell:
I have kept track of you through this and the new power T board. I thought this may be the best answer for you and the team. I hope you recover well and are back on the practice field in a hurry. Good choice.
In Christ Alone,
Greg (The Amature)
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2008 5:02:16 GMT -6
thanks Greg
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Post by raiderpirates on Oct 11, 2008 21:41:45 GMT -6
Good luck coach. It's a whole new season now. Count like it's week one to you and your players, but remember to learn from past events.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2008 6:18:05 GMT -6
Will do coach, the kids were excited, I'm excited, We've got a huge task ahead of us tonight. What sucks is that they seem to only remember a few plays I out in. But we'll be running the Wishbone T with a little spread
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Post by davecisar on Oct 12, 2008 7:13:10 GMT -6
Best of luck
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Post by coachdoug on Oct 12, 2008 9:10:30 GMT -6
Good luck to you coach - it sounds like this is the best thing for the kids.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2008 9:35:29 GMT -6
I hope so...I think so, just doing alot of second guessing myself this season. We're facing a weak team this weekend, I hope they can hold it together
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