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Post by coachcalande on Mar 31, 2007 5:57:41 GMT -6
from your assistants? Or would you prefer they just work hard and keep their ideas to themselves? How much does YOUR OWN EGO affect your ability to accept suggestions (or at least HEAR them?)...
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Post by sls on Mar 31, 2007 7:34:13 GMT -6
in meetings, I will take suggestions all day, as long as they are constructive. I hate it when someone says "I saw this play on Monday Night Football and I think it will enable us to score every time, you should of seen how open T. O. was and the ball that McNabb threw was a rocket".
Don't make suggestions on the field or in front of kids.
Just my opinion, I am sure others will feel different.
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Post by tog on Mar 31, 2007 8:47:03 GMT -6
feel the same sls
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bhb
Junior Member
Posts: 259
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Post by bhb on Mar 31, 2007 8:51:29 GMT -6
AC's make suggestions- HC's make decisions.. As long as the suggestions are well thought out- because I will throw every scenario possible to prove why the idea won't work for us (they need to be able to take this because I do the same thing with my ideas), and if we, as a staff, decide against it they move on and let it go..
And as long as they come in meetings, not on the field- especially in the middle of a close game-LOL- I'll pretty much hear them out..
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Post by fbdoc on Mar 31, 2007 8:58:56 GMT -6
I think the assistants need to feel comfortable to make suggestion, but to also realize that timing is everything, and to not suggest the McNab to T.O. play when it's 3rd and 15 and were on our own 10 with under a minute to play! I still use this line with my assistants every once in awhile (a head coach who is still a great friend used it on me frequently)... speaking AS the head coach - Gentlemen, this is only a suggestion, but I want you to keep in mind WHO is suggesting it.
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Post by coachd5085 on Mar 31, 2007 9:17:52 GMT -6
I would think any good HC would always appreciate suggestions AND even criticisms in a private manner. It is very difficult to evaluate yourself and behavior, because naturally, if you thought you could be doing something in a better way, YOU WOULD BE. I have always felt akward because of this during end of year meetings with a HC.
I could come up with a list of things I thought could be improved by other coaches and the program...but my list was usually very small. While this sounds very elitist and arrogant, I think there is a lot of common sense behind it. It is very easy to see everyone elses "mistakes" (in your opinion) but very difficult to see your own, because IF YOU ARE DOING THEM, YOU PROBABLY DON'T THINK THERE IS A BETTER WAY. It is important for development for others to suggest these better ways, so you can evaluate.
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Post by brophy on Mar 31, 2007 9:31:24 GMT -6
every suggestion is measure with how it can be tied in with the playbook.
If you can't take the time to assimiliate your suggestion to the playbook (terminology, base formations,etc) then you really haven't thought it out.
Also, you'd better have an answer for how it adjusts to everything we will see from our opponents.
Time, Teaching, and Execution all have to be juggled to make any play work (understand how long it would take to implement your suggestion).
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Post by phantom on Mar 31, 2007 9:35:41 GMT -6
Our rule for implementing new ideas during the season is that if something new is going in then something has to go out.
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Post by fbdoc on Mar 31, 2007 10:12:06 GMT -6
Great point phantom. Other wise the playbook gets crammed with suggestions and exceptions and instead of a playbook you have a grab bag. Also need to note how the "suggestion" effects other plays in the series or scheme.
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Post by coachd5085 on Mar 31, 2007 10:23:12 GMT -6
Just an interesting point...when asked about suggestions, this thread immediately when to plays and x's and o's. Just musing a bit about that, because I feel those aren't even close to being the most important part of the game.
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Post by phantom on Mar 31, 2007 10:47:58 GMT -6
Just an interesting point...when asked about suggestions, this thread immediately when to plays and x's and o's. Just musing a bit about that, because I feel those aren't even close to being the most important part of the game. True, but that's probably what most suggestions are about, especially in-season. To answer the original question, our boss is very good about taking suggestions and open to change if you can prove a point. Would he be willing to change from our Pro-I to a spread? Not chance. Then again, we know the guy so none of us would be dumb enough to suggest it.
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Post by dubber on Mar 31, 2007 11:41:12 GMT -6
It works best in this situation: the OC or DC hears all the suggestions, collates them into the HC's vision, presents them as a unified playbook, and then the process starts over again until you have a refined PB.
In season suggestions should be limited to a tweak in assignment/personnel here or there......don't reinvent the wheel every week
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2007 11:48:03 GMT -6
As a head coach I really appreciate suggestions from assistants and they have really helped us.
The best suggestions have not been about plays or defenses.
Instead the best suggestions from the other coaches have been about use of personel and reminders during the heat of the game. For example having an assistant coach remind you to go on a long count because he notices that the defense is over anxious. It may seem like a little thing but in a critical game this year our soph head coach reminded us to go on two and they jumped and we got a critical first down. On the next play we broke a long touchdown run and blew the game open. Those are the suggestions that make a difference.
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Post by dubber on Mar 31, 2007 11:58:20 GMT -6
As a head coach I really appreciate suggestions from assistants and they have really helped us. The best suggestions have not been about plays or defenses. Instead the best suggestions from the other coaches have been about use of personel and reminders during the heat of the game. For example having an assistant coach remind you to go on a long count because he notices that the defense is over anxious. It may seem like a little thing but in a critical game this year our soph head coach reminded us to go on two and they jumped and we got a critical first down. On the next play we broke a long touchdown run and blew the game open. Those are the suggestions that make a difference. Absolutely..........Homer-Rice-wanna-be's that come up with a "better" scheme are usually immature coaches.......simple things that are within the existing offense is what you're looking for.
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Post by coachsky on Mar 31, 2007 12:15:44 GMT -6
My experience is that your input and ability to make recommendations is earned.
I joined a new staff a last year and they weren't interested in hearing any of my ideas. I needed to learn their approach and systems and coach my group,. Totally understandable. I had come from a more successful program where I had coached freshman the past couple of years. Most of my experience was with MS level.
I had a good year coaching my group at Freshman, kids got better, coaches could really see them get better, the kids had a great experience, freshman coach liked my input and game prep suggestions. Parents liked the way i worked with their kids.
This off season I revised my old defense playbook that I used with my old team and shared it with the DC and HC. They liked it, last year they struggled on defense. They adopted the playbook and just changes a few names.
I spent some time this off seasons mapping all the fronts we saw last year. Next week I meet with the OC to evaluate all of our blocking schemes in the playbook.
So what I am saying that in most cases your ability to make suggestions and more importantly have your suggestions get proper consideration, is earned. If you do your job well and are a good soldier, understand who the boss is, I think you earn the opportunity to influence the program. It's like the only Stephen Covey concept "area of influence" vs. "area of control". If you do a good on your "area of control", your "area of influence" tends to widen.
Another key factor is timing! When i was Head Coach I hated hair brained ideas on the sideline. Or "hey I saw this play". There is a time and a place for suggestions.
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Post by coachcb on Mar 31, 2007 13:44:28 GMT -6
As long as the input is away from the field, I am always open to suggestions. However, if I am hearing the same ol bs every week (ie I saw the Pats run this and that) I am going to lose patience in a hurry. I had an assistant a few years back who was always nagging me to plug in Madden plays and terminology.
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Post by CVBears on Mar 31, 2007 16:00:25 GMT -6
Our HC encourages input from the assistants. not x's and o's during the season (during a game is rediculous to me), maybe a wrinkle here and there during the offseason. But, in a game, our HC has all of our duties listed out for giving input. what is the front, how many in the box, is this player getting reached/logged/etc., is the reverse there, etc. There is a job at the bottom for all of us that says, "find useful information." Anything that isn't on our list, but could be used in our playcalling to exploit a weakness that we didn't get on film or picked up as the game flows.
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Post by coachcb on Mar 31, 2007 16:07:51 GMT -6
In the middle of a game, I do what he wants me to do and only give other feedback if it's something that he's clearly missed.
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Post by ajreaper on Mar 31, 2007 21:42:26 GMT -6
This past season I had our HC blow up at me on the head sets- we had a guard that plain and simple he sucked. He couldn't block anyone. We are in the red zone and run a play that just gets blown up and he asks what had happened and I told him "Nate sucks" that's what happened. LOL, he blew up screaming in the head sets not to bad mouth the kid he was all we had etc. After he calmed down I told him I'd need not do that if we'd remember that when we are calling plays in critical situations- he got the point (we'd hd the converstion before). In some situations there's no time to wait for a better time and no point in beating around the bush. A good AC speaks his mind it's up to the HC to listen and evaluate the info. I'm not going to get into an argument in front of kids or something but I'll be damned if I'll stay quiet with the outcome still in doubt.
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Post by kboyd on Apr 1, 2007 8:20:12 GMT -6
We have a tight group and as long as the advice doesn't come at an innapropriate time, I very much so appreciate the input of our assistants. I learned a long time ago that I don't know everything and not just in football. If you want to keep growing as a person and a coach, you have to listen to those around you. After all, don't we all ask for help/opinions from strangers on this board?
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Post by coachd5085 on Apr 1, 2007 8:22:44 GMT -6
What about things such as personnel, practice structure, discipline, offseason calender, awards, team philosophy....everything seems to be pointed at x's and o's here.
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Post by champ93 on Apr 1, 2007 9:08:35 GMT -6
This past season I had our HC blow up at me on the head sets- we had a guard that plain and simple he sucked. He couldn't block anyone. We are in the red zone and run a play that just gets blown up and he asks what had happened and I told him "Nate sucks" that's what happened. LOL, he blew up screaming in the head sets not to bad mouth the kid he was all we had etc. After he calmed down I told him I'd need not do that if we'd remember that when we are calling plays in critical situations- he got the point (we'd hd the converstion before). In some situations there's no time to wait for a better time and no point in beating around the bush. A good AC speaks his mind it's up to the HC to listen and evaluate the info. I'm not going to get into an argument in front of kids or something but I'll be damned if I'll stay quiet with the outcome still in doubt. aj--i would have blown up on you too. Being told a kid sucks doesn't help me call a play. How about "so and so missed his block." That would be more helpful. Perhaps your comment about this kids ability would have been better served during the week's practices in order to have time to find a suitable replacement. An assistant's role is to do just that--assist. I give my assistants most of the power to decide who is best at their position. If a kid is with the #1s during practice and I don't see why, I discuss it with the assistant privately. I ask for input regarding all kinds of issues but ultimately it's my name in the program and my responsibility to lead.
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Post by coachd5085 on Apr 1, 2007 9:24:08 GMT -6
champ--aj said they had previous conversations about the topic, presumably during the week. Obviously based on the HC reply, there wasn't a suitable replacement, therefore I don't think aj was so horribly guilty (other than he could have been heard by others,) that in the heat of the moment the HC screwed up and forgot that there was a definite need to run to the OTHER guard in crucial situations. Again, according to AJ, this was discussed.
No deference should be paid to the HC, especially one that doesn't pay attention to detail. The HC doesn't suffer a loss more than the AC's
I would bet a round of beers that this fact was not noted on the HC call sheet--most likely the HC didnt have a situational call sheet.
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Post by bulldogoption on Apr 1, 2007 12:51:01 GMT -6
If the suggestions fits within our general scheme. Often, and not blaming anyone I was the same as an Asst. coach, the Asst. coaches don't have a grasp for the entire scheme. Something cool from a clinic, that other teams do well, may be a great technique, but not fit our system......
but to answer the original question, suggestions are great. when the head coach is confident in what he knows he can tell you yes or no and why without it being personal
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Post by playfast on Apr 1, 2007 13:40:22 GMT -6
I beleive it is good that your players hear another voice at times. Just make sure the assistants are on the same page as you.
I am open to any suggestions from my assistants even during the year. I have a few reasons for that.
1. It shows that they are thinking about football and not just one of those guys wearing a tshirt with the school's name on it. 2. I do not know everything. Even though you know what the assistant suggested is not a great idea it still makes me think that I could improve my strategy or teaching in that area. 3. How do people learn? By asking questions or making suggestions!!
I am the Head Coach and I will make all final decsions but I feel it is imperative to have staff that wants to work and learn and if you could study their suggestions and incoprorate them into your offense, defense, pregame, or practice you are encouraging them to keep working.
Most of my staff nows though before they make a suggestion they are to bounce their ideas off each other so if it is something that the rest of the staff does not agree with it probably will not fly with me.
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Post by CVBears on Apr 1, 2007 13:43:32 GMT -6
What about things such as personnel, practice structure, discipline, offseason calender, awards, team philosophy....everything seems to be pointed at x's and o's here. For personnel, the position coach makes the call. If we "need a guy" in a particular position (much like aj needed a guard), HC will help us find that guy from different areas. Of course, HC has the final say and if he makes a "suggestion" when needed, it is done. Practice structure...totally the HC. We tell him what we need to work on during indy or maybe cutting skelly by 5 minutes and adding it to inside run or team. Script is up to the coordinators on both sides of the ball. Coach is the architect. Assistants get to choose what kind of wood to build the house. However, if the carpenter tries to build the house with toothpicks, the architect will definitely take a trip to the lumber yard with the carpenter to get 2x4's. Discipine is completely the HC. Most other things that involved off season structure, calendars, academic policies and team philosophy, our HC asks for suggestions, we all give him suggestions and he makes the final decision. Having a coach that is not ego driven and a tight-knit staff helps a ton. Everyone understands who's in charge, their roles and that the HC's door is always open for reasonable suggestions.
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Post by coachbw on Apr 1, 2007 16:00:56 GMT -6
As a HC I would like to think that i am open to suggestions. I think that you hire your assistants to help you do the right thing for the program. One thing that does drive me crazy is when someone wants to give input or second guess after a coordinator or myself has made a decision. For example, if it is March and wetrying to decide whether or not to cut in our 3 step game, or what to charge for our summer weight program, etc. I want as much input as the guys can give. Once we make that decision I want it to be a unified front. I don't need any of the assistants giving input after the decision has been made (until we get to the point of evaluating what we are doing). Not sure if that makes sense . . .
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Post by briangilbert on Apr 1, 2007 16:03:43 GMT -6
As an assistant I've been on both sides of the fence. I've had a Head Coach who did everything his way, and did not care for anyone's input. And even when he got input (when he did ask) he would disregard anything you said. As a result because this coach wasn't a very smart man he lost the respect of the rest of the staff real quick (and players).
The other HC i have coached for is much more intelligent and listens to anyone's ideas. The result is the staff has a much better working relationship, and if we ever run into problems we can talk it out or develop a solution (the kids also believe in him).
So I believe it is better to have a HC who listens for ideas rather then the latter. No one could carry the load all by themselves, the game is much too complex.
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Post by coachd5085 on Apr 1, 2007 16:32:05 GMT -6
coachbw--what you said makes a TON of sense. Take input...come to a decision, and that is that till it is time to reevaluate again. That is something I think that all HC's should tell their staff..especially the younger guys. "Hey guys..i want input but, once we make a decision, we make a decision. "
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CoachJ
Junior Member
Posts: 307
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Post by CoachJ on Apr 1, 2007 18:42:29 GMT -6
from your assistants? Or would you prefer they just work hard and keep their ideas to themselves? How much does YOUR OWN EGO affect your ability to accept suggestions (or at least HEAR them?)... Weren't you just an HC? How well did you take suggestions from assistants? Our HC not only welcomes suggestions but encourages them. When we are infront of players though, he is always right unless he is mistaken about something where he is contradicting himself from earlier. Our HC doesn't design the offense or the defense nor does he call any plays. He more approves and makes decisions on what we come up with.
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