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Post by tripsclosed on Jul 1, 2022 7:46:38 GMT -6
I know I am not the first to notice and comment on this, but what's with the bad fundamentals we see on the collegiate P5 level, on both sides of the ball?
You watch an even an SEC team for example, and play after play, it's missed assignments, whiffed blocks, bad form and execution on routes, pass pro, run blocking, and catching, poor pursuit angles, bad tackling, coverage drops too shallow or too deep, or too far inside or outside, bad timing, two dudes blocking one dude when it clearly wasnt meant to be a double team and one of those dudes' assignments screams right into the backfield and blows the play up, the wrong routes run, and on and on (oh the humanity, right?).
Now, in *my* experience, frequently when this comes up, the answer thrown out to implicitly or explicitly defend this mess, is "Well, they are playing with special athletes me and you are not at the HS level, so they can get away with that."
Are they getting away with it though? Most teams are fairly pedestrian and it's the same few teams dominating every year.
Each one of those mistakes and instances of poor form, no matter how small or big, negatively affects your win probability. You add all those up over a season?
Maybe at some point people should step back and reevaluate if what they are doing and how they do it is optimal or not?
Once again, the Bruce Lee principle: 1 kick practiced 10,000 times beats 10,000 kicks practiced 1 time each.
Maybe THAT is why their form is so bad. When you have 50,000 different ways of running Inside Zone, Outside Zone, Power, Counter, Trap, Buck Sweep, and Iso, out of 1 million and 1 formations, with an unholy amount of motions, no wonder they can't execute any of it correctly but 3/10 times...
Then throw in too that the P5 level is notoriously more of a "networkocracy" than a meritocracy, and you end up with total boob jobs coaching your OL that have no business coaching in NAIA let alone P5.
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Post by blb on Jul 1, 2022 7:53:44 GMT -6
1. The 20-hour/week rule
2. CFB has become an extremely complex game X and O-wise. Requires a lot of practice-prep time which takes away from Individual (fundamentals).
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Post by tripsclosed on Jul 1, 2022 8:00:15 GMT -6
1. The 20-hour/week rule 2. CFB has become an extremely complex game X and O-wise. Requires a lot of practice-prep time which takes away from Individual (fundamentals). Makes sense on 1. On 2, especially because of 1, couldn't one, at least offensively if not defensively, buck the trend and say we are going simple and fast? Case in point: Louisiana Tech in 2012? It was this way at least as far back as 08/09 UF, you can watch old Percy Harvin film and watch UF OL screwing blocks up back then, too.
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Post by joelee on Jul 1, 2022 8:24:19 GMT -6
1. The 20-hour/week rule 2. CFB has become an extremely complex game X and O-wise. Requires a lot of practice-prep time which takes away from Individual (fundamentals). 3. Climbing each different level of coaching isn't a meritocracy.
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Post by silkyice on Jul 1, 2022 8:29:03 GMT -6
1. The 20-hour/week rule 2. CFB has become an extremely complex game X and O-wise. Requires a lot of practice-prep time which takes away from Individual (fundamentals). This. Beat me to it.
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Post by larrymoe on Jul 1, 2022 9:05:35 GMT -6
A portion of it, IMO, is that coaches at that level are servants to the talent. In that I mean that with the transfer portal and other factors, I think some coaches are intimidated to make corrections that may be perceived as too harsh because kids will leave or get them fired. Alabama can get away with a little more "harsh" or intense coaching because they can just pull out another 5 star guy out of the cupboard.
College football is just following the footsteps of the NFL in that players run the show now. They do whatever they want. And, that usually doesn't involve spending hours and hours learning the game.
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Post by fantom on Jul 1, 2022 9:30:17 GMT -6
1. The 20-hour/week rule 2. CFB has become an extremely complex game X and O-wise. Requires a lot of practice-prep time which takes away from Individual (fundamentals). 3. Climbing each different level of coaching isn't a meritocracy. A lot of guys are coaching in college based on recruiting ability rather than coaching ability.
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Post by blb on Jul 1, 2022 10:31:49 GMT -6
I think it started, because a friend of mine who was a Big Ten assistant coach for many years told me so, when the scholarship limitations were lowered and when Juniors were allowed to declare for the NFL Draft.
You couldn't have anything resembling full contact so much any more because you didn't have the depth as before.
If a starter got hurt you could no longer plug in a former highly-recruited kid who had been there waiting, working (including lifting-getting bigger, stronger, faster in Off-Season) for his chance to play.
The transfer portal is only going to exacerbate that.
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Post by tog on Jul 1, 2022 10:52:05 GMT -6
3. Climbing each different level of coaching isn't a meritocracy. A lot of guys are coaching in college based on recruiting ability rather than coaching ability. A LOT
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Post by tripsclosed on Jul 1, 2022 10:58:20 GMT -6
I think it started, because a friend of mine who was a Big Ten assistant coach for many years told me so, when the scholarship limitations were lowered and when Juniors were allowed to declare for the NFL Draft. You couldn't have anything resembling full contact so much any more because you didn't have the depth as before. If a starter got hurt you could no longer plug in a former highly-recruited kid who had been there waiting, working (including lifting-getting bigger, stronger, faster in Off-Season) for his chance to play. The transfer portal is only going to exacerbate that. Great point about the transfer portal. That is going to wreak absolute havoc with this matter...It will probably in effect end up being like the 1 and done environment in CBB. Impossible to build a program in that kind of environment. OL and most DL, and LBs will probably still be 4 and 5 years in the program. But you will probably have QBs, RBs, WRs, TEs, and DBs that will have played in up to 3 different systems during their career...
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Post by carookie on Jul 1, 2022 11:05:29 GMT -6
3. Climbing each different level of coaching isn't a meritocracy. A lot of guys are coaching in college based on recruiting ability rather than coaching ability. Oh my gosh, I'm sure I'm not the only one- but I could tell you stories of guys I've met/known at that level......
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Post by carookie on Jul 1, 2022 11:20:39 GMT -6
1. The 20-hour/week rule 2. CFB has become an extremely complex game X and O-wise. Requires a lot of practice-prep time which takes away from Individual (fundamentals).I think this is the big thing, but I also believe we need to hold a mirror up to ourselves (ourselves being HS coaches) here as well. I've known a LOT of HS coaches who fall into this same mentality, who will argue that, "I'm not a drill master" (ie not here to rep fundamentals), who spend the vast majority of their time repping team, who are more into coaching plays as opposed to players. Yes, you can correct fundamentals in whole group situations, but to be honest most coaches look at that as a time to ensure players are in the right place at the right time, as opposed to using proper technique/fundamentals when there. And any correction they give is just telling the kid to do it, as opposed to really working on the fundamental development. There tends to be three aspects of coaching: 1) athletic development (make our players bigger, faster, etc). 2) X & O's (run the play correctly, be in the right place at the right time for the number of plays we have). 3) Technique (be able to execute the fundamental actions/technique/movement required). Most coaches see improvement at 1 & 2 as having the most correlation to winning games- while 1 & 3 probably do the most for developing the player in the long run. So you get these HS coaches who spend little time developing technique, and when the kids get to college, they don't have much fundamental foundation. College coaches assume they should have been taught this already, and do the same thing the HS coach did, seeing paths 1 & 2 as the best way to win games. In regards to the 20 hour time limit, I see that as the same in HS. Many on this board argue that we/they shouldnt need that much practice time to get the job done. Its the same at the collegiate level. If you can't get it done in that amount of time, maybe you are trying to do too much.
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Post by blb on Jul 1, 2022 11:32:12 GMT -6
1. The 20-hour/week rule 2. CFB has become an extremely complex game X and O-wise. Requires a lot of practice-prep time which takes away from Individual (fundamentals).I think this is the big thing, but I also believe we need to hold a mirror up to ourselves (ourselves being HS coaches) here as well. I've known a LOT of HS coaches who fall into this same mentality, who will argue that, "I'm not a drill master" (ie not here to rep fundamentals), who spend the vast majority of their time repping team, who are more into coaching plays as opposed to players. Yes, you can correct fundamentals in whole group situations, but to be honest most coaches look at that as a time to ensure players are in the right place at the right time, as opposed to using proper technique/fundamentals when there. And any correction they give is just telling the kid to do it, as opposed to really working on the fundamental development. There tends to be three aspects of coaching: 1) athletic development (make our players bigger, faster, etc). 2) X & O's (run the play correctly, be in the right place at the right time for the number of plays we have). 3) Technique (be able to execute the fundamental actions/technique/movement required). Most coaches see improvement at 1 & 2 as having the most correlation to winning games- while 1 & 3 probably do the most for developing the player in the long run. So you get these HS coaches who spend little time developing technique, and when the kids get to college, they don't have much fundamental foundation. College coaches assume they should have been taught this already, and do the same thing the HS coach did, seeing paths 1 & 2 as the best way to win games. In regards to the 20 hour time limit, I see that as the same in HS. Many on this board argue that we/they shouldnt need that much practice time to get the job done. Its the same at the collegiate level. If you can't get it done in that amount of time, maybe you are trying to do too much. You are not wrong. In fact I agree with you whole-heartedly.
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Post by CS on Jul 1, 2022 11:55:18 GMT -6
1. The 20-hour/week rule 2. CFB has become an extremely complex game X and O-wise. Requires a lot of practice-prep time which takes away from Individual (fundamentals).I think this is the big thing, but I also believe we need to hold a mirror up to ourselves (ourselves being HS coaches) here as well. I've known a LOT of HS coaches who fall into this same mentality, who will argue that, "I'm not a drill master" (ie not here to rep fundamentals), who spend the vast majority of their time repping team, who are more into coaching plays as opposed to players. Yes, you can correct fundamentals in whole group situations, but to be honest most coaches look at that as a time to ensure players are in the right place at the right time, as opposed to using proper technique/fundamentals when there. And any correction they give is just telling the kid to do it, as opposed to really working on the fundamental development. There tends to be three aspects of coaching: 1) athletic development (make our players bigger, faster, etc). 2) X & O's (run the play correctly, be in the right place at the right time for the number of plays we have). 3) Technique (be able to execute the fundamental actions/technique/movement required). Most coaches see improvement at 1 & 2 as having the most correlation to winning games- while 1 & 3 probably do the most for developing the player in the long run. So you get these HS coaches who spend little time developing technique, and when the kids get to college, they don't have much fundamental foundation. College coaches assume they should have been taught this already, and do the same thing the HS coach did, seeing paths 1 & 2 as the best way to win games. In regards to the 20 hour time limit, I see that as the same in HS. Many on this board argue that we/they shouldnt need that much practice time to get the job done. Its the same at the collegiate level. If you can't get it done in that amount of time, maybe you are trying to do too much. Then I wonder if everyone goes by the Jimmie’s and joes not X’s and O’s philosophy, then why isn’t 1 and 3 more of a priority?
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Post by coachwoodall on Jul 1, 2022 13:18:19 GMT -6
As regarding to the 1/2/3 of this thread, I could agree/understand to the #1 & #2; have no idea to #3.
As coach in general, the why you don't stress fundamentals above all else is a thing, I don't know/understand.... however, I'm pragmatic enough to understand the application of #1-#3.
However in my world and my personal intonation; F--- it to all 3, you'll do what I coach or I'll lose without you.
I guess I've gotten fully onto the 'get off my lawn' generation.
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Post by blb on Jul 1, 2022 13:36:42 GMT -6
Talking CFB-P5 now:
If you are coaching at one of the top tier programs that get 4 and 5-star recruits every year, you may not have to spend so much time on teaching fundamentals.
If you're at the next tier - the programs that don't get the above - you have to develop your players in the Off-Season and by teaching them techniques-how to play successfully at P5 level.
Hopefully you will have them long enough to see it pay off.
In my neck of the woods that would be Iowa and Wisconsin for example. Michigan State under Dantonio too.
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Post by tripsclosed on Jul 1, 2022 14:19:22 GMT -6
Talking CFB-P5 now: If you are coaching at one of the top tier programs that get 4 and 5-star recruits every year, you may not have to spend so much time on teaching fundamentals. If you are Alabama, Clemson, etc, the very top elite, maybe, but there again they are the very top elite because of talent AND coaching. What about teams like Auburn, LSU, Florida, So Cal, Texas, Oklahoma, Oregon etc that get good talent but are only kinda good or middle of the road? I can sit down with you and watch game film of Auburn under Malzahn, atrocious fundamentals and execution, if they had executed properly, they could have just about scored every possesion, even against good teams.
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Post by coachd5085 on Jul 1, 2022 14:37:24 GMT -6
I know I am not the first to notice and comment on this, but what's with the bad fundamentals we see on the collegiate P5 level, on both sides of the ball? You watch an even an SEC team for example, and play after play, it's missed assignments, whiffed blocks, bad form and execution on routes, pass pro, run blocking, and catching, poor pursuit angles, bad tackling, coverage drops too shallow or too deep, or too far inside or outside, bad timing, two dudes blocking one dude when it clearly wasnt meant to be a double team and one of those dudes' assignments screams right into the backfield and blows the play up, the wrong routes run, and on and on (oh the humanity, right?). Now, in *my* experience, frequently when this comes up, the answer thrown out to implicitly or explicitly defend this mess, is "Well, they are playing with special athletes me and you are not at the HS level, so they can get away with that." Are they getting away with it though? Most teams are fairly pedestrian and it's the same few teams dominating every year. Each one of those mistakes and instances of poor form, no matter how small or big, negatively affects your win probability. You add all those up over a season? Maybe at some point people should step back and reevaluate if what they are doing and how they do it is optimal or not? Once again, the Bruce Lee principle: 1 kick practiced 10,000 times beats 10,000 kicks practiced 1 time each. Maybe THAT is why their form is so bad. When you have 50,000 different ways of running Inside Zone, Outside Zone, Power, Counter, Trap, Buck Sweep, and Iso, out of 1 million and 1 formations, with an unholy amount of motions, no wonder they can't execute any of it correctly but 3/10 times... Then throw in too that the P5 level is notoriously more of a "networkocracy" than a meritocracy, and you end up with total boob jobs coaching your OL that have no business coaching in NAIA let alone P5. Just to add a somewhat different perspective, I am sure that youth/Frosh/JV level coaches could make the exact same post directed toward HS varsity play. And college guys could make the same post directed toward NFL players. I would also say that I would not call many of the things you describe as fundamentals but rather as mistakes or poor execution. Part of the reason is likely that the speed of the game is just faster.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2022 14:45:24 GMT -6
As someone else said, coaching isn’t a meritocracy, depth issues exist, coaching in college is more about recruiting and putting together a talented roster now more than ever. Etc.
I would also say part of it is simply because people in general are mistake prone and the stuff those guys are doing at that level us often designed to create more mistakes.
I rarely see a HS game with “flawless execution” against equal or greater talent. In fact, I don’t think I’ve ever seen it for an entire game, or even an entire quarter, of HS ball even when it’s a powerhouse beating down the Little Sisters of the Poor. At the college level, where the talent disparity is usually smaller, it’s more likely to stand out.
Throw in all the different things everyone is trying to do on each play and some stuff is just going to give.
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Post by bignose on Jul 1, 2022 14:55:41 GMT -6
Too many coaches take talent for granted.
It's the real good coach who can teach his less than gifted kids to beat a more talented team, that has poor fundamentals, by out executing them
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Post by tripsclosed on Jul 1, 2022 15:10:56 GMT -6
I know I am not the first to notice and comment on this, but what's with the bad fundamentals we see on the collegiate P5 level, on both sides of the ball? You watch an even an SEC team for example, and play after play, it's missed assignments, whiffed blocks, bad form and execution on routes, pass pro, run blocking, and catching, poor pursuit angles, bad tackling, coverage drops too shallow or too deep, or too far inside or outside, bad timing, two dudes blocking one dude when it clearly wasnt meant to be a double team and one of those dudes' assignments screams right into the backfield and blows the play up, the wrong routes run, and on and on (oh the humanity, right?). Now, in *my* experience, frequently when this comes up, the answer thrown out to implicitly or explicitly defend this mess, is "Well, they are playing with special athletes me and you are not at the HS level, so they can get away with that." Are they getting away with it though? Most teams are fairly pedestrian and it's the same few teams dominating every year. Each one of those mistakes and instances of poor form, no matter how small or big, negatively affects your win probability. You add all those up over a season? Maybe at some point people should step back and reevaluate if what they are doing and how they do it is optimal or not? Once again, the Bruce Lee principle: 1 kick practiced 10,000 times beats 10,000 kicks practiced 1 time each. Maybe THAT is why their form is so bad. When you have 50,000 different ways of running Inside Zone, Outside Zone, Power, Counter, Trap, Buck Sweep, and Iso, out of 1 million and 1 formations, with an unholy amount of motions, no wonder they can't execute any of it correctly but 3/10 times... Then throw in too that the P5 level is notoriously more of a "networkocracy" than a meritocracy, and you end up with total boob jobs coaching your OL that have no business coaching in NAIA let alone P5. Just to add a somewhat different perspective, I am sure that youth/Frosh/JV level coaches could make the exact same post directed toward HS varsity play. And college guys could make the same post directed toward NFL players. I would also say that I would not call many of the things you describe as fundamentals but rather as mistakes or poor execution. Part of the reason is likely that the speed of the game is just faster. I hear ya on speed of the game, but you do see teams that are capable of executing sharply. I mean coach, you've seen the collegiate playbooks. Even before the 20 hour limit, even taking cake classes in cake degrees, even having your life literally around the clock, year round, dedicated to football, there is no way they have enough time to get good at all that, or even serviceable at most and good at some, and keep all that straight in their head.
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Post by tripsclosed on Jul 1, 2022 15:14:12 GMT -6
As someone else said, coaching isn’t a meritocracy, depth issues exist, coaching in college is more about recruiting and putting together a talented roster now more than ever. Etc. I would also say part of it is simply because people in general are mistake prone and the stuff those guys are doing at that level us often designed to create more mistakes. I rarely see a HS game with “flawless execution” against equal or greater talent. In fact, I don’t think I’ve ever seen it for an entire game, or even an entire quarter, of HS ball even when it’s a powerhouse beating down the Little Sisters of the Poor. At the college level, where the talent disparity is usually smaller, it’s more likely to stand out. Throw in all the different things everyone is trying to do on each play and some stuff is just going to give. Coach, a lot of it that im talking about is clearly unforced/self-inflicted errors. It's not something the other team did. It's them taking a bad angle, not using proper technique, playing hesitantly. People talk all the time about playing fast, and you want players playing not thinking. Paralysis by analysis. And yes, as i said at the end of the OP, it's definitely not a meritocracy.
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Post by carookie on Jul 1, 2022 15:57:25 GMT -6
I think this is the big thing, but I also believe we need to hold a mirror up to ourselves (ourselves being HS coaches) here as well. I've known a LOT of HS coaches who fall into this same mentality, who will argue that, "I'm not a drill master" (ie not here to rep fundamentals), who spend the vast majority of their time repping team, who are more into coaching plays as opposed to players. Yes, you can correct fundamentals in whole group situations, but to be honest most coaches look at that as a time to ensure players are in the right place at the right time, as opposed to using proper technique/fundamentals when there. And any correction they give is just telling the kid to do it, as opposed to really working on the fundamental development. There tends to be three aspects of coaching: 1) athletic development (make our players bigger, faster, etc). 2) X & O's (run the play correctly, be in the right place at the right time for the number of plays we have). 3) Technique (be able to execute the fundamental actions/technique/movement required). Most coaches see improvement at 1 & 2 as having the most correlation to winning games- while 1 & 3 probably do the most for developing the player in the long run. So you get these HS coaches who spend little time developing technique, and when the kids get to college, they don't have much fundamental foundation. College coaches assume they should have been taught this already, and do the same thing the HS coach did, seeing paths 1 & 2 as the best way to win games. In regards to the 20 hour time limit, I see that as the same in HS. Many on this board argue that we/they shouldnt need that much practice time to get the job done. Its the same at the collegiate level. If you can't get it done in that amount of time, maybe you are trying to do too much. Then I wonder if everyone goes by the Jimmie’s and joes not X’s and O’s philosophy, then why isn’t 1 and 3 more of a priority? I think 1, to an extent, is a priority, and thats what people say when they go by the "Jimmies and Joes". They, rightfully so, focus on developing athletic ability, because its the number one factor in determining wins. But to be honest, I don't think there are enough good coaches/teachers out there who can really focus on #3. Either they don't fully understand the technique required, so they don't teach fundamentals completely/correctly. Or they don't understand HOW to teach things: ie they just tell/yell at the kids what to do. Coaching fundamentals isnt telling a player what to do, its instructing him in such a way (often repeatedly, in small steps, and building up) so that when stuff hits the fan at a million miles per hour, the player does it instinctively. A lot of coaches think they are focusing on #3, but really they are just giving it lip service.
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Post by coachwoodall on Jul 1, 2022 18:09:11 GMT -6
Interesting topic considering my day's events; we hosted a combine for our state's end of year all star game. Our HC is on the staff and is tasked with being the DB coach, and our AC staff ran the drills so all of the all star coaches could evaluate the participants.
At the end of the day my HC, who is the DB coach for this all star game, asked the DB coaches at my school to assess the DB talent/skill of that groups we worked out. To a T, the coaches (total of 4 including our HC) distinguished between those that had innate skill/athleticism and those that had obviously been coached well as to those that excelled at simply having a skill set of DBs.
I also inquired into the other defensive coaches on our staff if they had kids that showed out talent wise versus kids that had obviously had been coached well. It was pretty consistent across the board. I was able to witness the drill work across the defensive board from front line to the back end and that was my assessment too.
I only saw the offensive WR/RB/QB in the competition setting portion of the day.
It was easy to see which kids had been coached/worked well in the fundamentals, versus the ones that just were there on the aspects of their over all physical skills. I even saw kids take to heart the corrections to their fundamental flaws like they had just heard them for the first time.
This was 75+ kids that were invited to come and work our at our facility. These were kids that had already been through several previous regional 'combines' and film evaluation by the all star coaches. Again I only witnessed primarily the DB group, but also in competition periods WRs, LBs, RBs, QBs, also (in 1 on 1, and split 7 on 7 time).
Again It was obvious that most of the kids had talent/genetics, but it was also obvious which kids had been coached well. Also this the 2nd year our staff ran this event; covid cancelled the game last year so the selective all star staff was recycled.
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Post by coachd5085 on Jul 2, 2022 6:08:51 GMT -6
Interesting topic considering my day's events; we hosted a combine for our state's end of year all star game. Our HC is on the staff and is tasked with being the DB coach, and our AC staff ran the drills so all of the all star coaches could evaluate the participants. At the end of the day my HC, who is the DB coach for this all star game, asked the DB coaches at my school to assess the DB talent/skill of that groups we worked out. To a T, the coaches (total of 4 including our HC) distinguished between those that had innate skill/athleticism and those that had obviously been coached well as to those that excelled at simply having a skill set of DBs. I also inquired into the other defensive coaches on our staff if they had kids that showed out talent wise versus kids that had obviously had been coached well. It was pretty consistent across the board. I was able to witness the drill work across the defensive board from front line to the back end and that was my assessment too. I only saw the offensive WR/RB/QB in the competition setting portion of the day. It was easy to see which kids had been coached/worked well in the fundamentals, versus the ones that just were there on the aspects of their over all physical skills. I even saw kids take to heart the corrections to their fundamental flaws like they had just heard them for the first time. This was 75+ kids that were invited to come and work our at our facility. These were kids that had already been through several previous regional 'combines' and film evaluation by the all star coaches. Again I only witnessed primarily the DB group, but also in competition periods WRs, LBs, RBs, QBs, also (in 1 on 1, and split 7 on 7 time). Again It was obvious that most of the kids had talent/genetics, but it was also obvious which kids had been coached well. Also this the 2nd year our staff ran this event; covid cancelled the game last year so the selective all star staff was recycled. What type of "drill work". Keep in mind it is possible that some kids were indeed coached well on the "drills". For instance, a DB whose regular season HS coach didn't use a backpedal might look pretty horrid if being put through 4 or 5 different backpedal and break type drills. A player coming from a team that utilized man coverage might not look to great as a corner or safety performing reroute drills for cover 2 or cover 3. And yes, obviously in HS sometimes staffs don't allow for indepth coaching of the best players on finer points. There is definitely some "ok, you are a best player...so go cover that guy" while time is spent on other aspects. I don't think the above would apply too much to the scenario the OP is presenting though.
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Post by fantom on Jul 2, 2022 8:48:05 GMT -6
And yes, obviously in HS sometimes staffs don't allow for indepth coaching of the best players on finer points. There is definitely some "ok, you are a best player...so go cover that guy" while time is spent on other aspects. I don't think the above would apply too much to the scenario the OP is presenting though. If the D1 prospect is getting his job done in HS despite lousy technique, keep in mind that the coach may need to use his practice time trying to get other guys even competent.
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Post by coachd5085 on Jul 2, 2022 9:04:44 GMT -6
And yes, obviously in HS sometimes staffs don't allow for indepth coaching of the best players on finer points. There is definitely some "ok, you are a best player...so go cover that guy" while time is spent on other aspects. I don't think the above would apply too much to the scenario the OP is presenting though. If the D1 prospect is getting his job done in HS despite lousy technique, keep in mind that the coach may need to use his practice time trying to get other guys even competent. exactly. That is what I was trying to convey, but didn't do it as well as you did coach.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2022 10:00:47 GMT -6
As someone else said, coaching isn’t a meritocracy, depth issues exist, coaching in college is more about recruiting and putting together a talented roster now more than ever. Etc. I would also say part of it is simply because people in general are mistake prone and the stuff those guys are doing at that level us often designed to create more mistakes. I rarely see a HS game with “flawless execution” against equal or greater talent. In fact, I don’t think I’ve ever seen it for an entire game, or even an entire quarter, of HS ball even when it’s a powerhouse beating down the Little Sisters of the Poor. At the college level, where the talent disparity is usually smaller, it’s more likely to stand out. Throw in all the different things everyone is trying to do on each play and some stuff is just going to give. Coach, a lot of it that im talking about is clearly unforced/self-inflicted errors. It's not something the other team did. It's them taking a bad angle, not using proper technique, playing hesitantly. People talk all the time about playing fast, and you want players playing not thinking. Paralysis by analysis. And yes, as i said at the end of the OP, it's definitely not a meritocracy. But what I’m saying is that those things are always there. It’s just that the greater athletic talent exposes natural mental hesitancy or mistakes in an opponent much more clearly for all to see. When you ADD to the mental processing players are supposed to do (and a lot of college and NFL coaches, including Saban and Belichik do this), you are going to potentially create more issues like this, Take “bad angles.” If you run 4.6 and you’re trying to get to a RB who runs 4.9 in HS, you have more room for error. You can false step, hesitate, or come in at all kinds of different angles, etc. and still get there… but if that RB runs 4.4 you have almost no room for error and it will be glaringly obvious if you make a slight mistake. I am sometimes astounded by watching stuff like Hawaii’s DL run 3 yards upfield and then try to “wrong arm” a few years ago, but that stuff is still the exception to what I see, not the norm. This is also why you see a lot of true freak athletes in HS and college who can’t put it together at the next level. A lot of those guys just can’t get the processing, reads, etc down. As a coach, it’s our job to simplify our stuff to make our players more effective, but “instincts” and “processing” are every bit as much a part of having “talent” as being big, strong, and running fast.
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Post by bobgoodman on Jul 3, 2022 9:28:13 GMT -6
the Bruce Lee principle: 1 kick practiced 10,000 times beats 10,000 kicks practiced 1 time each. But neither beats 100 kicks practiced 100 times each.
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Post by bobgoodman on Jul 3, 2022 9:34:16 GMT -6
I think it started, because a friend of mine who was a Big Ten assistant coach for many years told me so, when the scholarship limitations were lowered and when Juniors were allowed to declare for the NFL Draft. You couldn't have anything resembling full contact so much any more because you didn't have the depth as before. If a starter got hurt you could no longer plug in a former highly-recruited kid who had been there waiting, working (including lifting-getting bigger, stronger, faster in Off-Season) for his chance to play. The transfer portal is only going to exacerbate that. Great point about the transfer portal. That is going to wreak absolute havoc with this matter...It will probably in effect end up being like the 1 and done environment in CBB. Impossible to build a program in that kind of environment. OL and most DL, and LBs will probably still be 4 and 5 years in the program. But you will probably have QBs, RBs, WRs, TEs, and DBs that will have played in up to 3 different systems during their career... If that becomes noticeable enough, it's bound to accelerate the professionalization of the game.
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