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Post by larrymoe on Aug 20, 2018 20:19:27 GMT -6
What state and region do you coach? These are 16-18 year olds. They do make mistakes. Ga. Not about the kids or kids making mistakes. About coaches who put nowhere near the effort into coaching they demand from their kids.kids will make mistakes and perfectly understandable. When the mistakes are avoidable, fixable? And it continues to happen, is the issue. Those are coaches who are not putting out the same effort they demand of their kids. You must be on another level as a coach. I mean, you can tell what kind of coach and person someone is by watching film of their kids playing? That's amazing.
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Post by larrymoe on Aug 20, 2018 20:20:32 GMT -6
I'd rather have coaching football be my life than selling cars, or being a tellemarketer, or working in a facotry or pretty much anyother gig in the world. I'm absolutely certain I'd be absolutely miserable doing anything else with my life. No reason to reevaluate here.
I don't think larrymoe was referencing one's profession by "your life."
Precisely.
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klaby
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Post by klaby on Aug 22, 2018 9:07:29 GMT -6
I see it as 2 main issues. 1. its us. I just read and responded to a post where the Hc had his parent meeting the day before practice 1, then got upset when a parent said their kid cant make a practice because a pre-planned family event, and the response from the coach was then the kid is benched. So what support will you get for your program with parents when you do stupid crap like that. That is stupid, you wait til last minute and say mandatory this and mandatory that but dont give the parent good notice to adjust. So when a kid says I dont want to play, do you think the parent is like "no you need to stick it out, or it will be fun or you will like it". No the parent is like "good your coach is a Di&* anyway". #2 is FUN, which circles back around to #1 US. How many of you have watched a youth practice lately? If you do, you will see the fun sucked right out of the air. There is at least 1 on every staff, 1 Nick Saban, Vince Lombardi want to be yelling and screaming at kids. Then you will have the daddy ball aspect as well. So a kid goes to practice 4 days a week, gets the crap kicked out of them, has coach crazy yelling at them and then plays 3 plays on Saturday....damn that sounds like good fun to me! I mean where do i sign up.....now that kid is 6'4" 260 in HS and he is in show choir instead of football and we want to blame the kid cause he is "soft". These kids dont get paid to play, yet we expect them to make it their job in the off season. Go back and read some of the posts on the kid who came out late, more than half are "he didnt put the work in, he needs to make up this, he needs to do that". Same people now on this post bitchin cause numbers are down....the reason might just be the guy looking back at you in the morning when you shave....We need to look at how we are demanding from these parents and kids. Not every kid lives, eats and breaths football. Not every family does either. When you tell a kid that he has to do XYZ in the off season or he cant play, dont be surprised when he decides not to play. You make the work outs available, and you encourage, but you also need to understand these are KIDS, not Adults, and Kids need to have fun and that Kids dont make life decisions for themselves, mom and dad do. And if Mom and Dad says your going to spend a month with Grandpa and Grandma in XYZ state during the summer then we need to respect that. These arent your kids, they are your players, big difference. Now college, pros, yes different story, those are adults, making life decisions for themselves. Its just like a youth coach getting mad at a 12 year old for being late to practice....news flash the 12 year old cant drive! He also cant get mad at Dad for working late....So why are you yelling at a 12 year old for being late, or a 15 year old?
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Post by huddlehut on Aug 22, 2018 11:52:09 GMT -6
I see it as 2 main issues. 1. its us. I just read and responded to a post where the Hc had his parent meeting the day before practice 1, then got upset when a parent said their kid cant make a practice because a pre-planned family event, and the response from the coach was then the kid is benched. So what support will you get for your program with parents when you do stupid crap like that. That is stupid, you wait til last minute and say mandatory this and mandatory that but dont give the parent good notice to adjust. So when a kid says I dont want to play, do you think the parent is like "no you need to stick it out, or it will be fun or you will like it". No the parent is like "good your coach is a Di&* anyway". #2 is FUN, which circles back around to #1 US. How many of you have watched a youth practice lately? If you do, you will see the fun sucked right out of the air. There is at least 1 on every staff, 1 Nick Saban, Vince Lombardi want to be yelling and screaming at kids. Then you will have the daddy ball aspect as well. So a kid goes to practice 4 days a week, gets the crap kicked out of them, has coach crazy yelling at them and then plays 3 plays on Saturday....damn that sounds like good fun to me! I mean where do i sign up.....now that kid is 6'4" 260 in HS and he is in show choir instead of football and we want to blame the kid cause he is "soft". These kids dont get paid to play, yet we expect them to make it their job in the off season. Go back and read some of the posts on the kid who came out late, more than half are "he didnt put the work in, he needs to make up this, he needs to do that". Same people now on this post bitchin cause numbers are down....the reason might just be the guy looking back at you in the morning when you shave....We need to look at how we are demanding from these parents and kids. Not every kid lives, eats and breaths football. Not every family does either. When you tell a kid that he has to do XYZ in the off season or he cant play, dont be surprised when he decides not to play. You make the work outs available, and you encourage, but you also need to understand these are KIDS, not Adults, and Kids need to have fun and that Kids dont make life decisions for themselves, mom and dad do. And if Mom and Dad says your going to spend a month with Grandpa and Grandma in XYZ state during the summer then we need to respect that. These arent your kids, they are your players, big difference. Now college, pros, yes different story, those are adults, making life decisions for themselves. Its just like a youth coach getting mad at a 12 year old for being late to practice....news flash the 12 year old cant drive! He also cant get mad at Dad for working late....So why are you yelling at a 12 year old for being late, or a 15 year old? Amen!
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Post by coachcb on Aug 22, 2018 13:22:36 GMT -6
Well, I suggest that we look into solutions for the issue:
1. The concussion issue will fade away when concussions stop being prevalent. Make sure that the kids are outfitted with the proper equipment and teach proper tackling, shedding and blocking form. The number of concussions coming out of football around her has dropped significantly since coaches started teaching safer practices. We had more concussions coming out of basketball than football last year. And, the concussions in basketball were far, far worse because a kid rebounded the head off of a floor or a wall.
2.. Press home the importance of being a multiple sport athlete. Sell the other sports programs at every turn; show up to as many basketball games, wrestling matches, baseball games, track meets (etc..) as you can. Being a multiple sport coach certainly helps as well. The football players know I am going to get on them if they're not out for track. If they're out for Legion baseball, so be it.. But, I'm going to be pushing track all year long.
3. Honestly, it seems like we're fighting club sports for kids more and more these days. Hockey and fall baseball are getting popular around here, they're talking kids into specializing and it's a PITA. The best way to counteract this is to promote pride in ALL school athletics without trashing the club sports. Make sports a point of school pride, regardless of the success of certain sports.
4. Successful sports draw participation, PERIOD. Our wrestling program is one of the best in the state and they routinely have 50-60 kids out with a school population of 250. Track draws around 80-90 boys and girls.. We had an ugly season in football last year and our numbers have dropped to the high 30's..
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Post by CS on Aug 22, 2018 18:49:30 GMT -6
Well, I suggest that we look into solutions for the issue: 1. The concussion issue will fade away when concussions stop being prevalent. Make sure that the kids are outfitted with the proper equipment and teach proper tackling, shedding and blocking form. The number of concussions coming out of football around her has dropped significantly since coaches started teaching safer practices. We had more concussions coming out of basketball than football last year. And, the concussions in basketball were far, far worse because a kid rebounded the head off of a floor or a wall. 2.. Press home the importance of being a multiple sport athlete. Sell the other sports programs at every turn; show up to as many basketball games, wrestling matches, baseball games, track meets (etc..) as you can. Being a multiple sport coach certainly helps as well. The football players know I am going to get on them if they're not out for track. If they're out for Legion baseball, so be it.. But, I'm going to be pushing track all year long. 3. Honestly, it seems like we're fighting club sports for kids more and more these days. Hockey and fall baseball are getting popular around here, they're talking kids into specializing and it's a PITA. The best way to counteract this is to promote pride in ALL school athletics without trashing the club sports. Make sports a point of school pride, regardless of the success of certain sports. 4. Successful sports draw participation, PERIOD. Our wrestling program is one of the best in the state and they routinely have 50-60 kids out with a school population of 250. Track draws around 80-90 boys and girls.. We had an ugly season in football last year and our numbers have dropped to the high 30's.. fight fire with fire... Fall baseball? Spring football... Some states don’t allow spring football
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Post by coachks on Aug 23, 2018 20:20:21 GMT -6
Well, I suggest that we look into solutions for the issue: 1. The concussion issue will fade away when concussions stop being prevalent. Make sure that the kids are outfitted with the proper equipment and teach proper tackling, shedding and blocking form. The number of concussions coming out of football around her has dropped significantly since coaches started teaching safer practices. We had more concussions coming out of basketball than football last year. And, the concussions in basketball were far, far worse because a kid rebounded the head off of a floor or a wall. 2.. Press home the importance of being a multiple sport athlete. Sell the other sports programs at every turn; show up to as many basketball games, wrestling matches, baseball games, track meets (etc..) as you can. Being a multiple sport coach certainly helps as well. The football players know I am going to get on them if they're not out for track. If they're out for Legion baseball, so be it.. But, I'm going to be pushing track all year long. 3. Honestly, it seems like we're fighting club sports for kids more and more these days. Hockey and fall baseball are getting popular around here, they're talking kids into specializing and it's a PITA. The best way to counteract this is to promote pride in ALL school athletics without trashing the club sports. Make sports a point of school pride, regardless of the success of certain sports. 4. Successful sports draw participation, PERIOD. Our wrestling program is one of the best in the state and they routinely have 50-60 kids out with a school population of 250. Track draws around 80-90 boys and girls.. We had an ugly season in football last year and our numbers have dropped to the high 30's.. fight fire with fire... Fall baseball? Spring football... You know fighting fire with fire is actually a bad idea right?
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Post by fantom on Aug 23, 2018 22:12:18 GMT -6
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Post by silkyice on Aug 24, 2018 8:09:12 GMT -6
if you pay attention, the NFL tried very sneakily quietly to outlaw blocking and tackling...(I am not explaining this as I understand how hard this is to believe.. Or not) Don't believe it.
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Post by coachcb on Aug 24, 2018 14:50:29 GMT -6
Well, I suggest that we look into solutions for the issue: 1. The concussion issue will fade away when concussions stop being prevalent. Make sure that the kids are outfitted with the proper equipment and teach proper tackling, shedding and blocking form. The number of concussions coming out of football around her has dropped significantly since coaches started teaching safer practices. We had more concussions coming out of basketball than football last year. And, the concussions in basketball were far, far worse because a kid rebounded the head off of a floor or a wall. 2.. Press home the importance of being a multiple sport athlete. Sell the other sports programs at every turn; show up to as many basketball games, wrestling matches, baseball games, track meets (etc..) as you can. Being a multiple sport coach certainly helps as well. The football players know I am going to get on them if they're not out for track. If they're out for Legion baseball, so be it.. But, I'm going to be pushing track all year long. 3. Honestly, it seems like we're fighting club sports for kids more and more these days. Hockey and fall baseball are getting popular around here, they're talking kids into specializing and it's a PITA. The best way to counteract this is to promote pride in ALL school athletics without trashing the club sports. Make sports a point of school pride, regardless of the success of certain sports. 4. Successful sports draw participation, PERIOD. Our wrestling program is one of the best in the state and they routinely have 50-60 kids out with a school population of 250. Track draws around 80-90 boys and girls.. We had an ugly season in football last year and our numbers have dropped to the high 30's.. fight fire with fire... Fall baseball? Spring football...
Nope, we keep our mouths shut about the club sports but do everything we can to promote our school sports. The club sport coaches already trash anything outside of their sport so we take the high road. The fall baseball coaches are terrible about it but the kids playing for them are going to have a rude awakening over the next few months. They're going to be traveling constantly (we're talking 10+ hour drives..) and getting the chit kicked out of them by much, much better teams. They finished just below .500 against local competition during the spring so it's going to be an ugly fall for them.
In my experience, you just need to let the kids learn their lesson when it comes to this kind of specialization. You won't draw many kids away from a year-round club sport if they're successful but they'll matriculate back to school sports the minute they start losing.
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Post by larrymoe on Aug 25, 2018 12:13:17 GMT -6
Local D3 football program held a FREE kid's camp today for kids grade 1-6. My son is the only kid who attended.
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Post by blb on Aug 25, 2018 12:44:21 GMT -6
Local D3 football program held a FREE kid's camp today for kids grade 1-6. My son is the only kid who attended.
I understand your point but holding a "camp" now may be bad timing.
Also I don't know what a "camp" for kids, say grades 1-4, is going to teach them about Football they will carry with them.
Way too young.
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Post by larrymoe on Aug 25, 2018 15:29:53 GMT -6
Local D3 football program held a FREE kid's camp today for kids grade 1-6. My son is the only kid who attended.
I understand your point but holding a "camp" now may be bad timing.
Also I don't know what a "camp" for kids, say grades 1-4, is going to teach them about Football they will carry with them.
Way too young.
Does it matter? It was free babysitting for 2 hours. Usually you can offer to smack kids in the heads for two hours and if it means the kid is out of the house you'll at least have a dozen parents dump their kids off. And yet, no one took their kids.
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Post by coachd5085 on Aug 25, 2018 15:42:26 GMT -6
I understand your point but holding a "camp" now may be bad timing.
Also I don't know what a "camp" for kids, say grades 1-4, is going to teach them about Football they will carry with them.
Way too young.
Does it matter? It was free babysitting for 2 hours. Usually you can offer to smack kids in the heads for two hours and if it means the kid is out of the house you'll at least have a dozen parents dump their kids off. And yet, no one took their kids. I think the point being made here is that yes, the overall participation in HS football nationwide is down, and yes, in your area the interest seems to be waning, but in some other places its popularity is growing. It just isn't important in your area (which also is evident by your biographical post outlining your career path)
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Post by larrymoe on Aug 25, 2018 16:49:29 GMT -6
Does it matter? It was free babysitting for 2 hours. Usually you can offer to smack kids in the heads for two hours and if it means the kid is out of the house you'll at least have a dozen parents dump their kids off. And yet, no one took their kids. I think the point being made here is that yes, the overall participation in HS football nationwide is down, and yes, in your area the interest seems to be waning, but in some other places its popularity is growing. It just isn't important in your area (which also is evident by your biographical post outlining your career path) To be clear, interest in the sport isn't waning, just participation in the sport. I see more student and media interest in games than any other time in my life.
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Post by Chris Clement on Aug 27, 2018 8:36:59 GMT -6
So if we run with larrymoe’s argument, then the question is who are these kids that would have come out n the past but no longer do? My first guess is that it’s a lot of kids who would not have played significant roles and the increased options means they can have their cake and eat it too; they can enjoy football casually while participating in an activity they’re actually somewhat good at.
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Post by blb on Aug 27, 2018 8:49:27 GMT -6
So if we run with larrymoe ’s argument, then the question is who are these kids that would have come out n the past but no longer do? My first guess is that it’s a lot of kids who would not have played significant roles and the increased options means they can have their cake and eat it too; they can enjoy football casually while participating in an activity they’re actually somewhat good at.
Kids are no longer willing to work so hard (especially Off-Season) just to sit the bench.
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Post by tigerpride on Aug 27, 2018 10:21:50 GMT -6
Numbers are down in my area. The ky powers that be have turned it into a year around sport. I played 15 years of football, including 5 in college. Players spend more time with their high schools now then back in the mid 80s than I did in college. When I played, our first practice was August 1 but now the season begins in April of your 8th grade year (w weights) and stops after your last game played. Unless you play another sport, you get the month of December off, spring break and a two week summer break. It's basically 10 + months. Many kids don't want to spend 10 months on this.
In KY, we have spring football (dumb, IMO) and can have helmets on all summer long (another dumb). If you dont participate in spring football, you are considered a bad coach, not utilizing your days of preparation. But let's face it, we are guilty of doing it to keep up with the Jones's. When you do spring FB, many spring sport kids may think they don't have a chance to win a starting job.
I think kids still love football, but its way too much time IMO.
With basketball and baseball, there are lots of games and fewer practices. They get instant gratification. In football, you have to wait a week. And let's not forget that weights and the off season time is not worth it for many.
I agree that football is VERY hyped up. It certainly is here in NKY and Cincinnati. With that said, there are many strong winning programs who are going to have large numbers and draw great crowds. But for every strong program, there is another program with limited numbers and resources and some HC working his tail off to keep it afloat.
Concussions have nothing to do with it IMO. When you look at concussions, the NFL and law suits -- I think you have to throw in the fact that those guys play 15-25 years of football. Many of their hits have been from the strongest and powerful athletes in the world. Only 1% of our players probably make it thru college and only a few make it to the NFL. I can't say I recall many players having serious long term trauma from a JV hit they took in 11th grade.
Lastly, and most importantly, there are better things to do for most kids like playing video games and smoking pot. With the family dynamics changing for the worse, most kids wonder what they are going to eat, who their father is, how are they going to get to school, etc...... i was lucky to have supportive parents who pushed me to participate and supported my participation.
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Post by Chris Clement on Aug 27, 2018 11:03:23 GMT -6
So if we run with larrymoe ’s argument, then the question is who are these kids that would have come out n the past but no longer do? My first guess is that it’s a lot of kids who would not have played significant roles and the increased options means they can have their cake and eat it too; they can enjoy football casually while participating in an activity they’re actually somewhat good at.
Kids are no longer willing to work so hard (especially Off-Season) just to sit the bench.
Can you blame them?
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Post by blb on Aug 27, 2018 11:16:57 GMT -6
Kids are no longer willing to work so hard (especially Off-Season) just to sit the bench.
Can you blame them?
Not at all. Especially if they have to Pay to "Play" (many euphemisms - 'Participation Fees' - being used to try to cover that up these days).
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2018 15:09:41 GMT -6
Not at all. Especially if they have to Pay to "Play" (many euphemisms - 'Participation Fees' - being used to try to cover that up these days).
It's stuff like this that makes me think the future of the game may wind up being 6 man football. Fewer players needed, less expensive to field a team, and everyone gets a chance to score.
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Post by blb on Aug 27, 2018 15:56:10 GMT -6
Not at all. Especially if they have to Pay to "Play" (many euphemisms - 'Participation Fees' - being used to try to cover that up these days).
It's stuff like this that makes me think the future of the game may wind up being 6 man football. Fewer players needed, less expensive to field a team, and everyone gets a chance to score.
Perhaps in some states at HS level.
It is interesting that in last decade four colleges in my state have started football programs with a fifth next year.
And no, I don't live in TX, CA, or FL.
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coachddwebb
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Post by coachddwebb on Aug 27, 2018 16:16:00 GMT -6
Maybe all the kids playing JC in Phoenix and Tucson this year can go there, because they are canceling the JC programs at the end of the season.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2018 17:08:27 GMT -6
It's stuff like this that makes me think the future of the game may wind up being 6 man football. Fewer players needed, less expensive to field a team, and everyone gets a chance to score.
Perhaps in some states at HS level.
It is interesting that in last decade four colleges in my state have started football programs with a fifth next year.
And no, I don't live in TX, CA, or FL.
It's different for colleges though. The NAIA and D3 schools use it to get students' tuition money. D2 and D1 schools see it as being a PR and branding effort. HS don't really have either of those concerns. My alma mater (ETSU) dropped football shortly before I graduated as a cost-cutting measure, after naming the Tennis Coach as AD and then embarking on building all the non-revenue producing sports nice new stadiums. They brought it back a few years ago when a new President took over, fired the old AD, and named a former football player as the new AD. It's still deeply in the red, but the administration loves the prestige and attention it brings the university. Other schools that dropped football, like Austin Peay, have brought it back, too. I can see 6 man as the future of the youth and HS games in a lot of places. If insurance costs keep ballooning and the desire to turn it into glorified flag football continues, I could even see a pro 6 man league filling a niche.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2018 14:46:38 GMT -6
Just heard another school in PA that has had 3 straight winning seasons , just cancelled their season because of low numbers
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Post by blb on Aug 29, 2018 15:12:51 GMT -6
Just heard another school in PA that has had 3 straight winning seasons , just cancelled their season because of low numbers
What is that school's enrollment?
Are there other mitigating factors?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2018 15:28:28 GMT -6
Just heard another school in PA that has had 3 straight winning seasons , just cancelled their season because of low numbers
What is that school's enrollment?
Are there other mitigating factors?
Enrollment 900, private academy, grades Pre k Through 12 tuition is $16k Not sure what factors affected it, however I hear last year they had approx 40 kids out for football, this year it was around 20
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Post by blb on Aug 29, 2018 15:39:52 GMT -6
What is that school's enrollment?
Are there other mitigating factors?
Enrollment 900, private academy, grades Pre k Through 12 tuition is $16k Not sure what factors affected it, however I hear last year they had approx 40 kids out for football, this year it was around 20
What is enrollment 9-12 that they could draw Football players from?
If enrollment is 900 Pre-K through 12 I'm guessing that the HS is less than 150 boys and girls. Maybe significantly less (half?).
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2018 16:02:40 GMT -6
No Idea coach
I know this
Last few years, program thriving
This year....Program nixed, and this is one of many this year I've heard across the country.
So I guess well see what happens
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Post by fantom on Aug 29, 2018 16:11:53 GMT -6
No Idea coach I know this Last few years, program thriving This year....Program nixed, and this is one of many this year I've heard across the country. So I guess well see what happens What school? Some schools may be just too small to support a football program.
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