|
|
Post by hlb2 on Nov 28, 2023 7:10:09 GMT -6
I saw this in a HS playoff game this past week and was wondering everyone's thoughts on this. I know the staff on the losing side of this scenario so I do have a little more insight than just the casual fan. The setup is this, playoff game, Team A (the one I'm familiar with) has just taken the lead 10-6 with 10 seconds left to go in the game. Team A kicks the ball deep, do a Power 5 commit in the far left corner (Team A's perspective). The returner ends up returning the kick 97 yards for a game winning TD as time expires to win the game 12-10. Some insight, Team A's kicker has kicked about 85% of his kickoffs into the endzone this season. Also Team A's defense had been playing extremely well during this game.
I'm always interested in situational football to gain a better awareness. I am not second guessing or judging anyone. I would just like to know the thoughts on this one.
|
|
|
|
Post by powercounterandjet on Nov 28, 2023 7:17:01 GMT -6
Assuming it's something I've worked (and I would have had being me, with this kicker especially) I'm sky kicking it to the 30 on the numbers. Put a lot of pressure on a kid who doesnt normally catch it, maybe he runs and takes time, maybe we can recover it and win, but it gets some field position and keeps their guy from returning it. Big leg means he can get it there with a lot of height. No shot I'm kicking deep though.
|
|
|
|
Post by Defcord on Nov 28, 2023 7:44:19 GMT -6
I don't ever kick it deep, especially to a D1 commit, ever.
|
|
lws55
Sophomore Member
Posts: 241 
|
Post by lws55 on Nov 28, 2023 8:04:55 GMT -6
I would kick it hard on the ground down the middle of the field. If anything it could hit one of their players and we recover. You are also asking kids that generally don't field kicks to try and corral a bullet of a football bouncing around on the ground.
|
|
|
|
Post by wolverine55 on Nov 28, 2023 8:30:08 GMT -6
I like the idea of the sky kick, but we don't practice that so we would squib. For whatever reason, kickoff coverage is a consistent issue for us so we normally squib even if we don't particularly fear the other team's return men. Then, when they move the guys up, we give our kicker the freedom to blast one over their heads as he does genuinely have a decent leg.
|
|
|
|
Post by veerwego on Nov 28, 2023 9:08:19 GMT -6
Don't kick it to the best player on the field ever.
|
|
|
|
Post by MICoach on Nov 28, 2023 9:19:33 GMT -6
We've had awful kick coverage the last couple years and this year moved to exclusively sky kicking, aiming for about the 25 yard line (put it right behind the first non-returner). It was a significant improvement over previous years, only gave up a couple long returns, no return TD's.
So yeah, in that situation I'd sky it away from that returner. Squib is an option too.
With that said, we had 2-3 years where we had kids who could put almost 100% in the endzone and it was awesome.
|
|
|
|
Post by RunThePistol on Nov 28, 2023 10:04:04 GMT -6
Don't let their best guy beat you, simplest rule ever.
ALsO, the Squib might be one of the most under rated kicks ever. It takes forever to get down the field, it takes forever to field, and all of that combines to allow the coverage team more time to get down the field and make the play before it gets started.
|
|
|
|
Post by cwaltsmith on Nov 28, 2023 10:12:59 GMT -6
Never give "bonus touches" to other teams best player!!!
|
|
|
|
Post by silkyice on Nov 28, 2023 11:33:13 GMT -6
to a Power 5 commit. game winning TD as time expires to win the game 12-10. Kicking deep is the WRONG thing to do here even if they have a d4 decommit back there to return. As time expires? and the score is 10-6 at the time so a FG can't beat you? I honestly would have done a surprise onside kick. That really is not hindsight. My past coaching staffs would tell you that is exactly what I would do. I have done that in other similarish situations. One, you will recover it. Game over. Two, they will not get a return. Three, at worst, they get one HailMary play against your defense from at best around 50 yardline. Pooch is probably the next best idea. It limits possibilities and makes a HailMary even less likely if they fair catch. Pooch also limits rugby return some. Squib is acceptable. But they still could get a return or at least try and rugby it home. Kicking deep is horrendous. That, by far, gives the opponent's the best chance. You kick deep, you better get it in the endzone. |
|
|
|
Post by hlb2 on Nov 28, 2023 12:36:57 GMT -6
Is there a time difference when the clock starts on a sky kick vs. squib? The clock starts once the ball is fielded correct?
|
|
|
|
Post by silkyice on Nov 28, 2023 12:59:10 GMT -6
Is there a time difference when the clock starts on a sky kick vs. squib? The clock starts once the ball is fielded correct? Correct |
|
|
|
Post by carookie on Nov 28, 2023 23:18:24 GMT -6
Even a ‘hard squib’ is more than I would hope for, as that could end up in the studs hand.
That ball is kicked on the ground with enough strength to get to about their 40. Right at that depth where if a middle row player fields it he has no blocking set up, and if a front line guy fields it he is just gonna fall on it
|
|
|
|
Post by larrymoe on Nov 29, 2023 4:56:59 GMT -6
As others have said, there's no way in hell I'm kicking that deep. I never did the sky kick, but had it done to me and it was very effective. I just never had a kid who could do it. We never got it above the eye line a lot though.
|
|
|
|
Post by CS on Nov 29, 2023 5:10:18 GMT -6
Never put it in their best players hands for the win. Especially if he’s a power 5 player
|
|
|
|
Post by canesfan on Nov 29, 2023 7:55:42 GMT -6
Sky kick.
|
|
coachjax90
Freshmen Member
Spring ball/offseason learning time
Posts: 70
|
Post by coachjax90 on Nov 29, 2023 8:04:15 GMT -6
Squib that joker
|
|
|
|
Post by Defcord on Nov 29, 2023 8:16:54 GMT -6
I would even add maybe try kicking it out of bounds. We use the sky/pooch kick regularly and have had some go out of bounds and no one makes us rekick ever.
We have a dude that can score on KOR so we always make teams rekick. But I don't think that's the norm.
|
|
|
|
Post by silkyice on Nov 29, 2023 8:43:51 GMT -6
I would even add maybe try kicking it out of bounds. We use the sky/pooch kick regularly and have had some go out of bounds and no one makes us rekick ever. We have a dude that can score on KOR so we always make teams rekick. But I don't think that's the norm. I would normally say that is not the best decision for a variety of reasons. But in this situation, it is actually a GREAT idea. If they take the ball, they just have one more HailMary play left. If they take the penalty and make you re-kick, I don't think the 5 extra yards really matter in this situation one way or the other. |
|
|
|
Post by echoofthewhistle on Nov 29, 2023 9:01:33 GMT -6
I would even add maybe try kicking it out of bounds. We use the sky/pooch kick regularly and have had some go out of bounds and no one makes us rekick ever. We have a dude that can score on KOR so we always make teams rekick. But I don't think that's the norm. I would normally say that is not the best decision for a variety of reasons. But in this situation, it is actually a GREAT idea. If they take the ball, they just have one more HailMary play left. If they take the penalty and make you re-kick, I don't think the 5 extra yards really matter in this situation one way or the other. Off topic but you should genearlly always make teams re-kick when kicking and punting. |
|
|
|
Post by veerman on Nov 29, 2023 11:18:15 GMT -6
The type of kick is not the issue. DON"T KICK IT TO THE BEST PLAYER!!! KO scouting starts with, is there a kid who we are not going to kick it to this week (Power 5 commit would definitely check this box). Sometimes there's multiple guys, so we may do a different type of kick on kickoff that week.
We actually was on the winning side of this once. We had a kid that is playing at a power 5 school now, a team just scored to take the lead in the 4th quarter in a 2nd round playoff game. Their kicker was going to a power 5 school as well. ALL night they put it out the back of the endzone with no chance of return. After they took the lead they wanted to sky kick it on the numbers about at the 5 (Like a lot of colleges do for some reason), well our guy takes it for a house call, and we tie the game, only for him to break a long run after they go 3 and out the next possession for us to win the game.
|
|
|
|
Post by veerman on Nov 29, 2023 11:19:55 GMT -6
I would normally say that is not the best decision for a variety of reasons. But in this situation, it is actually a GREAT idea. If they take the ball, they just have one more HailMary play left. If they take the penalty and make you re-kick, I don't think the 5 extra yards really matter in this situation one way or the other. Off topic but you should genearlly always make teams re-kick when kicking and punting. maybe on kickoff, but punt could be a different story. |
|
|
|
Post by echoofthewhistle on Nov 29, 2023 12:16:26 GMT -6
Off topic but you should genearlly always make teams re-kick when kicking and punting. maybe on kickoff, but punt could be a different story. Reason against making them rekick? In my mind outside of you having great field position from a block, bad punt, or good return, making them punt again makes them have to execute another snap, punt, and coverage with players who might now be fatigue. |
|
|
|
Post by bobgoodman on Nov 30, 2023 9:32:28 GMT -6
If your kicker knows the whirlybird kickoff, do it. Otherwise ground ball, and not so hard that it's liable to bounce to the deep people.
|
|
|
|
Post by veerman on Nov 30, 2023 10:49:09 GMT -6
maybe on kickoff, but punt could be a different story. Reason against making them rekick? In my mind outside of you having great field position from a block, bad punt, or good return, making them punt again makes them have to execute another snap, punt, and coverage with players who might now be fatigue. I'm getting the ball, so why would I want to put it back in their hands? Again if I'm in bad field position I would, or if their punter just hit a rare dinger that he could not do a second time that kept us getting the ball in their territory I would. |
|
|
|
Post by cqmiller on Dec 1, 2023 18:38:50 GMT -6
Kick the ball out of bounds and make them try go go 60 in one play.
Even squib will get lateralled back to the DUDE if their coaches are worth a damn.
|
|
|
|
Post by bignose on Dec 1, 2023 18:55:01 GMT -6
I would do a directional squib to my sideline (most teams want to return to their home side)even to the point of laying the ball sideways across the tee to get a crazy bounce.
I'd aim to try to get the ball down to between the 35-25, outside of the numbers, and send my fastest kids down on that side.
We want them to field the ball and start the clock, or recover it ourselves.
In the event that the receiving team recovers, and they have time for one play, we would remind our kids that pass interference is only a 15 yard penalty, and we'd make sure that their stud was both pressed and covered deep.
|
|
|
|
Post by blb on Dec 2, 2023 8:30:25 GMT -6
In other words - do anything EXCEPT kick the ball deep to the Return Man.
|
|
|
|
Post by silkyice on Dec 2, 2023 9:21:13 GMT -6
In other words - do anything EXCEPT kick the ball deep to the Return Man. Ha. That is exactly right. It is hard to make the exact right call. The perfect call. But ding dangit, avoid the WRONG CALL. |
|
|
|
Post by bobgoodman on Dec 2, 2023 9:44:45 GMT -6
Kick the ball out of bounds and make them try go go 60 in one play. Heh...like they're going to let you kick out of bounds on purpose and take that penalty. |
|
