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Post by coachkeating33 on Oct 7, 2018 7:30:30 GMT -6
If you took over a losing program and a player(s) missed practice for no reason...do you sit him for a quarter or more ....the back up players are significantly less talented...thoughts?
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Post by blb on Oct 7, 2018 7:56:20 GMT -6
If you took over a losing program and a player(s) missed practice for no reason...do you sit him for a quarter or more ....the back up players are significantly less talented...thoughts?
Your first year you must set the rules-expectations in no uncertain terms or the issues-problems will be there as long as you are.
There must be some consequence. You have to be willing to lose in order to have discipline because you most certainly will lose if you don't.
Is this his (their) first unexcused absence?
My policy was first unexcused absence you got PIE (Personal Improvement Exercises), second you sat out a game, third you were dismissed from team - "Three strikes and you're out."
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Post by johnson2133 on Oct 7, 2018 15:34:58 GMT -6
I will parrot much of what was said above. I've never been the coach of a "winning" program...infact I have never had a season over .500 (unless you are counting league games only) so I have ZERO problem sitting players to establish rules and expectations. As I've mentioned before I've played games with 5 on 6 in football and 4 on 5 in basketball to get the message delivered. If I'm the HC and I'm responsible for the product on the field/court then we are doing it the way I see fit.
And every program has improved that I've been in charge of. Those who couldn't hang...got off the train.
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Post by CS on Oct 7, 2018 15:42:57 GMT -6
I will parrot much of what was said above. I've never been the coach of a "winning" program...infact I have never had a season over .500 (unless you are counting league games only) so I have ZERO problem sitting players to establish rules and expectations. As I've mentioned before I've played games with 5 on 6 in football and 4 on 5 in basketball to get the message delivered. If I'm the HC and I'm responsible for the product on the field/court then we are doing it the way I see fit. And every program has improved that I've been in charge of. Those who couldn't hang...got off the train. No offense but if a guy who hasn’t had a season over .500 tells me what he does for “discipline” I’m going to find a different opinion. I like what BLB said. Make ups and if it’s a regular thing just don’t play them. I probably wouldn’t kick them off unless they were just being a complete turd. I definitely wouldn’t play a game with less players than the other team though
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Post by johnson2133 on Oct 7, 2018 16:28:46 GMT -6
I will parrot much of what was said above. I've never been the coach of a "winning" program...infact I have never had a season over .500 (unless you are counting league games only) so I have ZERO problem sitting players to establish rules and expectations. As I've mentioned before I've played games with 5 on 6 in football and 4 on 5 in basketball to get the message delivered. If I'm the HC and I'm responsible for the product on the field/court then we are doing it the way I see fit. And every program has improved that I've been in charge of. Those who couldn't hang...got off the train. No offense but if a guy who hasn’t had a season over .500 tells me what he does for “discipline” I’m going to find a different opinion. I like what BLB said. Make ups and if it’s a regular thing just don’t play them. I probably wouldn’t kick them off unless they were just being a complete turd. I definitely wouldn’t play a game with less players than the other team though You're certainly entitled to believe what you want and while my overall "winning" percentage isnt stellar I've never coached at a school with an enrollment over 75. My current FB team has 6 players...just enough for a team. My previous team (girls basketball) had won 6 games the previous 3 seasons combined before I took over. Last year we won our league and had a home playoff game for the first time in almost 10 years.(9-12 overall 5-1 league record) Also was selected as league coach of the year by local media and fellow coaches. When you consistently play schools with 2-3 times the enrollment you have...winning games isnt as easy as it sounds. As I mentioned all the teams have been left better than I found them. But again...to each their own.
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Post by carookie on Oct 7, 2018 18:05:28 GMT -6
I will parrot much of what was said above. I've never been the coach of a "winning" program...infact I have never had a season over .500 (unless you are counting league games only) so I have ZERO problem sitting players to establish rules and expectations. As I've mentioned before I've played games with 5 on 6 in football and 4 on 5 in basketball to get the message delivered. If I'm the HC and I'm responsible for the product on the field/court then we are doing it the way I see fit. And every program has improved that I've been in charge of. Those who couldn't hang...got off the train. No offense but if a guy who hasn’t had a season over .500 tells me what he does for “discipline” I’m going to find a different opinion.I like what BLB said. Make ups and if it’s a regular thing just don’t play them. I probably wouldn’t kick them off unless they were just being a complete turd. I definitely wouldn’t play a game with less players than the other team though You are free to take or not take advice from whomever you choose; and I am not trying to start a pedantic type of argument here (especially considering I tend to respect your opinion on most things I see you posting on). But the bolded text is something I think is a mistake. There are many cases where doing the correct thing and winning don't go together in prep football. Often times the outcome of the game is determined by factors- mostly genetics relative to the opponent- that our out of the coaches control....well unless you are recruiting and poaching from other schools. This season will be my first losing season in over a decade as a coach, last year the only team to beat us was the team that won it all. The difference.....relative natural talent. I know of many cases where certain teams are grossly overmatched relative to all teams in their league and on their schedule (sometimes for years on end). Winning and losing is at times outside of the coaches control; moreover, winning pct. does not equal validity of opinion; I can tell you of seasons where we did many things wrong and still went on to title games.
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Post by 53 on Oct 7, 2018 19:03:45 GMT -6
How the hell do you play a football game with 6 kids?
You have to have 7 on the line or it’s a penalty.
Just reread it and it’s 6 man ball. Never mind
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Post by CS on Oct 7, 2018 19:04:13 GMT -6
No offense but if a guy who hasn’t had a season over .500 tells me what he does for “discipline” I’m going to find a different opinion. I like what BLB said. Make ups and if it’s a regular thing just don’t play them. I probably wouldn’t kick them off unless they were just being a complete turd. I definitely wouldn’t play a game with less players than the other team though You're certainly entitled to believe what you want and while my overall "winning" percentage isnt stellar I've never coached at a school with an enrollment over 75. My current FB team has 6 players...just enough for a team. My previous team (girls basketball) had won 6 games the previous 3 seasons combined before I took over. Last year we won our league and had a home playoff game for the first time in almost 10 years.(9-12 overall 5-1 league record) Also was selected as league coach of the year by local media and fellow coaches. When you consistently play schools with 2-3 times the enrollment you have...winning games isnt as easy as it sounds. As I mentioned all the teams have been left better than I found them. But again...to each their own. You probably should have added the rest of that information to your original post. I still find it unnecessary to punish the rest of your team by playing with fewer players to prove your point.
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Post by CS on Oct 7, 2018 19:14:16 GMT -6
No offense but if a guy who hasn’t had a season over .500 tells me what he does for “discipline” I’m going to find a different opinion.I like what BLB said. Make ups and if it’s a regular thing just don’t play them. I probably wouldn’t kick them off unless they were just being a complete turd. I definitely wouldn’t play a game with less players than the other team though You are free to take or not take advice from whomever you choose; and I am not trying to start a pedantic type of argument here (especially considering I tend to respect your opinion on most things I see you posting on). But the bolded text is something I think is a mistake. There are many cases where doing the correct thing and winning don't go together in prep football. Often times the outcome of the game is determined by factors- mostly genetics relative to the opponent- that our out of the coaches control....well unless you are recruiting and poaching from other schools. This season will be my first losing season in over a decade as a coach, last year the only team to beat us was the team that won it all. The difference.....relative natural talent. I know of many cases where certain teams are grossly overmatched relative to all teams in their league and on their schedule (sometimes for years on end). Winning and losing is at times outside of the coaches control; moreover, winning pct. does not equal validity of opinion; I can tell you of seasons where we did many things wrong and still went on to title games. "I've never been the coach of a "winning" program...infact I have never had a season over .500 (unless you are counting league games only) so I have ZERO problem sitting players to establish rules and expectations. As I've mentioned before I've played games with 5 on 6 in football and 4 on 5 in basketball to get the message delivered" I get that you can be a good coach with a bad record and that circumstance can be just as important as knowledge of the game and skill to teach it but playing games with fewer players than the other team purposefully to prove a point isn't fair to the rest of the team. He provided more information and I'm sure that he is a fine coach but not knowing anything else about him or the situation and I showed up to one of those games I would question his judgment.
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Post by johnson2133 on Oct 7, 2018 19:39:04 GMT -6
You are free to take or not take advice from whomever you choose; and I am not trying to start a pedantic type of argument here (especially considering I tend to respect your opinion on most things I see you posting on). But the bolded text is something I think is a mistake. There are many cases where doing the correct thing and winning don't go together in prep football. Often times the outcome of the game is determined by factors- mostly genetics relative to the opponent- that our out of the coaches control....well unless you are recruiting and poaching from other schools. This season will be my first losing season in over a decade as a coach, last year the only team to beat us was the team that won it all. The difference.....relative natural talent. I know of many cases where certain teams are grossly overmatched relative to all teams in their league and on their schedule (sometimes for years on end). Winning and losing is at times outside of the coaches control; moreover, winning pct. does not equal validity of opinion; I can tell you of seasons where we did many things wrong and still went on to title games. "I've never been the coach of a "winning" program...infact I have never had a season over .500 (unless you are counting league games only) so I have ZERO problem sitting players to establish rules and expectations. As I've mentioned before I've played games with 5 on 6 in football and 4 on 5 in basketball to get the message delivered" I get that you can be a good coach with a bad record and that circumstance can be just as important as knowledge of the game and skill to teach it but playing games with fewer players than the other team purposefully to prove a point isn't fair to the rest of the team. He provided more information and I'm sure that he is a fine coach but not knowing anything else about him or the situation and I showed up to one of those games I would question his judgment. And you would be correct to question. I talk to parents all the time. I respect your knowledge and your contributions to this community so let me ask you your thoughts on this situation I just had during our last game: I have a player who is small and slow for his age and he was playing his defensive position...getting torched by a kid on the other team. So halftime my assistant coach and I decide to move him to a less athletic kid...my player whines and complains. We start the second half and the change helps...not much, but we are still getting beat by this kid. Meanwhile on offense my player stops running his routes to his capability. I call TO to talk to him. He asks to go back to his Defensive spot. I said no. He throws fit again. I remove him from game. We played 5 on 6 for a couple series. I ask if he is ready to go back in..he asks if it is to his original position. I said no. He untucked his Jersey. I turned back to game. We lost 49-84. There is literally no difference in our offense or defense production with the kid on the field or not. So it isnt hurting my kids. Infact I think they understand completely. 4 of my 6 kids are on IEPs for academic and behavioral issues. This is my first year at the school. I have young men who are directionless and treat female teachers like dirt...They love football so I will use it for all I can to make them understand that there is the right way and the wrong way to act. And if I have to lose football games because of it...then so be it. This is not just my team either. Had a varsity VB captain flip off a ref and cuss her coach out in a game last week. These kids have never had to answer for their actions as far as I can tell. That won't fly as long as I'm here. Even if it means forfeiting.
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Post by CS on Oct 8, 2018 3:49:48 GMT -6
"I've never been the coach of a "winning" program...infact I have never had a season over .500 (unless you are counting league games only) so I have ZERO problem sitting players to establish rules and expectations. As I've mentioned before I've played games with 5 on 6 in football and 4 on 5 in basketball to get the message delivered" I get that you can be a good coach with a bad record and that circumstance can be just as important as knowledge of the game and skill to teach it but playing games with fewer players than the other team purposefully to prove a point isn't fair to the rest of the team. He provided more information and I'm sure that he is a fine coach but not knowing anything else about him or the situation and I showed up to one of those games I would question his judgment. And you would be correct to question. I talk to parents all the time. I respect your knowledge and your contributions to this community so let me ask you your thoughts on this situation I just had during our last game: I have a player who is small and slow for his age and he was playing his defensive position...getting torched by a kid on the other team. So halftime my assistant coach and I decide to move him to a less athletic kid...my player whines and complains. We start the second half and the change helps...not much, but we are still getting beat by this kid. Meanwhile on offense my player stops running his routes to his capability. I call TO to talk to him. He asks to go back to his Defensive spot. I said no. He throws fit again. I remove him from game. We played 5 on 6 for a couple series. I ask if he is ready to go back in..he asks if it is to his original position. I said no. He untucked his Jersey. I turned back to game. We lost 49-84. There is literally no difference in our offense or defense production with the kid on the field or not. So it isnt hurting my kids. Infact I think they understand completely. 4 of my 6 kids are on IEPs for academic and behavioral issues. This is my first year at the school. I have young men who are directionless and treat female teachers like dirt...They love football so I will use it for all I can to make them understand that there is the right way and the wrong way to act. And if I have to lose football games because of it...then so be it. This is not just my team either. Had a varsity VB captain flip off a ref and cuss her coach out in a game last week. These kids have never had to answer for their actions as far as I can tell. That won't fly as long as I'm here. Even if it means forfeiting. It’s hard to answer without fully knowing the situation or your history with him but I will say it sounds like you have your hands full. Personally, I would have explained the situation and he was going to play that spot no matter. If he quits then there isn’t much you could do about it and life goes on. Judging by his reaction to you when you asked if he wanted to go back in my guess is he probably would have just went and sulked on the bench. I’m not saying I’m against sitting kids for punishment at all, but in your situation it would be the last thing I went to. Plus, in my state if you don’t have enough to play you forfeit so there is that
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