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Post by coachwoodall on Dec 6, 2018 7:31:35 GMT -6
There are several threads around that touch on this, so I wanted to have a dedicated post to discuss these issues/topics.
What are the ways in which your program is working with your players to provide them those necessary tools that they need beyond their playing days? This might be in the realm for some of "that isn't in my job description" and I understand. I recently returned to a school and the HC has assigned me the task of creating a curriculum of sorts for the kids in our football/PE class next semester.
This is going to include somethings like: -interviewing skills -dressing for success -resume writing -social media presence -manners/etiquette
I trying to bring outside speakers to handle these types of topics.
What are you doing along these lines and what suggestions do you have? These sessions will be done during class and happen about once a month or so.
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Post by fkaboneyard on Dec 6, 2018 8:26:12 GMT -6
I'm not opposed to this per se but most of this stuff is totally unrelated to football and should not be done by a football coach. In my opinion our job is to help make them reach their full potential as football players and, while we do that, help to influence them to be men of integrity. I make myself available to kids outside of practice, and even outside of the season, to help them with personal struggles if they need it. The stuff you list above should largely be done by the guidance/career counselor's office. That said, I always have a discussion re: the responsible use of social media because poor choices can easily affect the football program in a negative way.
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Post by 54695469 on Dec 6, 2018 8:34:53 GMT -6
Just be a football coach. If you're doing a good job, all of that other stuff will take care of itself.
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Post by Thad Wells on Dec 6, 2018 12:00:03 GMT -6
I strongly disagree with any coach who thinks their influence stops with coaching football. We are in one of the most influential positions in our current time. Players come to us because they want to. They respect us and they value what we say. If a coach just wants to coach football then that’s obviously their decision, but you would be waisting an unbelievable opportunity to help thousands of people considering the generational impact.
I believe we are in the life coaching business. We’re just fortunate to get to do it following a passion we love.
When you are on your death bed what would you regret more? Spending every second of time you have with your players on football, or taking a portion of that time and talking about life.
We have 90 minutes with our players everyday in school. We spend half of that time in the weight room and half of that time in the classroom. We discuss nearly every life topic you can think of. Before being at my current school we had no time with the players during the school day so we did this on Mondays after school, in place of practice.
There are several programs you can use but I prefer to have real conversations with the team, centered around current issues. I also discuss the books that I am reading.
On Fridays, before the game, we put our players through Financial Peace University.
You could be the difference in someone having a fulfilled life if you choose to be.
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Post by coachwoodall on Dec 6, 2018 12:24:39 GMT -6
I'm not opposed to this per se but most of this stuff is totally unrelated to football and should not be done by a football coach. In my opinion our job is to help make them reach their full potential as football players and, while we do that, help to influence them to be men of integrity. I make myself available to kids outside of practice, and even outside of the season, to help them with personal struggles if they need it. The stuff you list above should largely be done by the guidance/career counselor's office. That said, I always have a discussion re: the responsible use of social media because poor choices can easily affect the football program in a negative way.
This is basically what I am doing; facilitating the resources that are available to the kids. Also, making contacts that can be helpful to the kids that they probably aren't aware of by the fact of they are are young and ignorant to the importance of them. Example, we have an alumnus who is a successful superintendent in a neighboring district. He is our first speaker.
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Post by fballcoachg on Dec 6, 2018 13:02:57 GMT -6
Just be a football coach. If you're doing a good job, all of that other stuff will take care of itself. They’ll learn interview skills, resume writing, how to function in different settings, etc through your tackle circuit?
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Post by fballcoachg on Dec 6, 2018 13:08:19 GMT -6
This stuff takes a few minutes, interesting that early responses are “not my responsibility.” I know most of use include “on and off the field” in mission statements or goals, this is off the field and is so easy to incorporate I don’t get why you wouldn’t do it.
An easy way to address these things can include throwing in a slide or two during install, at the end of practice bring up 3 kids to demonstrate proper handshakes and introductions in a professional setting, at a team dinner have coaches circulate and ask kids interview type questions.
We incorporate a voluntary leadership class but thinking about the original question, we can utilize some of our time much more efficiently and reinforce skills that will help our players.
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Post by 54695469 on Dec 6, 2018 14:39:19 GMT -6
Just be a football coach. If you're doing a good job, all of that other stuff will take care of itself. They’ll learn interview skills, resume writing, how to function in different settings, etc through your tackle circuit? Not my job to teach interview skills or how to write a fricking resume. I'm sure that there are folks in the building who are much more qualified to teach those things. Where does all of this stop? Do you teach the kids about religion, sex, birth control, how to carve a turkey, etc? As a coach, we should teach effort, pride, skills, teamwork, and things associated with the game and success (which carry over into life beyond the game). Do history teachers teach resume writing? Why not? Do Science teachers teach kids how to interview? Why not? You're a football coach. Teach things related to football which will carry over. Most of this other stuff is just done so some coach can tweet it out to show the world what a great guy he is and how much he "loves the grind!" Just coach. I've put in over thirty five years in the profession and feel that ive had a positive impact on a lot of kids and I have never taught a class in tying a tie or resume writing.
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Post by Thad Wells on Dec 6, 2018 15:02:05 GMT -6
Do you teach the kids about religion, sex, birth control, how to carve a turkey, etc? Turkey carving? No. Do we discuss religion, sex, and birth control? We have. Most of this other stuff is just done so some coach can tweet it out to show the world what a great guy he is and how much he "loves the grind!" No grind here. We cherish our time with family AND we do our best to help our players wherever we can. I hope any young coach that reads your post chooses to dismiss it. Yes, coach football. Yes, coach life skills. You can do both. Our youth is not getting these skills in other places.
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Post by coachddwebb on Dec 6, 2018 15:06:21 GMT -6
In previous years we did a leadership training. However I like the idea of teach kids how to write a resume, apply for a job, manners, and how to handle social media. These are skills they are not getting at home and they are not regularly taught in school and it should be.
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Post by fballcoachg on Dec 6, 2018 16:42:05 GMT -6
They’ll learn interview skills, resume writing, how to function in different settings, etc through your tackle circuit? You're a football coach. Teach things related to football which will carry over. Most of this other stuff is just done so some coach can tweet it out to show the world what a great guy he is and how much he "loves the grind!" Just coach. I've put in over thirty five years in the profession and feel that ive had a positive impact on a lot of kids and I have never taught a class in tying a tie or resume writing. I’m sure you have had a positive impact without doing those things, I’d hope no one would stick it out that long without having a positive impact. That said, these things take a few minutes if even. Not sure what the disdain for doing them is. My mission as a coach is to coach but also help young men on and off the field. So yes, when a school dance is coming up we talk about treating dates with respect, when the Fourth of July is coming up we talk about making good choices, when they are going in to their senior years we talk about fasfa, we set up study tables, we help them make highlights, we ask them about plans after school and how to achieve them, if it’s something we aren’t capable or comfortable helping with we send them to someone who is. We do all of these things not for a twitter post or to brag but because we have a platform and an opportunity to provide supports for them. We think our role and responsibility is more than just teaching the buck sweep. It’s not some self serving ego boost or false posturing, it’s something we consider part of the mission. And, it’s something that honestly takes minimal effort but can have significant returns. I’m also not the janitor but I pick up trash, I’m not grounds but I’ve lined fields, I’m not a taxi but I’ve driven coworkers, I’m not a team mom but I’ve helped serve meals...I’m not a lot of things, a lot of things aren’t “my job” but I do them because they aren’t that hard, they need to be done, and improve things.
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Post by kylem56 on Dec 6, 2018 18:02:52 GMT -6
Do you teach the kids about religion, sex, birth control, how to carve a turkey, etc? Turkey carving? No. Do we discuss religion, sex, and birth control? We have. Most of this other stuff is just done so some coach can tweet it out to show the world what a great guy he is and how much he "loves the grind!" No grind here. We cherish our time with family AND we do our best to help our players wherever we can. I hope any young coach that reads your post chooses to dismiss it. Yes, coach football. Yes, coach life skills. You can do both. Our youth is not getting these skills in other places. Coach Wells I am going to go against the majority and agree with you here. I have had to show kids how to write cover letters and resumes and I am not a certified guidance counselor or English teacher. If I am reading what you are talking about, it is somewhat similar to what OSU calls "Real Life Wednesdays" www.cleveland.com/osu/2017/06/the_real_life_impact_real_life.html I know of a couple of D3 colleges in Michigan and I know some very successful (one just played for a state title, another lost in round 2) high schools in Ohio who do something similar. One of those high schools actually paid for their varsity to take a SAT prep course on Saturday mornings. I think just the idea of bringing in a guest speaker each week to talk about those things could help. If it happens to be the guidance counselor or english teacher, great! If its someone else , good as well. Every single high school program's situation is different and only you know what is going to be serve your student athletes. Sportsleader has put out some good stuff, and I think Jeff Jansenn and Randy Jackson's books can provide you with some materials as well.
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Post by 54695469 on Dec 6, 2018 18:22:59 GMT -6
So much of what we do as coaches, is very related to every day life. Showing up on time, meetings, required non practice none game day quotas, carrying out your duties on a day to day basis. If you are doing coaching right, your kids are learning,the demands of life under your watch. That does not require a speech, speeches, lectures. The way to do coaching in any arena is to make it hard. Imo. Exactly. Thank you!
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Post by CS on Dec 6, 2018 20:07:22 GMT -6
I have never worked at a school that didn’t teach all of these things to kids already
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Post by badtotheflexbone on Dec 6, 2018 20:53:30 GMT -6
"The stuff you list above should largely be done by the guidance/career counselor's office"
I think you're missing the most important piece here and that is the relationship that you've (hopefully) built with kids. This relationship then has a HUGE influence to kids when they make their day-to-day decisions. There's a reason kids will "run through a wall" for some coaches, can the same be said of guidance counselors (who they might see once a month, if that)?
As ridiculous as this sounds, it's not the message but who the message is coming from. I've been asked to talk to my players about certain conducts from counselors even though they've gone over the SAME EXACT thing. But because it was coming from "COACH" instead of "lady in the office" it stopped the behavior.
I'm not going to sit here and try to convince you otherwise but in my opinion, if you see coaching football in its entirety as just teaching kids to chase around a stupid brown ball then you're missing out on the "power/influence" you have over kids. (Damn I just bashed my own profession)
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Post by tothehouse on Dec 6, 2018 21:22:38 GMT -6
Question. Football coaches are passionate and usually go way above and beyond building up relationships with kids.
Should the school be talking with football coaches about how they connect so well with kids? Should school Admin talk to football coaches about how they relate to their players and how teachers can do it as well?
I would be advocating to the school for a class that students can take that is all about that stuff. Not just football players but all kids.
While you're at it coachwoodall try to set them up with internships/job shadowing in the area. Treat it like a vocational class. I would think most businesses would like kids that put in the time and effort to get any job done. We all know that we push football players hard. That's a good thing. They should apply those skills to getting a job. I'm thinking after they finish their senior season.
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Post by 60zgo on Dec 6, 2018 22:32:21 GMT -6
This thread is pretty startling so far...
If you are "just coaching" why would you be a high school coach? That doesn't make sense.
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Post by CS on Dec 7, 2018 4:47:02 GMT -6
This thread is pretty startling so far... If you are "just coaching" why would you be a high school coach? That doesn't make sense. I think you are missing his point. He is saying that if you are doing right by your players and doing the things a good coach does you are teaching them all kinds of real world skills. Things like goal setting, punctuality, how to shake a mans hand etc. I have proof read college essays for kids and helped them with stuff like resumes’ but I’m not going to spend football time on it when they have a class for it
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Post by jlenwood on Dec 7, 2018 6:25:59 GMT -6
Question. Football coaches are passionate and usually go way above and beyond building up relationships with kids. Should the school be talking with football coaches about how they connect so well with kids? Should school Admin talk to football coaches about how they relate to their players and how teachers can do it as well? I would be advocating to the school for a class that students can take that is all about that stuff. Not just football players but all kids. While you're at it coachwoodall try to set them up with internships/job shadowing in the area. Treat it like a vocational class. I would think most businesses would like kids that put in the time and effort to get any job done. We all know that we push football players hard. That's a good thing. They should apply those skills to getting a job. I'm thinking after they finish their senior season. They should be using those skills to get into school and getting a degree. Junior college then university. Kids deserve more than Podunk jobs that requires absolutely no brain power. I bring in a graduating senior in college every spring, math and science normally just to talk about college life and what their plans after graduation. Most of those students have had jobs lined up that start 65k a year. So every job without a college degree is a "Podunk job" that requires "no brain power"? The guy is just suggesting a job shadow to see some work ethic and real life situations that might make the athlete think about what is needed in the world outside of the cozy confines of a high school...you know...the one where the lowly podunks are making $$.
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Post by jlenwood on Dec 7, 2018 6:39:12 GMT -6
I love this thought and to those who don't think this is an important idea, think of it from the outside. If I am a parent and I have a young man coming into high school, what are my thoughts about football? Well, from all accounts it is on the decline because of a variety of real or perceived threats.
So as a parent I can be scared off by all of the negativity surrounding the game (again real or just perceived) and talk my child into not playing this great game. OR.....I see that this high school has a coaching staff that truly is influencing and truly helping the young boys in their program to not only become young men and men of character through the game, but also preparing them for a life outside of the walls of school. In other words, this school has a staff of men who truly care about the long term success of their athletes.
Does the soccer program do this, cross country or whatever other fall sport is available, nope, well then I guess my kid is playing football. So now we begin taking some kid who doesn't have a clue about the future, and we truly help to set him up for success. We can all talk and preach all day long about how football saves lives of kids through the process of being involved for four years, but why not cement that with long term tools to help them when the game ends. I have seen kids who truly excelled at football, and we thought we had them on the right path, and then they graduate and don't have a clue about what to do OUTSIDE of the game.
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Post by Thad Wells on Dec 7, 2018 8:00:24 GMT -6
You can win AND influence.
Is it possible to argue against the fact that players play harder for coaches who prove they care about them beyond the field?
Coach A - Coaches to the best of his ability on the field but neglects his responsibilities off the field. Coach B - Works with players off the field but neglects his football duties. Coach C - Coaches to the best of his ability on the field AND works with players off the field.
Which coach would you want your child playing for? Which coach will die without regret?
Too many people neglect the "Theory of AND". We can be good coaches AND good husbands AND good fathers AND good influencers.
Balance is almost always the better choice.
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humble
Sophomore Member
Posts: 204
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Post by humble on Dec 7, 2018 8:15:00 GMT -6
We worked out 4 days a week in the summer. 1 day a week we would talk about something with our position groups for about 10 minutes. Typically things relating to character.
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Post by PSS on Dec 7, 2018 9:16:55 GMT -6
Question. Football coaches are passionate and usually go way above and beyond building up relationships with kids. Should the school be talking with football coaches about how they connect so well with kids? Should school Admin talk to football coaches about how they relate to their players and how teachers can do it as well? I would be advocating to the school for a class that students can take that is all about that stuff. Not just football players but all kids. While you're at it coachwoodall try to set them up with internships/job shadowing in the area. Treat it like a vocational class. I would think most businesses would like kids that put in the time and effort to get any job done. We all know that we push football players hard. That's a good thing. They should apply those skills to getting a job. I'm thinking after they finish their senior season. They should be using those skills to get into school and getting a degree. Junior college then university. Kids deserve more than Podunk jobs that requires absolutely no brain power. I bring in a graduating senior in college every spring, math and science normally just to talk about college life and what their plans after graduation. Most of those students have had jobs lined up that start 65k a year. Not every student is meant to go to college. Vocational schools and the military are just as important. Those that attend vocational schools will make an honest living. Often, 18 year olds are not mature enough. For those that have no idea what to do I encourage them to consider the military. This helps them to mature and decide what they want to do for their future. In addition to that they will have an advantage. These students will have their education paid if they chose to go to college.
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Post by coachwoodall on Dec 7, 2018 9:39:09 GMT -6
Sorry guys, just looking for ideas; not a debate over the pros and cons of doing it.
Thanks.
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Post by tothehouse on Dec 7, 2018 11:14:49 GMT -6
I guess it depends on where you live. I live in one of the most tech cities outside of the silicon valley. There are lots of places to shadow. Again, giving coach something else to possibly look into. A lot of the business owners around my school played football...at my school. People need to realize that might be the case where they live. It's a good idea to connect your current players with some of these guys. There are also colleges that have specific programs like coach is talking about. I'm sure you could reach out to them. I know my alma mater, San Jose State, has a great program for life after sports. sjsuspartans.com/sports/2018/8/3/genrel-070508aaa-html.aspx
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Post by 60zgo on Dec 7, 2018 23:46:01 GMT -6
This thread is pretty startling so far... If you are "just coaching" why would you be a high school coach? That doesn't make sense. I think you are missing his point. He is saying that if you are doing right by your players and doing the things a good coach does you are teaching them all kinds of real world skills. Things like goal setting, punctuality, how to shake a mans hand etc. I have proof read college essays for kids and helped them with stuff like resumes’ but I’m not going to spend football time on it when they have a class for it I'm not missing the point. I don't think you and I coach in the same world. It's cool. You do you and I'll do me.
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Post by CS on Dec 8, 2018 7:37:51 GMT -6
I think you are missing his point. He is saying that if you are doing right by your players and doing the things a good coach does you are teaching them all kinds of real world skills. Things like goal setting, punctuality, how to shake a mans hand etc. I have proof read college essays for kids and helped them with stuff like resumes’ but I’m not going to spend football time on it when they have a class for it I'm not missing the point. I don't think you and I coach in the same world. It's cool. You do you and I'll do me. I don’t understand how you took offense to what I posted. How is it that we don’t coach in the same world?
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Post by jlenwood on Dec 8, 2018 8:07:40 GMT -6
Not every student is meant to go to college. Vocational schools and the military are just as important. Those that attend vocational schools will make an honest living. Often, 18 year olds are not mature enough. For those that have no idea what to do I encourage them to consider the military. This helps them to mature and decide what they want to do for their future. In addition to that they will have an advantage. These students will have their education paid if they chose to go to college. To each his own. I have the utmost respect for the military and vocational schools, but my football players are capable of much more. Wow...condescend much.
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Post by tigerpride on Dec 8, 2018 8:20:46 GMT -6
Counselors today are not the counselors of old. They are too busy with testing and other things, not guidance. Life skills are not a priority to high schools - data and ACT scores are. So I agree it is our job to guide and counsel these kids. We spend more time with them than their families do.
I track eligibility all year long, not just during season and not just for my own purpose. Half my kids don't have two parents at home so i tell my staff that we are their family away from home.
I bring in guest speakers who will talk about careers and military oppprtunities. We have an ACT.
Our job descriptions never end. We are in the business of football and most importantly, relationships.
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Post by coachd5085 on Dec 8, 2018 8:26:26 GMT -6
I strongly disagree with any coach who thinks their influence stops with coaching football. We are in one of the most influential positions in our current time. Players come to us because they want to. They respect us and they value what we say. If a coach just wants to coach football then that’s obviously their decision, but you would be waisting an unbelievable opportunity to help thousands of people considering the generational impact. I believe we are in the life coaching business. We’re just fortunate to get to do it following a passion we love. When you are on your death bed what would you regret more? Spending every second of time you have with your players on football, or taking a portion of that time and talking about life. We have 90 minutes with our players everyday in school. We spend half of that time in the weight room and half of that time in the classroom. We discuss nearly every life topic you can think of. Before being at my current school we had no time with the players during the school day so we did this on Mondays after school, in place of practice. There are several programs you can use but I prefer to have real conversations with the team, centered around current issues. I also discuss the books that I am reading. On Fridays, before the game, we put our players through Financial Peace University. You could be the difference in someone having a fulfilled life if you choose to be. Question coach...do you teach at a private school?
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