|
Post by fbdoc on Oct 8, 2007 16:47:54 GMT -6
Any of you see the play where Trent Green got hurt? My question is, was his block a "Clean" block by a QB on a DL, or was it a "Cheap Shot" at the knees? I say it was a clean aggressive block. Too bad his head got in the way.
|
|
|
Post by spencerxi on Oct 8, 2007 19:32:17 GMT -6
I don't think it was a smart play by him. I think its clean, however it would not be my approach to a block like that. I think I would have been just as mad as the DL that took the shoot and then got up and go in greens face. I would have gone for the back side shoulder instead. Physics wasn't really on Trents side for that shot
|
|
|
Post by lionhart on Oct 8, 2007 19:34:06 GMT -6
i disagree. no way should a qb be going BELOW the knees on a d-lineman..... ever. its a stupid move and, although i dont wish injury on anyone, he got whatg was comin. the NUMBER 1 thing d-lineman are protective of is their knees. no injury can end a career quicker... especially for a big guy. if the roles were reversed, and a d-lineman on a peel-back block had cut a qb... what would be the reaction?
|
|
|
Post by phantom on Oct 8, 2007 19:57:44 GMT -6
If it was a legal block, what's the problem?
|
|
|
Post by CVBears on Oct 8, 2007 20:26:12 GMT -6
If it was a legal block, what's the problem? that's what I was thinking
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on Oct 8, 2007 20:29:39 GMT -6
While technically correct phantom, I thought it was kind of busy league myself. He probably could have gotten the same effect from just chipping a shoulder. I think what made it kind of cheap was it was a blind cut, and against those top heavy guys, it is more likely to catch the leg firmly planted.
|
|
|
Post by wildcat on Oct 8, 2007 20:56:54 GMT -6
Like someone already said, if the roles were reversed and it was that d-lineman going low on Green, that d-lineman would have a much lighter wallet.
|
|
|
Post by Yash on Oct 8, 2007 21:44:27 GMT -6
I got no problem with him cutting him. You want a QB to try and take a DL on high? Now QB's probably don't work on blocking very often so the execution was poor and result shows that. As long as the rule book states its a legal block whats the problem with it?
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on Oct 8, 2007 22:00:25 GMT -6
For you guys that don't have a problem with it...do you have a problem with the DL celebrating the (potentially) career ending concussion?
|
|
|
Post by CVBears on Oct 8, 2007 23:12:58 GMT -6
For you guys that don't have a problem with it...do you have a problem with the DL celebrating the (potentially) career ending concussion? great question...this is where things get very gray/fuzzy for me. at first, I do have a problem with the DL celebrating the concussion, only because of the intentions of the celebration. as soon as one starts talking about intentions, black and white issues are no longer black and white. although legal, trent green knew the potential damage he could do to others and himself, but decided to preform the block anyway. But even as I write this, if someone gets hurt as a result of any play, is it ever okay to celebrate their demise? If a player, that has been instructed other wise, keeps his head down when he tackles and gets hurt, should the other team celebrate because the hurt player "got what he deserved?"
|
|
|
Post by wildcat on Oct 8, 2007 23:23:37 GMT -6
NFL d-linemen have been hammered by the league when they breathe on QBs too much and now, one of those QBs who is a beneficiary of that preferential treatment levels a potentially career-threatening blindside block against a d-lineman? I don't condone celebrating when an opposing player (or anyone, for that matter) gets injured, but I can certainly understand why this particular player reacted the way he did.
Furthermore, we are talking about the man's livelihood here...how would any of us react if someone tried to take our ability to earn a living away? There was no reason that Green had to hit that guy as low as he did. Completely uncalled for.
I think that it is totally BS what Green did...in fact, I think the NFL should pass a rule that says quarterbacks can not go downfield and block for other offensive players in light of the fact that defensive players really have to treat rushing the QB with kid gloves.
|
|
|
Post by olinecoach61 on Oct 9, 2007 6:30:37 GMT -6
Green got what he deserved, karma baby...
|
|
|
Post by coachsky on Oct 9, 2007 7:16:21 GMT -6
I'm with Oline and DC Ohio. You reap what you sow. You cut a guy like that and get hurt - too bad. It's legal to cut, but man I think there are times to cut and times to back off. It's a fine line. Karma might be saying that Trent crossed that line.
He wasn't celebrating Green's injury. He just saw his career flash in front of his eyes. He was pissed, not happy the guy was hurt.
|
|
|
Post by coachroberts99 on Oct 9, 2007 7:16:29 GMT -6
I've looked at it a hundred times, and still see no problem with it.... ask why was it a blinside. It was because old #99 was running from left to right with no idea what was going to be in the way. Sorry how often do we hear guys shouting at LBers "head on a swivel", to me this is no different.
The block was poorly exectued and unfortunately TG paid the price, but if #99 had got a free shot at TG in the back on a passing down would he have given two shits about his health?
Given the opportunity every football player wants to drop someone, it was a clean and legal hit and to be honest if TG hadn't have got hurt I really doubt anyone would still be talking about it... instead it would be just another highlight reel hit that we all love watching.
It was a freak injury, and luckily a rare one and I think we should leave it at that IMHO.
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on Oct 9, 2007 7:38:05 GMT -6
dc--thank you, you summed up nicely what I didn't have time to do.
Coach Roberts--I agree with you, BUT I would also say, If he tried to blast Green blindside, AND THEN after making the hit, he crumpled to the ground, I think Green's reaction could have been the same.
It is more of a "YEAY, YOU CAN'T HURT ME" thing than a "YEAH, YOU GOT HURT thing.
|
|
|
Post by Yash on Oct 9, 2007 7:51:08 GMT -6
Well wildcat, you say QBs should not be able to go down field and block, but technically he wasn't downfield. he was in the backfield. Should all blindside hits be illegal then? If I was going to get blindsided I think a QB is the guy I'd want to blindside me not a TE or FB. How was it uncalled for that green went low on johnson? A 220lb QB has no chance taking a 320lb DT high, he woulda got steam rolled. I don't understand why people see this as a cheap shot. It was during the play, it was around the play and it was a legal block.
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on Oct 9, 2007 7:54:58 GMT -6
Yash--I think a point to consider is that the block would have been effective if he had simply chipped on the shoulder. A 220 QB has no chance taking on a 320 DT on a base or iso block...that same 220 qb could easily just chip into the unaware DT's shoulder and create the diversion needed.
|
|
|
Post by Yash on Oct 9, 2007 8:24:43 GMT -6
What does a QB want to protect though his shoulder, thats what he uses to pass with. He is probably thinking the safest bet here is to get down and take him low. Obviously a poorly executed cut block may have ended his career. If I see a 320lb guy running at me at full speed, I'm not thinking about taking him high. You don't stop an 18 wheeler by hitting it in the front of the truck, you take out the tires.
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on Oct 9, 2007 8:28:23 GMT -6
yash--very valid points, from the QB's point of view. From the DL's vantage point....."I am not the fastest guy in the world. I really don't have an angle, and any angle I DO have will be lost if somebody just kind of nudges me frmo the side. Why am I flipping over now...why did someting just cut my knee out...."
|
|
|
Post by Yash on Oct 9, 2007 9:05:53 GMT -6
It was 2 guys both going full speed playing hard, trying to make a play. I see nothing cheap, or out of the rules about it. If this would have been away from the play like the Warren sapp on chad clifton hit than maybe we got an argument but both guys were trying to make plays and green unfortunately got his head in the way of johnson's knee.
|
|
|
Post by coachbdud on Oct 9, 2007 11:24:26 GMT -6
i have no problem with the D linemen celebrating, even if Greens career is over, because Green very easily could have ended the D linemens career wiht thet block, if his leg is planted when he makes that cut the D linemen has AT LEAST a torn MCL
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on Oct 9, 2007 12:02:15 GMT -6
OK..just out of curiousity... I would love to see the coaching responsbilities of those who have posted in the thread--
Mostly a Defensive backs coach here.
|
|
|
Post by olinecoach61 on Oct 9, 2007 18:49:14 GMT -6
OLine / OC
|
|
|
Post by fort on Oct 9, 2007 19:17:49 GMT -6
Maybe it's just my knee problems talking (and the fact that I was a DT), but while the block was legal, I think it was definitely cheap and uncalled for. I am not a big fan of the free cut-blocking rules the NFL has, anyway. I cringe whenever I see one outside of what would be the FBZ (especially against flow like Green's block). Scary stuff. I can't blame Johnson at all for what he did after the play and his comments after the game. I find it very ironic Green initiates a cheap block (IMO) and he's the one who's career is likely over. Like the other guys have said, maybe its karma...
|
|
|
Post by Yash on Oct 9, 2007 21:38:09 GMT -6
what makes this block cheap? it wasn't away from the play, it was a legal hit, he hit him from the front ( i guess the side) but it wasn't a shot from behind or anything. I don't get what makes this shot cheap. unless you are saying a cut block is a cheap block. I don't know, i don't see anything cheap about this. It was around the play just trying to make something happen.
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on Oct 10, 2007 7:43:51 GMT -6
Yash--postion/ coaching responsibilities?
|
|
|
Post by Yash on Oct 10, 2007 11:16:37 GMT -6
I coach RBs now, I played DT and QB in high school, coached QBs and head JV coach for a high school.
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on Oct 10, 2007 11:43:14 GMT -6
Anybody see a trend here? Defensive coaches..and the OL...vs RB's and QB
|
|
coachpodach
Freshmen Member
We're on a mission from God...
Posts: 69
|
Post by coachpodach on Oct 10, 2007 11:52:50 GMT -6
O-line coach speaking out here...This was just an unfortunate injury resulting from a QB doing too much. If the pro QB's are going to be protected as they are, they should back away from the action, and not block either. Something just isn't right about that...put 'em in skirts.
|
|
|
Post by tye2021 on Oct 10, 2007 17:20:08 GMT -6
I don't know if I'd call it acheap shot but...the NFL needs to do more to protect the most difficult positions football OL & DL. If a small CB on a blitz hit a big QB like Culpepper that low he would have been at the very least fined. I don't blame Trent Green I blame the league's competition commitee.
|
|