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Post by hsrose on Aug 15, 2019 14:51:29 GMT -6
When do you call it a day and fold the varsity program? I know all the stuff about quitting, gutting it out, being heroic in the face of long odds, Spartans, last great act of defiance, hold the rope, all that. I'm a full-time drinker of that cool-aid. But that's in the abstract. I'm facing this here and now and it's getting damn hard.
I see posts where teams have 14 with 5 Fr/So and they play, others have 16 and they go to the playoffs. One of my coaches goes to the 'I played on a team of 15 and we went 5-4', but he's 68 from a small school in a galaxy far, far away. I'm sitting here right now with 18 bodies on varsity. 29 on JV. And I have tried to bring up JV to play but either the kid or parents refuse to come up, and I cannot force them to come up. I have 2 Sophs on varsity right now, both are likely to start both ways and special teams.
Of the 18 bodies, 1 is a 115# girl (5 older brothers, Marine Corp. dad, I'm learning new words and phrases from her every day), 2 are soccer players that have never played before and are #150 or so. I just lost 2 seniors that have transferred to another school. They were captains and 2-way players. That dropped us to 18. One of my other seniors hurt his ankle in a tackle drill (half-speed, onto bags) yesterday and is out for at least 2 weeks. Had 15 at practice yesterday - 2 were working, 1 had a Dr. appt. Ended with 14 after the Sr. twisted his ankle. Anyway, on the personal side both of my dogs just died (true), my house is in shatters (kitchen remodel, true), and the light was in my eyes (false). Its indeed a sad tale of woe and misery.
Legal Aspect: I'm in CA and yesterday I had to go to the dentist get a new crown done. They made me wear sunglasses/safety glasses during the procedure because somebody somewhere dropped an instrument on a woman that caused her to lose an eye. And, as explained to me by the AD if I knowingly put a player on the field that is not ready to fully participate, and that player is then injured as a result of playing, the (possible) lawsuit would be negligence and in the $5M range. I am not ready to take that risk. 3 seasons ago I almost lost my whole helmet inventory because a parent (also a coach) bought a 'safer' helmet (Virginia Tech document) and that would have made it "a safety equipment imbalance for the other players based on $$" so I would have had to replace the full inventory. The school attorney was about ready to impose that. The helmet sales rep was able to talk him down off the ledge, but it was very close. The school here is not fond of anything that sniffs at being possibly legal.
I am in the position of having a couple of injuries and then putting players on the field that are not ready to play at the varsity level. I can hide them on offense, I can't hide them on defense. I have no real prospect of getting any players from the JV. I have no real prospect of getting players from the school, the players hit the recruiting trail hard yesterday and got a sophomore who is in special ed, and a Frosh that is a national level speedster apparently and the parents have said won't/will not/ain't gonna happen play varsity.
When do you call it? Has anyone ever called it? I ain't looking for any Oh Poor Me stuff here. I want to proceed but that legal thing ($ payout x probability of happening is still a big number) keeps coming up as the ranks get thinner.
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Post by aceback76 on Aug 15, 2019 15:15:15 GMT -6
I guess you "signed on" for THIS SEASON! Haven't your kids "sacrificed to get ready, and aren't they looking to YOU for guidance (put THEM first)? Eliminate all the self-pity & finish THIS season. If you want to hang it up, do so THEN!
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Post by blb on Aug 15, 2019 15:27:19 GMT -6
I have posted this before but my bottom line was 17 players.
Basically "a pair and spare," not allowing for cross-training.
3 WR 2 TE 3 OT 3 OG 2 C 2 QB 3 RB
3 DE 3 DT 3 OLB 2 MLB 3 CB 3 S
Even then it is problematic if you can finish season (injuries etc.)
Or be able to practice efficiently enough to be competitive, depending on level.
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Post by carookie on Aug 15, 2019 15:50:19 GMT -6
So, i dont know how much this will resonate, due to the differences of the situation, but i am in a relatively similar boat. Several years back i has hired to coach at a very small school. Initially i was going to be a hs ac, but they needed a jh 8-man hc so i said Id do it (had coached ha for a decade but it was a fun new challenge). Plus i was the hciw for hs so it was a good way to develop my system while i waited.
The numbers at the hs were low, they fielded 16 all season for varsity, but overall the school was struggling more. And they without warning shutdown the hs in May. This caused a lot of problems including crushing our jh enrollment. We started summer workouts with 4, and held steady for about a month. I was able to finagle a co-op but that has currently put our number up to 10 (well, 9.5 as one dad calls me every other day about pulling his son for fear of low numbers leading to injury).
It really is difficult, and i have to soul search a lot about player safety and where is that line. Most schools we play will have 5x our enrollment. A number of them are directly attached to big time recruiting programs that are stacked with d1 players. It is not an exageration to say that my lb can be outweighed by 80+ pounds by opposing rbs, and my guy wont get to sub out. People talk about ‘never considering calling off games for safety’ probably never had to deal with these types if dangerous mismatches.
I am still trying to make it work, and maybe this can help, because there are a handfull of boys who want to play ball, and i know i can teach them the right way. But as long as i can field a team then i want them to be able to get to play. Do we stand much shot at winning? Not really, but there is so much more to gain. Selfishly, i recognize this will probably be it for me being able to coach. I know people say there is always somewhere for someone, but my situation is really unique and i doubt opportunities remain. So though these last few months have not been the best, id enjoy one last go round wearing the whistle
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2019 16:41:33 GMT -6
When do you call it a day and fold the varsity program? I know all the stuff about quitting, gutting it out, being heroic in the face of long odds, Spartans, last great act of defiance, hold the rope, all that. I'm a full-time drinker of that cool-aid. But that's in the abstract. I'm facing this here and now and it's getting damn hard. I see posts where teams have 14 with 5 Fr/So and they play, others have 16 and they go to the playoffs. One of my coaches goes to the 'I played on a team of 15 and we went 5-4', but he's 68 from a small school in a galaxy far, far away. I'm sitting here right now with 18 bodies on varsity. 29 on JV. And I have tried to bring up JV to play but either the kid or parents refuse to come up, and I cannot force them to come up. I have 2 Sophs on varsity right now, both are likely to start both ways and special teams. Of the 18 bodies, 1 is a 115# girl (5 older brothers, Marine Corp. dad, I'm learning new words and phrases from her every day), 2 are soccer players that have never played before and are #150 or so. I just lost 2 seniors that have transferred to another school. They were captains and 2-way players. That dropped us to 18. One of my other seniors hurt his ankle in a tackle drill (half-speed, onto bags) yesterday and is out for at least 2 weeks. Had 15 at practice yesterday - 2 were working, 1 had a Dr. appt. Ended with 14 after the Sr. twisted his ankle. Anyway, on the personal side both of my dogs just died (true), my house is in shatters (kitchen remodel, true), and the light was in my eyes (false). Its indeed a sad tale of woe and misery. Legal Aspect: I'm in CA and yesterday I had to go to the dentist get a new crown done. They made me wear sunglasses/safety glasses during the procedure because somebody somewhere dropped an instrument on a woman that caused her to lose an eye. And, as explained to me by the AD if I knowingly put a player on the field that is not ready to fully participate, and that player is then injured as a result of playing, the (possible) lawsuit would be negligence and in the $5M range. I am not ready to take that risk. 3 seasons ago I almost lost my whole helmet inventory because a parent (also a coach) bought a 'safer' helmet (Virginia Tech document) and that would have made it "a safety equipment imbalance for the other players based on $$" so I would have had to replace the full inventory. The school attorney was about ready to impose that. The helmet sales rep was able to talk him down off the ledge, but it was very close. The school here is not fond of anything that sniffs at being possibly legal. I am in the position of having a couple of injuries and then putting players on the field that are not ready to play at the varsity level. I can hide them on offense, I can't hide them on defense. I have no real prospect of getting any players from the JV. I have no real prospect of getting players from the school, the players hit the recruiting trail hard yesterday and got a sophomore who is in special ed, and a Frosh that is a national level speedster apparently and the parents have said won't/will not/ain't gonna happen play varsity. When do you call it? Has anyone ever called it? I ain't looking for any Oh Poor Me stuff here. I want to proceed but that legal thing ($ payout x probability of happening is still a big number) keeps coming up as the ranks get thinner. If you can survive the season, leave. Let the school be out of options and close it themselves
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Post by 54695469 on Aug 15, 2019 17:16:49 GMT -6
You don't want to hear it, but in my first head coaching job, we had 13 players in the whole high school program during year one.... Finished 1-9. Took a while, but ten years later went 15-0 and won a state championship (and had plenty of players). We would not have don't that if we'd have folded in year one. That said, I'm in Texas. You're in California - not exactly comparing apples to apples. Folks around here aren't into litigation as much as they are out west.
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Post by aceback76 on Aug 15, 2019 18:13:10 GMT -6
When do you call it a day and fold the varsity program? I know all the stuff about quitting, gutting it out, being heroic in the face of long odds, Spartans, last great act of defiance, hold the rope, all that. I'm a full-time drinker of that cool-aid. But that's in the abstract. I'm facing this here and now and it's getting damn hard. I see posts where teams have 14 with 5 Fr/So and they play, others have 16 and they go to the playoffs. One of my coaches goes to the 'I played on a team of 15 and we went 5-4', but he's 68 from a small school in a galaxy far, far away. I'm sitting here right now with 18 bodies on varsity. 29 on JV. And I have tried to bring up JV to play but either the kid or parents refuse to come up, and I cannot force them to come up. I have 2 Sophs on varsity right now, both are likely to start both ways and special teams. Of the 18 bodies, 1 is a 115# girl (5 older brothers, Marine Corp. dad, I'm learning new words and phrases from her every day), 2 are soccer players that have never played before and are #150 or so. I just lost 2 seniors that have transferred to another school. They were captains and 2-way players. That dropped us to 18. One of my other seniors hurt his ankle in a tackle drill (half-speed, onto bags) yesterday and is out for at least 2 weeks. Had 15 at practice yesterday - 2 were working, 1 had a Dr. appt. Ended with 14 after the Sr. twisted his ankle. Anyway, on the personal side both of my dogs just died (true), my house is in shatters (kitchen remodel, true), and the light was in my eyes (false). Its indeed a sad tale of woe and misery. Legal Aspect: I'm in CA and yesterday I had to go to the dentist get a new crown done. They made me wear sunglasses/safety glasses during the procedure because somebody somewhere dropped an instrument on a woman that caused her to lose an eye. And, as explained to me by the AD if I knowingly put a player on the field that is not ready to fully participate, and that player is then injured as a result of playing, the (possible) lawsuit would be negligence and in the $5M range. I am not ready to take that risk. 3 seasons ago I almost lost my whole helmet inventory because a parent (also a coach) bought a 'safer' helmet (Virginia Tech document) and that would have made it "a safety equipment imbalance for the other players based on $$" so I would have had to replace the full inventory. The school attorney was about ready to impose that. The helmet sales rep was able to talk him down off the ledge, but it was very close. The school here is not fond of anything that sniffs at being possibly legal. I am in the position of having a couple of injuries and then putting players on the field that are not ready to play at the varsity level. I can hide them on offense, I can't hide them on defense. I have no real prospect of getting any players from the JV. I have no real prospect of getting players from the school, the players hit the recruiting trail hard yesterday and got a sophomore who is in special ed, and a Frosh that is a national level speedster apparently and the parents have said won't/will not/ain't gonna happen play varsity. When do you call it? Has anyone ever called it? I ain't looking for any Oh Poor Me stuff here. I want to proceed but that legal thing ($ payout x probability of happening is still a big number) keeps coming up as the ranks get thinner. Try this approach in building that TEAM: This inspired me when I read it. It is the essence of building a football TEAM'S Morale: THE FIGHTER: "I am the last of a dying breed. I will tell you the truth even if you do not like it. Many of you do not like me and are afraid of me because I tell it like it is and you do not like to hear it. I am always there for my friends. I will tell them the truth even if they do not like it because that is what a friend does. Strength and honor are my bloodline. I will back my friends and stand with them even if there is an army standing in front of us. I will fight to the end. Death before dishonor is our motto. I am a man with honor" . This is what it is all about, and it is our job to convey that to our players. That is the way it is and what the sport of football is all about.
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Post by freezeoption on Aug 15, 2019 18:42:28 GMT -6
Coached an 11 man team with 17 players one year went 1-9. Coached an 8 man team with 10 players one being a down syndrome kid that had seizures. Coached a jv 11 man team with 12. The 8 man team didn't win a game often played with hurt kids but put them where there was no contact so we could play. Really played with 7 or 6. That jv team went 10-0. Great group of kids with many going on to play in college. You could move your kids down to jv and forfeit varsity. We didn't we played but I can see what your thinking and I've been there. My superintendent at the 8 man school had no clue. A lot of the guys on here don't understand what it's like.
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Post by Defcord on Aug 15, 2019 18:47:41 GMT -6
If you are really worried about the legal aspect, you need to get it in writing from higher ups that you are covered and protected by school liability or you need to get out.
There’s no way I would put my family at that high of a financial risk if I felt there was any real probability of a law suit.
It’s a weird situation and I would ask for clear guidelines on evaluating players readiness to participate without putting me at risk. If those couldn’t be provided, then I wouldn’t coach. I wouldn’t shut down the whole operation, I would just step aside.
And if I were bitter I might be thorough in my explanation with the local media. If I weren’t bitter, I would state personal reasons.
On a side note I always thought it was much easier to hide a kid on defense. Besides the defensive line they can usually completely avoid contact all together, especially dbs because receivers are trying to get away to get open and ball carriers are trying to score.
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Post by Defcord on Aug 15, 2019 18:54:57 GMT -6
Coached an 11 man team with 17 players one year went 1-9. Coached an 8 man team with 10 players one being a down syndrome kid that had seizures. Coached a jv 11 man team with 12. The 8 man team didn't win a game often played with hurt kids but put them where there was no contact so we could play. Really played with 7 or 6. That jv team went 10-0. Great group of kids with many going on to play in college. You could move your kids down to jv and forfeit varsity. We didn't we played but I can see what your thinking and I've been there. My superintendent at the 8 man school had no clue. A lot of the guys on here don't understand what it's like. This brought back memories. My freshmen year we played with 12. 11 freshmen and the worst sophomore to ever play the game of football just in case we needed a sub. We only won 1 game and the other teams coaches and fans cussed us like a church league softball game on the way to our bus and swore we wouldn’t have beaten them without a tenth grader on the team. That kid probably heard those fools and thought he was Lawerence Taylor!
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Post by coachscdub on Aug 15, 2019 19:49:22 GMT -6
My alma mater was the biggest school in our league (enrollment between 1500-2000, i cant remember what they were that specific year) and in the mid 90's around 96-97 i believe they canceled the varsity program for the year for lack of turn out. The Juniors went down and played JV the Seniors unfortunately went without. The following season they started the Varsity program back up and were able to go on to one of the best records in school history.
The point of this is, perhaps you have to scrap the varsity this year, give your seniors an honest and sincere apology, inform them as to why this is happening and thank them for their time and commitment. Take the Varsity staff and combine it with the JV and try and build from within. Make the goal to be the best JV team in your league, and hopefully the following year those JV kids will stay on, those Frosh kids who will then be Sophs will perhaps be more willing/more able to move up.
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Post by 53 on Aug 15, 2019 20:10:43 GMT -6
Who decides if they’re physically fit to be varsity and where is that metric.
I’ve seen 130 pound professional ass kickers and I’ve seen 300 pound marshmallows that couldn’t move at all.
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Post by wingtol on Aug 15, 2019 20:45:02 GMT -6
What are the other teams you play like? Similar size rosters?
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Post by carookie on Aug 15, 2019 20:52:07 GMT -6
Who decides if they’re physically fit to be varsity and where is that metric. I’ve seen 130 pound professional ass kickers and I’ve seen 300 pound marshmallows that couldn’t move at all. In both your examples the players had something positive. What about that 115 lb marshmallow? You gonna let him try to tackle 220 lb future d1 stud for a whole night? There are some massive mis matches that shake out on the field, and for certain there are people who physically should not be on a varsity field. Not being to quantify a specific number doesnt mean it doesnt exist
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humble
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Post by humble on Aug 16, 2019 6:50:39 GMT -6
When do you call it a day and fold the varsity program? I know all the stuff about quitting, gutting it out, being heroic in the face of long odds, Spartans, last great act of defiance, hold the rope, all that. I'm a full-time drinker of that cool-aid. But that's in the abstract. I'm facing this here and now and it's getting damn hard. I see posts where teams have 14 with 5 Fr/So and they play, others have 16 and they go to the playoffs. One of my coaches goes to the 'I played on a team of 15 and we went 5-4', but he's 68 from a small school in a galaxy far, far away. I'm sitting here right now with 18 bodies on varsity. 29 on JV. And I have tried to bring up JV to play but either the kid or parents refuse to come up, and I cannot force them to come up. I have 2 Sophs on varsity right now, both are likely to start both ways and special teams. Of the 18 bodies, 1 is a 115# girl (5 older brothers, Marine Corp. dad, I'm learning new words and phrases from her every day), 2 are soccer players that have never played before and are #150 or so. I just lost 2 seniors that have transferred to another school. They were captains and 2-way players. That dropped us to 18. One of my other seniors hurt his ankle in a tackle drill (half-speed, onto bags) yesterday and is out for at least 2 weeks. Had 15 at practice yesterday - 2 were working, 1 had a Dr. appt. Ended with 14 after the Sr. twisted his ankle. Anyway, on the personal side both of my dogs just died (true), my house is in shatters (kitchen remodel, true), and the light was in my eyes (false). Its indeed a sad tale of woe and misery. Legal Aspect: I'm in CA and yesterday I had to go to the dentist get a new crown done. They made me wear sunglasses/safety glasses during the procedure because somebody somewhere dropped an instrument on a woman that caused her to lose an eye. And, as explained to me by the AD if I knowingly put a player on the field that is not ready to fully participate, and that player is then injured as a result of playing, the (possible) lawsuit would be negligence and in the $5M range. I am not ready to take that risk. 3 seasons ago I almost lost my whole helmet inventory because a parent (also a coach) bought a 'safer' helmet (Virginia Tech document) and that would have made it "a safety equipment imbalance for the other players based on $$" so I would have had to replace the full inventory. The school attorney was about ready to impose that. The helmet sales rep was able to talk him down off the ledge, but it was very close. The school here is not fond of anything that sniffs at being possibly legal. I am in the position of having a couple of injuries and then putting players on the field that are not ready to play at the varsity level. I can hide them on offense, I can't hide them on defense. I have no real prospect of getting any players from the JV. I have no real prospect of getting players from the school, the players hit the recruiting trail hard yesterday and got a sophomore who is in special ed, and a Frosh that is a national level speedster apparently and the parents have said won't/will not/ain't gonna happen play varsity. When do you call it? Has anyone ever called it? I ain't looking for any Oh Poor Me stuff here. I want to proceed but that legal thing ($ payout x probability of happening is still a big number) keeps coming up as the ranks get thinner. I think you would be much happier coaching in the south.
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Post by rosey65 on Aug 16, 2019 7:15:10 GMT -6
When do you call it a day and fold the varsity program? I know all the stuff about quitting, gutting it out, being heroic in the face of long odds, Spartans, last great act of defiance, hold the rope, all that. I'm a full-time drinker of that cool-aid. But that's in the abstract. I'm facing this here and now and it's getting damn hard. I see posts where teams have 14 with 5 Fr/So and they play, others have 16 and they go to the playoffs. One of my coaches goes to the 'I played on a team of 15 and we went 5-4', but he's 68 from a small school in a galaxy far, far away. I'm sitting here right now with 18 bodies on varsity. 29 on JV. And I have tried to bring up JV to play but either the kid or parents refuse to come up, and I cannot force them to come up. I have 2 Sophs on varsity right now, both are likely to start both ways and special teams. Of the 18 bodies, 1 is a 115# girl (5 older brothers, Marine Corp. dad, I'm learning new words and phrases from her every day), 2 are soccer players that have never played before and are #150 or so. I just lost 2 seniors that have transferred to another school. They were captains and 2-way players. That dropped us to 18. One of my other seniors hurt his ankle in a tackle drill (half-speed, onto bags) yesterday and is out for at least 2 weeks. Had 15 at practice yesterday - 2 were working, 1 had a Dr. appt. Ended with 14 after the Sr. twisted his ankle. Anyway, on the personal side both of my dogs just died (true), my house is in shatters (kitchen remodel, true), and the light was in my eyes (false). Its indeed a sad tale of woe and misery. Legal Aspect: I'm in CA and yesterday I had to go to the dentist get a new crown done. They made me wear sunglasses/safety glasses during the procedure because somebody somewhere dropped an instrument on a woman that caused her to lose an eye. And, as explained to me by the AD if I knowingly put a player on the field that is not ready to fully participate, and that player is then injured as a result of playing, the (possible) lawsuit would be negligence and in the $5M range. I am not ready to take that risk. 3 seasons ago I almost lost my whole helmet inventory because a parent (also a coach) bought a 'safer' helmet (Virginia Tech document) and that would have made it "a safety equipment imbalance for the other players based on $$" so I would have had to replace the full inventory. The school attorney was about ready to impose that. The helmet sales rep was able to talk him down off the ledge, but it was very close. The school here is not fond of anything that sniffs at being possibly legal. I am in the position of having a couple of injuries and then putting players on the field that are not ready to play at the varsity level. I can hide them on offense, I can't hide them on defense. I have no real prospect of getting any players from the JV. I have no real prospect of getting players from the school, the players hit the recruiting trail hard yesterday and got a sophomore who is in special ed, and a Frosh that is a national level speedster apparently and the parents have said won't/will not/ain't gonna happen play varsity. When do you call it? Has anyone ever called it? I ain't looking for any Oh Poor Me stuff here. I want to proceed but that legal thing ($ payout x probability of happening is still a big number) keeps coming up as the ranks get thinner. Get it in writing from the higher-ups, put the legal onus on them. If THEY want you to fold the varsity program this year, then by all means just let it go.
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Post by coachd5085 on Aug 17, 2019 11:34:43 GMT -6
I guess you "signed on" for THIS SEASON! Haven't your kids "sacrificed to get ready, and aren't they looking to YOU for guidance (put THEM first)? Eliminate all the self-pity & finish THIS season. If you want to hang it up, do so THEN! I don't think he is talking about hanging up his whistle because he is no longer interested in coaching? He is saying, at what point do you say it is not in the best interest of all involved to field a Varsity football team this season. Sure, ideally this is something that would be done in the offseason, not in Mid August, but at this point @hsrose is asking for input on how to determine if it is safe for the kids to play.
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Post by freezeoption on Aug 17, 2019 12:28:10 GMT -6
It sounds like your administration is wishy washy. Sounds like you better have insurance above any that the school may offer. By putting it in their lap will help if you live somewhere where people sue a lot. Number one always cover your butt.
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Post by bigmoot on Aug 17, 2019 16:25:49 GMT -6
What's your relationship with opposing coaches. There are 4 teams on my schedule I cant compete with. They could beat me 100-0 if they wanted. They usually get 35 by the half and empty tje bench in the 2nd. Really never worse than 49-7 type scores. They know me and my situation.
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Post by carookie on Aug 17, 2019 17:41:55 GMT -6
What's your relationship with opposing coaches. There are 4 teams on my schedule I cant compete with. They could beat me 100-0 if they wanted. They usually get 35 by the half and empty tje bench in the 2nd. Really never worse than 49-7 type scores. They know me and my situation. This is a very good point. There are some coaches out there that want to set their players up for big hits against smaller opponents and will continue to do so even when the game is out of hand. They are often the one whose players will hit after the whistle, hit above the shoulders on crack-backs, etc etc.
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Post by hsrose on Aug 19, 2019 9:20:20 GMT -6
UPDATE: Had our 3-team scrimmage on Saturday. It went pretty well, QB needs to look at the read key rather than the back, OL need some additional work on assignments, I need some DB's, but overall the kids played well. They were dead tired at the end but they had tasted first blood and they liked it.
I have 17 on the roster as of this morning.
RB/LB is down with a knee something from the scrimmage. He will be checked by the trainer today before practice but from talking with him over the weekend it does not sound good. Very painful, can't bend the knee too much. I don't have much faith that he will be cleared. He got hit but thought it was his calf, finished the scrimmage.
OG, all 5'9", #165 of him, comes out about halfway through the scrimmage, his arm popped out of the socket. It went back in but it was painful. Come to find out he has a torn ligament in the shoulder, the Dr. cleared him to play because he will go in after the season and clean things up. It's already damaged, football isn't likely to add to the carnage, so surgery after the season is fine with him. Trainer and I were not aware of this so it was kind of a surprise when he just casually mentioned 'Oh yeah, I've got this torn ligament so my shoulder pops out all the time...'
The two captains that left on Wednesday were sitting on the far sideline, just watching. Saw a couple of students walk by them. Apparently they were noticed by the parents under the pressbox so the team mom warned me about possible comments being heard on the video.
Got a kid that wants to come out, a soph. Apparently family life is the pits, has been in a lot of fights, sent to several schools including a 'lockdown school' because he is a runner. Back here now and apparently will be eligible to play football. I don't know how, but it may happen. Good eyes, shook my hand, good sized kid. Will likely bring him directly to varsity as the security officer here says that he has never had a mentor, never been involved with sports at the HS. So he might be viable. Or not. Officer said that his mom has been on meth for 15+ years but is now clean so he has a place to stay.
I have realized that I was being sexist in not wanting the girl to play on defense. I realized that she has to be a football player 1st, then a girl. So I am no longer going to try to hide her on offense. On her 1st play on defense the receiver she was covering had to be 1' taller than she.
So we're going into our game this week with 14, maybe 15 players. We're going to play this season as best we can.
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Post by 53 on Aug 19, 2019 11:56:30 GMT -6
Good luck coach, and hopefully this is what that troubled kid needs. At least you're giving him a shot, and now it's on him.
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Post by carookie on Aug 19, 2019 13:04:15 GMT -6
UPDATE: Had our 3-team scrimmage on Saturday. It went pretty well, QB needs to look at the read key rather than the back, OL need some additional work on assignments, I need some DB's, but overall the kids played well. They were dead tired at the end but they had tasted first blood and they liked it. I have 17 on the roster as of this morning. RB/LB is down with a knee something from the scrimmage. He will be checked by the trainer today before practice but from talking with him over the weekend it does not sound good. Very painful, can't bend the knee too much. I don't have much faith that he will be cleared. He got hit but thought it was his calf, finished the scrimmage. OG, all 5'9", #165 of him, comes out about halfway through the scrimmage, his arm popped out of the socket. It went back in but it was painful. Come to find out he has a torn ligament in the shoulder, the Dr. cleared him to play because he will go in after the season and clean things up. It's already damaged, football isn't likely to add to the carnage, so surgery after the season is fine with him. Trainer and I were not aware of this so it was kind of a surprise when he just casually mentioned 'Oh yeah, I've got this torn ligament so my shoulder pops out all the time...' The two captains that left on Wednesday were sitting on the far sideline, just watching. Saw a couple of students walk by them. Apparently they were noticed by the parents under the pressbox so the team mom warned me about possible comments being heard on the video. Got a kid that wants to come out, a soph. Apparently family life is the pits, has been in a lot of fights, sent to several schools including a 'lockdown school' because he is a runner. Back here now and apparently will be eligible to play football. I don't know how, but it may happen. Good eyes, shook my hand, good sized kid. Will likely bring him directly to varsity as the security officer here says that he has never had a mentor, never been involved with sports at the HS. So he might be viable. Or not. Officer said that his mom has been on meth for 15+ years but is now clean so he has a place to stay. I have realized that I was being sexist in not wanting the girl to play on defense. I realized that she has to be a football player 1st, then a girl. So I am no longer going to try to hide her on offense. On her 1st play on defense the receiver she was covering had to be 1' taller than she. So we're going into our game this week with 14, maybe 15 players. We're going to play this season as best we can. Coach, how good is your opposition? I have done the 14-15 on a team before, but it was in the lowest 11-man classification, so very few dominant athletes (and anyone who had a couple NCAA players was basically playoff bound). Are you going up against studs or just average guys?
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Post by 60zgo on Aug 25, 2019 8:25:56 GMT -6
The first year at my current job we had 15 kids. Finished the first game with 8 kids on the field. We ended up playing the whole season and I'm not sure how. We focused on the positive and getting better each day. Your will to get better as a coach must be greater than your will to quit. I say this from experience because I wanted to shut it down every day for about the first third of the season. It will force you out of any comfort zone you have and make you very creative.
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Post by hsrose on Aug 27, 2019 8:14:16 GMT -6
I had a full on, 2-page, description of what happened last Friday. We lost, 48-7, but we held them scoreless until 9 minutes in the 2nd. Some good things, but not very many at all. I decided not to post that, no reason to. But I did want to post my summary notes that I got from the game.
NOTE TO SELF: When the numbers are low there is no such thing as a "position". Everyone has to know all the positions because you don't know which domino will fall and take out a whole set of other dominoes. And that means even more simple on the offense/defense. The issue with this is that the players are not created equal and putting players in these positions is not conducive to their success or to the teams, it only satisfies the need to have a body, any body, on the field. Some of the issue is mental, they don’t know what to do, the other is physical, they are not capable of playing the position.
NOTE TO SELF: When you have to call time outs to set personnel because of an injury or something, you’re in a bad way. I know about being prepared, playing the what-if games on the whiteboard, who is backing up whom, but now, when everybody is backing up everyone else and that makes it tough to figure out on the fly who to put where. We are so low on personnel that losing 1 player can have a lot of impacts which take time to figure out. Lose 2 and now we are talking permutations that my pea brain can't process on the fly. Lose 3 and I've got receivers playing fullback. When this happens with a larger team you can move Rooks and Bishops and Knights into similar positions. Now, we’re moving Pawns into positions that need Rooks and Bishops and Knights. It just doesn’t work. I'm putting kids into places they have never been and asking them to do things they have never done. I haven't trained them, they don't know the techniques, I'm dooming them to failure before they step on the field. I don't like that.
And, yesterday 3 seniors got popped for vaping in the locker room so they are suspended for 3 days and on Social Probation meaning they can have nothing to do with any non-academic activities at the school. Meaning they cannot be at practice or anything for 3 weeks. That means they will miss this week (bye) and the next 2 games. A Freshmen got caught vaping pot, on Friday, wearing his game jersey, in class. So in the last 2 days I've lost 4 players for vaping.
I must have been really bad in a former life or something. This is getting comical.
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Post by blb on Aug 27, 2019 9:02:48 GMT -6
I had a full on, 2-page, description of what happened last Friday. We lost, 48-7, but we held them scoreless until 9 minutes in the 2nd. Some good things, but not very many at all. I decided not to post that, no reason to. But I did want to post my summary notes that I got from the game. NOTE TO SELF: When the numbers are low there is no such thing as a "position". Everyone has to know all the positions because you don't know which domino will fall and take out a whole set of other dominoes. And that means even more simple on the offense/defense. The issue with this is that the players are not created equal and putting players in these positions is not conducive to their success or to the teams, it only satisfies the need to have a body, any body, on the field. Some of the issue is mental, they don’t know what to do, the other is physical, they are not capable of playing the position. NOTE TO SELF: When you have to call time outs to set personnel because of an injury or something, you’re in a bad way. I know about being prepared, playing the what-if games on the whiteboard, who is backing up whom, but now, when everybody is backing up everyone else and that makes it tough to figure out on the fly who to put where. We are so low on personnel that losing 1 player can have a lot of impacts which take time to figure out. Lose 2 and now we are talking permutations that my pea brain can't process on the fly. Lose 3 and I've got receivers playing fullback. When this happens with a larger team you can move Rooks and Bishops and Knights into similar positions. Now, we’re moving Pawns into positions that need Rooks and Bishops and Knights. It just doesn’t work. I'm putting kids into places they have never been and asking them to do things they have never done. I haven't trained them, they don't know the techniques, I'm dooming them to failure before they step on the field. I don't like that. And, yesterday 3 seniors got popped for vaping in the locker room so they are suspended for 3 days and on Social Probation meaning they can have nothing to do with any non-academic activities at the school. Meaning they cannot be at practice or anything for 3 weeks. That means they will miss this week (bye) and the next 2 games. A Freshmen got caught vaping pot, on Friday, wearing his game jersey, in class. So in the last 2 days I've lost 4 players for vaping. I must have been really bad in a former life or something. This is getting comical.
Such circumstances are why my bottom line was 17 (along with not being able to practice-prepare properly).
If we got below 17 and there was no one to bring up from lower level (or move down from varsity to JV if latter was team struggling with numbers), we would have to cancel games until we got injured players back, even if it meant forfeiting games or even canceling season.
Fortunately we never got to that point with varsity, but it was close a few times.
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Post by hsrose on Aug 27, 2019 10:21:27 GMT -6
17 - Anyone else have a line/number like that?
I've had that conversation with the coaches since I got here, 'What is the number that we cancel?' They never liked that conversation, never reached a real consensus on it. We were never close to that. But it was always in the 15-16-17 range. Now that I'm here at that number that conversation has a lot more meaning.
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Post by fkaboneyard on Aug 27, 2019 13:16:25 GMT -6
17 - Anyone else have a line/number like that? I've had that conversation with the coaches since I got here, 'What is the number that we cancel?' They never liked that conversation, never reached a real consensus on it. We were never close to that. But it was always in the 15-16-17 range. Now that I'm here at that number that conversation has a lot more meaning.
I think the number would have to depend on the types of kids. If you had 16 kids and 13 of them were fatties with 3 skill kids you could do it. If you had 16 kids and 3 of them were fatties with 13 skill kids it wouldn't be long until your skill kids got killed.
I once was on staff of a team that had 19 kids. We lost two to injury and 1 to grades. It was very, very difficult for a lot of reasons, not the least of which was that it was near impossible to get any kind of look in practice. Of the total 19 kids we only had 7 that were decent football players, the rest were goofballs. We didn't win a game all season and I hated it but I grew immensely as a coach that year. Good luck coach and hang in there.
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Post by blb on Aug 27, 2019 14:10:36 GMT -6
17 - Anyone else have a line/number like that? I've had that conversation with the coaches since I got here, 'What is the number that we cancel?' They never liked that conversation, never reached a real consensus on it. We were never close to that. But it was always in the 15-16-17 range. Now that I'm here at that number that conversation has a lot more meaning.
If you can't practice-prepare properly to compete,
and you are playing kids out of position (as in your last post) just to try to field a "team" -
What do you think is the right thing to do?
Also - at least some of your kids obviously care more about other things ("vaping") than they do about playing football-your team or program.
Cancel the season.
Start again next year after you've had a full Off-Season to try to build relationships and a stable program.
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Post by coachd5085 on Aug 27, 2019 18:53:11 GMT -6
17 - Anyone else have a line/number like that? I've had that conversation with the coaches since I got here, 'What is the number that we cancel?' They never liked that conversation, never reached a real consensus on it. We were never close to that. But it was always in the 15-16-17 range. Now that I'm here at that number that conversation has a lot more meaning.
If you can't practice-prepare properly to compete,
and you are playing kids out of position (as in your last post) just to try to field a "team" -
What do you think is the right thing to do?
Also - at least some of your kids obviously care more about other things ("vaping") than they do about playing football-your team or program.
Cancel the season.
Start again next year after you've had a full Off-Season to try to build relationships and a stable program.
In some associations, there may be stiff penalties for sinpky cancelling a season. Just something to consider
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