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Post by nicku on Sept 28, 2018 7:30:16 GMT -6
Upset that her son doesn't play much. He is a sweet kid that is...not all there. All of our games have been close, too.
So she asks, "why did he not play at all tonight? It's not fair!"
Well, for one thing, he is the worst player on the entire freshman B team, and we were only up 6 until a pick 6 at the end. So it was close, we wanted to finish it off.
Second, he left his helmet in his locker at school and it was an away game. So that's another reason.
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Post by Defcord on Sept 28, 2018 7:51:49 GMT -6
I am not saying it's the right way to do things but I personally think every kid that is in good standing should play every game at the lower levels. And at varsity the kids that have been invested in the program should be played as often as possible.
If our sport is struggling with numbers, then we need to allow kids to experience the best part of it...playing.
I know their is value in competition and winning but on the freshmen B team surely there is a spot this could have gotten in without ruining the outcome for everything.
If he was a turd, I would have a different opinion but good kids deserve to play. Plus you never know what will happen to a motivated kids in over the course of a 4 year high school career.
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Post by nicku on Sept 28, 2018 8:01:44 GMT -6
I am not saying it's the right way to do things but I personally think every kid that is in good standing should play every game at the lower levels. And at varsity the kids that have been invested in the program should be played as often as possible. If our sport is struggling with numbers, then we need to allow kids to experience the best part of it...playing. I know their is value in competition and winning but on the freshmen B team surely there is a spot this could have gotten in without ruining the outcome for everything. If he was a turd, I would have a different opinion but good kids deserve to play. Plus you never know what will happen to a motivated kids in over the course of a 4 year high school career. He also didn't have his helmet.
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Post by newhope on Sept 28, 2018 9:29:22 GMT -6
Rule 1: We never discuss playing time with parents. Explain this to parents at the first parent meeting and every subsequent parent meeting. Make sure admin knows this is your rule. It will save you a lot of time and problems.
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Post by Defcord on Sept 28, 2018 9:41:10 GMT -6
I am not saying it's the right way to do things but I personally think every kid that is in good standing should play every game at the lower levels. And at varsity the kids that have been invested in the program should be played as often as possible. If our sport is struggling with numbers, then we need to allow kids to experience the best part of it...playing. I know their is value in competition and winning but on the freshmen B team surely there is a spot this could have gotten in without ruining the outcome for everything. If he was a turd, I would have a different opinion but good kids deserve to play. Plus you never know what will happen to a motivated kids in over the course of a 4 year high school career. He also didn't have his helmet. Yeah that part is a major problem! He wouldn't play.
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Post by Defcord on Sept 28, 2018 9:50:49 GMT -6
Rule 1: We never discuss playing time with parents. Explain this to parents at the first parent meeting and every subsequent parent meeting. Make sure admin knows this is your rule. It will save you a lot of time and problems. We ask parents for their kid, their time, their money and their support. Why can't they ask about playing time?
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Post by mnike23 on Sept 28, 2018 9:53:12 GMT -6
I am not saying it's the right way to do things but I personally think every kid that is in good standing should play every game at the lower levels. And at varsity the kids that have been invested in the program should be played as often as possible. If our sport is struggling with numbers, then we need to allow kids to experience the best part of it...playing. I know their is value in competition and winning but on the freshmen B team surely there is a spot this could have gotten in without ruining the outcome for everything. If he was a turd, I would have a different opinion but good kids deserve to play. Plus you never know what will happen to a motivated kids in over the course of a 4 year high school career. As right as you may be, i disagree. we dont have a participation rule, thats pop warner/aau/usa football. best kids play. rules for parents, we dont discuss playing time. you want to know why he didnt play, come to practice and watch him compete with the person in front of him. end of talk. as far as varsity kids being invested, yes they should play, in blowouts, homecoming games and senior night(if a senior) otherwise, win your battle with the #1 in your spot. im not going to pull a starter just to give little billy some burn because he came to 100% of the summer workouts. by the same token, i will yank a player for screwing up, starter or not. when you are evaulated on wins and losses, not for getting kids in games or sending kids to college, better score 50, give up 0 and win every game you can. not saying its right, but its reality in certain places.
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Post by newhope on Sept 28, 2018 10:10:19 GMT -6
Rule 1: We never discuss playing time with parents. Explain this to parents at the first parent meeting and every subsequent parent meeting. Make sure admin knows this is your rule. It will save you a lot of time and problems. We ask parents for their kid, their time, their money and their support. Why can't they ask about playing time? Because it is a wasted conversation from which no one will leave happy and no one will convince the other. It's pointless. I won't be able to convince them junior isn't good enough. They won't convince me he is. They will leave madder than when they came in. I've got too many more productive things to do with my time. All I owe them for their kid, their time, their money and their support is to give their kid a fair chance and to spend my energies towards trying to make him the best player and person I can. We will talk to the kid. We will tell him what he needs to get better---we will talk to parents about what the kid needs to get better, how he can improve, etc. We will talk to parents about how we can help the kid with schoolwork, with personal issues, with college, with life after football---pretty much anything except playing time. Once you open the door to playing time discussion, then you'll have lots of those discussions. Then you'll have discussions about how many touches he gets a game, etc, etc, etc.
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Post by Defcord on Sept 28, 2018 10:32:06 GMT -6
I am not saying it's the right way to do things but I personally think every kid that is in good standing should play every game at the lower levels. And at varsity the kids that have been invested in the program should be played as often as possible. If our sport is struggling with numbers, then we need to allow kids to experience the best part of it...playing. I know their is value in competition and winning but on the freshmen B team surely there is a spot this could have gotten in without ruining the outcome for everything. If he was a turd, I would have a different opinion but good kids deserve to play. Plus you never know what will happen to a motivated kids in over the course of a 4 year high school career. As right as you may be, i disagree. we dont have a participation rule, thats pop warner/aau/usa football. best kids play. rules for parents, we dont discuss playing time. you want to know why he didnt play, come to practice and watch him compete with the person in front of him. end of talk. as far as varsity kids being invested, yes they should play, in blowouts, homecoming games and senior night(if a senior) otherwise, win your battle with the #1 in your spot. im not going to pull a starter just to give little billy some burn because he came to 100% of the summer workouts. by the same token, i will yank a player for screwing up, starter or not. when you are evaulated on wins and losses, not for getting kids in games or sending kids to college, better score 50, give up 0 and win every game you can. not saying its right, but its reality in certain places. I am not saying on varsity to play them whenever. I am saying play them when you can. Lower levels I am not saying play them as a participation trophy. I am saying play them as an investment in your teams future. I am also not going to pull a starter to give little Billy free playing time, but if he is invested in the program I think finding him time is beneficial to the program more than detrimental. One example is the more those guys get to play the better they practice and give us a look when on the scout team.
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Post by Defcord on Sept 28, 2018 10:35:09 GMT -6
We ask parents for their kid, their time, their money and their support. Why can't they ask about playing time? Because it is a wasted conversation from which no one will leave happy and no one will convince the other. It's pointless. I won't be able to convince them junior isn't good enough. They won't convince me he is. They will leave madder than when they came in. I've got too many more productive things to do with my time. All I owe them for their kid, their time, their money and their support is to give their kid a fair chance and to spend my energies towards trying to make him the best player and person I can. We will talk to the kid. We will tell him what he needs to get better---we will talk to parents about what the kid needs to get better, how he can improve, etc. We will talk to parents about how we can help the kid with schoolwork, with personal issues, with college, with life after football---pretty much anything except playing time. Once you open the door to playing time discussion, then you'll have lots of those discussions. Then you'll have discussions about how many touches he gets a game, etc, etc, etc. I think you can have an honest conversation with a parent to help them understand their child's role on the team. That includes playing time. In my experience those communications help rational parents understand the situation. Irrational ones, well there's no chance anyway.
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Post by newhope on Sept 28, 2018 10:39:37 GMT -6
Because it is a wasted conversation from which no one will leave happy and no one will convince the other. It's pointless. I won't be able to convince them junior isn't good enough. They won't convince me he is. They will leave madder than when they came in. I've got too many more productive things to do with my time. All I owe them for their kid, their time, their money and their support is to give their kid a fair chance and to spend my energies towards trying to make him the best player and person I can. We will talk to the kid. We will tell him what he needs to get better---we will talk to parents about what the kid needs to get better, how he can improve, etc. We will talk to parents about how we can help the kid with schoolwork, with personal issues, with college, with life after football---pretty much anything except playing time. Once you open the door to playing time discussion, then you'll have lots of those discussions. Then you'll have discussions about how many touches he gets a game, etc, etc, etc. I think you can have an honest conversation with a parent to help them understand their child's role on the team. That includes playing time. In my experience those communications help rational parents understand the situation. Irrational ones, well there's no chance anyway. Role on the team, yes. Playing time, no.
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Post by Defcord on Sept 28, 2018 11:31:54 GMT -6
I think you can have an honest conversation with a parent to help them understand their child's role on the team. That includes playing time. In my experience those communications help rational parents understand the situation. Irrational ones, well there's no chance anyway. Role on the team, yes. Playing time, no. Isn't their playing time part of their role?
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Post by mnike23 on Sept 28, 2018 11:47:24 GMT -6
at parent meetings yearly i offer this to those monday night former all star players that are dads in the stands now, who claim they were an all americant at who gives a dang high school in mulberry alaska.....
come watch friday nights game film with me saturday morning. come watch practice tape monday night, tuesday night, wednesday night, you tell me if little junior is doing the right thing, giving his all is not up for debate, but running correct route, blocking correct man, throwing to right player(reading d) making the tackle, etc...
in 25 years I have had 1 person come saturday morning after he felt his boy was deserving of the ball. he showed we watched hudl, i diagrammed every single play(offense) on the screen as to what they should be doing, gave him the qb reads of the defense if it was a pass, where his all star should have been in terms of routes, blocking, catching... after an hour or so, he looked at me and said, dam coach, i thought you was crazy calling the same play over and over, but its not.... (zone read, power, counter, jet) i thought the qb just dont like my baby boy,,,, dam man, im really sorry. i wont say another word this fall.
that is how you shut up parents. most are from missouri and the show me state. they dont believe you that billy is hot garbage and at 5'7 135 is not the feature back of my power i offense. and that 6'4 380 and 8 second 40 johnny boy cannot play pulling guard and he needs to lose 100lbs.
playing time is EARNED. not given. role on the team, be a great team mate. when you get in, go 100miles an hour. earn your time in practice. stop walking around and complaining. and tell mom to stop yelling put my baby in and dad to stop screaming throw steven the ball(fullhouse double tight offense).... rant over
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Post by carookie on Sept 28, 2018 11:58:29 GMT -6
Rule 1: We never discuss playing time with parents. Explain this to parents at the first parent meeting and every subsequent parent meeting. Make sure admin knows this is your rule. It will save you a lot of time and problems. We ask parents for their kid, their time, their money and their support. Why can't they ask about playing time? 1) Because it inevitably turns into a discussion about someone else's kid(s). If lil Johnny aint playing, then its probably because big Bobby is better. So in the end I have to discus another child's abilities with an adult who is not their parent. 2) More often than not, the kid has not made an effort to self-advocate and is just relying on mommy to stand up for them. I am trying to teach them to speak up for themselves, and I can honestly explain with any player why their PT is what it is. 3) Pandora's Box- once you let one many more will come, and it will be a competition between them to see who can complain the best to get their kid the most PT.
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Post by planck on Sept 28, 2018 12:06:06 GMT -6
Had a fun email from a parent earlier this year telling us how junior was "hard working and competitive, even if he isn't the biggest or fastest" and it wasn't fair he didn't play much in the game that day. On the opening kickoff of that game, he ran backwards on kickoff coverage to avoid contact, finishing the play 45 yards away from the ball.
I just...I'm not trying to be mean to people, but it's not fair to the 10 other kids on the field to put somebody out there who does that.
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Post by carookie on Sept 28, 2018 12:09:13 GMT -6
Upset that her son doesn't play much. He is a sweet kid that is...not all there. All of our games have been close, too. So she asks, "why did he not play at all tonight? It's not fair!" Well, for one thing, he is the worst player on the entire freshman B team, and we were only up 6 until a pick 6 at the end. So it was close, we wanted to finish it off. Second, he left his helmet in his locker at school and it was an away game. So that's another reason. About a decade back I was coaching Frosh team for a large school (about 70+ on the freshman team). Had a mom come up and complain to the staff about PT for her boy with an interesting twist, she was complaining that we didn't have cuts at the start of the season. At least then her son would have been able to pursue other opportunities in which he could be more involved (more PT) without having to quit. It was an interesting take. On another note, I had a dad come up to me last week after a practice claiming he had to discuss a 'major problem with me'. Great, I am thinking bullying or injury. Nope. Major problem was son was disenchanted that he only got in "1 Inning" last game. I explained to him my policy on discussing playing time with parents, I pointed out briefly that his son doesn't know where to lineup (new to the team, missed a lot of practice with injuries and study halls). But what I really wanted to point out was that we had to call for the closer so he only could go for 1 inning.
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Post by 50slantstrong on Sept 28, 2018 13:05:06 GMT -6
I don't know about the rest of you guys, but I've never not coached a lower level team in which everyone HAD to play, not by coach program policy, but because we wouldn't be able to field a team if we didn't...
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Post by Defcord on Sept 28, 2018 13:09:26 GMT -6
We ask parents for their kid, their time, their money and their support. Why can't they ask about playing time? 1) Because it inevitably turns into a discussion about someone else's kid(s). If lil Johnny aint playing, then its probably because big Bobby is better. So in the end I have to discus another child's abilities with an adult who is not their parent. 2) More often than not, the kid has not made an effort to self-advocate and is just relying on mommy to stand up for them. I am trying to teach them to speak up for themselves, and I can honestly explain with any player why their PT is what it is. 3) Pandora's Box- once you let one many more will come, and it will be a competition between them to see who can complain the best to get their kid the most PT. 1. It doesn't if you don't let it. "Sorry ma'am...we are not discussing another player. This is your son's role with the team." Then be honest. "Maam we love little Johnny but we don't envision him not playing much this season. What he can DO is help us by being a good part of our scout team and helping us prepare. If he begins to be successful there against our #1s then things could change. But at this point he isn't ready to play more." 2. I agree with this. I would include the kid in the conversation so all three of us are on the same page about the kids role. I like your point though so maybe my first response with the parent would be to ask them if they had discussed the player's role with the player. 3. I don't think it's pandora's box. I am not saying to pander to the parents and play them more. I am saying they are giving us their most cherished commodity and going through great inconvenience in many cases to do so. I think that deserves and honest answer to their child's role, including playing time. I think communication clears up issues more than refusing to communicate.
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Post by dytmook on Sept 28, 2018 13:38:51 GMT -6
We will talk to parents about their kids but once they mention another kid we stop the conversation.
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Post by blb on Sept 28, 2018 13:49:02 GMT -6
Had a fun email from a parent earlier this year telling us how junior was "hard working and competitive, even if he isn't the biggest or fastest" and it wasn't fair he didn't play much in the game that day. On the opening kickoff of that game, he ran backwards on kickoff coverage to avoid contact, finishing the play 45 yards away from the ball. I just...I'm not trying to be mean to people, but it's not fair to the 10 other kids on the field to put somebody out there who does that.
Maybe he thought he was supposed to be the Safety?
I kid...
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Post by nicku on Sept 28, 2018 14:05:01 GMT -6
Had a fun email from a parent earlier this year telling us how junior was "hard working and competitive, even if he isn't the biggest or fastest" and it wasn't fair he didn't play much in the game that day. On the opening kickoff of that game, he ran backwards on kickoff coverage to avoid contact, finishing the play 45 yards away from the ball. I just...I'm not trying to be mean to people, but it's not fair to the 10 other kids on the field to put somebody out there who does that.
Maybe he thought he was supposed to be the Safety?
I kid...
That's what I was gonna say...hell, we can't get anyone to contain correctly on kickoff, I'll take that kid!
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Post by carookie on Sept 28, 2018 20:43:39 GMT -6
1) Because it inevitably turns into a discussion about someone else's kid(s). If lil Johnny aint playing, then its probably because big Bobby is better. So in the end I have to discus another child's abilities with an adult who is not their parent. 2) More often than not, the kid has not made an effort to self-advocate and is just relying on mommy to stand up for them. I am trying to teach them to speak up for themselves, and I can honestly explain with any player why their PT is what it is. 3) Pandora's Box- once you let one many more will come, and it will be a competition between them to see who can complain the best to get their kid the most PT. 1. It doesn't if you don't let it. "Sorry ma'am...we are not discussing another player. This is your son's role with the team." Then be honest. "Maam we love little Johnny but we don't envision him not playing much this season. What he can DO is help us by being a good part of our scout team and helping us prepare. If he begins to be successful there against our #1s then things could change. But at this point he isn't ready to play more." 2. I agree with this. I would include the kid in the conversation so all three of us are on the same page about the kids role. I like your point though so maybe my first response with the parent would be to ask them if they had discussed the player's role with the player. 3. I don't think it's pandora's box. I am not saying to pander to the parents and play them more. I am saying they are giving us their most cherished commodity and going through great inconvenience in many cases to do so. I think that deserves and honest answer to their child's role, including playing time. I think communication clears up issues more than refusing to communicate. I guess you and I have been at different types of places. In the cases I have been in, when a parent asks why there kid isn't playing what they are implying is, why arent I smart enough to play their kid. If they wanted an actual answer I imagine they'd ask "what could my kid do to have a better chance to play (or get more playing time)?" But I have yet to get that one.
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Post by Defcord on Sept 28, 2018 21:07:15 GMT -6
1. It doesn't if you don't let it. "Sorry ma'am...we are not discussing another player. This is your son's role with the team." Then be honest. "Maam we love little Johnny but we don't envision him not playing much this season. What he can DO is help us by being a good part of our scout team and helping us prepare. If he begins to be successful there against our #1s then things could change. But at this point he isn't ready to play more." 2. I agree with this. I would include the kid in the conversation so all three of us are on the same page about the kids role. I like your point though so maybe my first response with the parent would be to ask them if they had discussed the player's role with the player. 3. I don't think it's pandora's box. I am not saying to pander to the parents and play them more. I am saying they are giving us their most cherished commodity and going through great inconvenience in many cases to do so. I think that deserves and honest answer to their child's role, including playing time. I think communication clears up issues more than refusing to communicate. I guess you and I have been at different types of places. In the cases I have been in, when a parent asks why there kid isn't playing what they are implying is, why arent I smart enough to play their kid. If they wanted an actual answer I imagine they'd ask "what could my kid do to have a better chance to play (or get more playing time)?" But I have yet to get that one. I have seen both. Definitely more of the ones you are encountering for sure.
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Post by junior6589 on Sept 28, 2018 21:15:00 GMT -6
At that level I think you should find a place for the kid to play. Front line of kick return. Something. The result is secondary at that level, keeping the program flowing is first.
And before I get asked, our team has our fair share of space cadets at that level as well.
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Post by 19delta on Sept 29, 2018 9:01:31 GMT -6
I am not saying it's the right way to do things but I personally think every kid that is in good standing should play every game at the lower levels. And at varsity the kids that have been invested in the program should be played as often as possible. If our sport is struggling with numbers, then we need to allow kids to experience the best part of it...playing. I know their is value in competition and winning but on the freshmen B team surely there is a spot this could have gotten in without ruining the outcome for everything. If he was a turd, I would have a different opinion but good kids deserve to play. Plus you never know what will happen to a motivated kids in over the course of a 4 year high school career. He also didn't have his helmet. That's a legit reason, of course. But what about the other games in which he didn't get to play?
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Post by 19delta on Sept 29, 2018 9:04:47 GMT -6
Rule 1: We never discuss playing time with parents. Explain this to parents at the first parent meeting and every subsequent parent meeting. Make sure admin knows this is your rule. It will save you a lot of time and problems. I'm always willing to discuss playing time (or anything else, for that matter) with parents. However, I preface the request for a meeting by warning the parent that I am going to be brutally honest and they most likely aren't going to want to hear what I have to say.
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Post by 19delta on Sept 29, 2018 9:11:47 GMT -6
I am not saying it's the right way to do things but I personally think every kid that is in good standing should play every game at the lower levels. And at varsity the kids that have been invested in the program should be played as often as possible. If our sport is struggling with numbers, then we need to allow kids to experience the best part of it...playing. I know their is value in competition and winning but on the freshmen B team surely there is a spot this could have gotten in without ruining the outcome for everything. If he was a turd, I would have a different opinion but good kids deserve to play. Plus you never know what will happen to a motivated kids in over the course of a 4 year high school career. As right as you may be, i disagree. we dont have a participation rule, thats pop warner/aau/usa football. best kids play. rules for parents, we dont discuss playing time. you want to know why he didnt play, come to practice and watch him compete with the person in front of him. end of talk. as far as varsity kids being invested, yes they should play, in blowouts, homecoming games and senior night(if a senior) otherwise, win your battle with the #1 in your spot. im not going to pull a starter just to give little billy some burn because he came to 100% of the summer workouts. by the same token, i will yank a player for screwing up, starter or not. when you are evaulated on wins and losses, not for getting kids in games or sending kids to college, better score 50, give up 0 and win every game you can. not saying its right, but its reality in certain places. I vehemently disagree. The OP said this was a freshman "B" game. The purpose of having freshman "B" games is so everyone gets to play! If you are fortunate enough to coach at a school that has enough kids tio even have a freshman "B" team, it is incumbent upon you to use that game to get ALL of your freshman players quality snaps. Playing to win? In a freshman "B" game? Are you serious???
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Post by 19delta on Sept 29, 2018 9:15:48 GMT -6
Had a fun email from a parent earlier this year telling us how junior was "hard working and competitive, even if he isn't the biggest or fastest" and it wasn't fair he didn't play much in the game that day. On the opening kickoff of that game, he ran backwards on kickoff coverage to avoid contact, finishing the play 45 yards away from the ball. I just...I'm not trying to be mean to people, but it's not fair to the 10 other kids on the field to put somebody out there who does that. If this was at the varsity level, I agree with you. If it was a freshman B game, I don't.
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Post by planck on Sept 29, 2018 10:49:51 GMT -6
It was neither.
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Post by silkyice on Sept 29, 2018 11:12:33 GMT -6
Rule 1: We never discuss playing time with parents. Explain this to parents at the first parent meeting and every subsequent parent meeting. Make sure admin knows this is your rule. It will save you a lot of time and problems. I'm always willing to discuss playing time (or anything else, for that matter) with parents. However, I preface the request for a meeting by warning the parent that I am going to be brutally honest and they most likely aren't going to want to hear what I have to say. Same
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