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Post by jg78 on Jul 2, 2018 12:07:07 GMT -6
If you were considering taking a job in which you would be the HFC but not AD, what would be some dealbreakers for you that could exist if you're not in charge of the athletic program?
For example, if you were offered a job as HFC but the AD (who is also, say, the b'ball coach) would run the weight room with your input being secondary? Would that be a dealbreaker? I know it would be for some. What about other plausible scenarios?
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Post by 19delta on Jul 2, 2018 12:34:03 GMT -6
If you were considering taking a job in which you would be the HFC but not AD, what would be some dealbreakers for you that could exist if you're not in charge of the athletic program? For example, if you were offered a job as HFC but the AD (who is also, say, the b'ball coach) would run the weight room with your input being secondary? Would that be a dealbreaker? I know it would be for some. What about other plausible scenarios? Most basketball coaches are completely clueless when it comes to the weightroom. I don't care for my football players to spend a half hour on ab work and use calf raises as a max effort lift. That scenario would 100% be a dealbreaker for me.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2018 12:50:38 GMT -6
I hire, fire my own staff
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Post by CS on Jul 2, 2018 13:13:36 GMT -6
If you were considering taking a job in which you would be the HFC but not AD, what would be some dealbreakers for you that could exist if you're not in charge of the athletic program? For example, if you were offered a job as HFC but the AD (who is also, say, the b'ball coach) would run the weight room with your input being secondary? Would that be a dealbreaker? I know it would be for some. What about other plausible scenarios? The deal breaker for me right off the bat is that the basketball coach is the AD
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Post by jg78 on Jul 2, 2018 13:15:51 GMT -6
If you were considering taking a job in which you would be the HFC but not AD, what would be some dealbreakers for you that could exist if you're not in charge of the athletic program? For example, if you were offered a job as HFC but the AD (who is also, say, the b'ball coach) would run the weight room with your input being secondary? Would that be a dealbreaker? I know it would be for some. What about other plausible scenarios? Most basketball coaches are completely clueless when it comes to the weightroom. I don't care for my football players to spend a half hour on ab work and use calf raises as a max effort lift. That scenario would 100% be a dealbreaker for me. What about some guru from outside the program? As HFC, is it necessary for you to have the final say in the weight room?
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Post by bigmoot on Jul 2, 2018 13:36:05 GMT -6
With regards to the weight room...its not an absolute. I have a coach who runs the weight room. He does his deal. I'm good as long as I see the progress I want. But he is my guy and it's one of the reasons I hired him.
Control of money and fundraising would be big on my list.
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Post by irishdog on Jul 2, 2018 13:38:37 GMT -6
If you know what you're talking about, and can convince a guru from outside the program that what you want to see done in the weight room with the football players is going to benefit them as athletes and not just football players it will carry more weight with that guy than an AD who is the hoops coach.
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Post by coachbdud on Jul 2, 2018 14:12:36 GMT -6
I would need to see what his program looks like before deciding i would let him (or anyone else besides me) take over the lifting for MY football program
I would also want -control of my staff -ability to get ALL of my program into a weight training class -ability to bring teachers in to coach -full control of our budget
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Post by Yash on Jul 2, 2018 14:41:59 GMT -6
My next school will not be good at show choir (laugh but we lose kids to it yearly) and will not care about American legion baseball. My current school the kids care more about legion baseball than school ball.
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Post by bigmoot on Jul 2, 2018 15:29:58 GMT -6
My next school will not be good at show choir (laugh but we lose kids to it yearly) and will not care about American legion baseball. My current school the kids care more about legion baseball than school ball. Dang traveling teams, your kid ain't good enough to make team A, let's just create a new one.
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Post by groundchuck on Jul 2, 2018 16:57:55 GMT -6
Some of those would be deal breakers. I’d also want to find out how the last head coach and other head coaches in the district were/are treated. Some places have a history of problems that never seem to go away or get better.
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Post by carookie on Jul 2, 2018 17:19:29 GMT -6
Most basketball coaches are completely clueless when it comes to the weightroom. I don't care for my football players to spend a half hour on ab work and use calf raises as a max effort lift. That scenario would 100% be a dealbreaker for me. What about some guru from outside the program? As HFC, is it necessary for you to have the final say in the weight room? Honestly, it depends on the guru; I would have to know him. I have worked with some 'gurus' who didn't know how to run a wt. room- sometimes not really a 'guru' mostly someone who didn't know how to communicate, manage time, or effectively coordinate a program. There is more to running a wt room than simply knowing what lifts to do and how to do them.
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Post by coachd5085 on Jul 2, 2018 19:31:36 GMT -6
Most basketball coaches are completely clueless when it comes to the weightroom. I don't care for my football players to spend a half hour on ab work and use calf raises as a max effort lift. That scenario would 100% be a dealbreaker for me. What about some guru from outside the program? As HFC, is it necessary for you to have the final say in the weight room? Yes. It is for me. As a USWA certified coach and having been somewhat familiar with the S&C game who knows the difference between training and wearing someone out, I want final say. Now, having final say doesn't mean "We are running my program because I am the best ever" It simply means that I want to be able to tell the functional bosa ball balancing guru, nope..no thank you. I want to be able to sit down and have an intelligent conversation with whoever is running the gym (might be the man in the mirror) and have reasons for everything that I am ok with.
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Post by coachjm on Jul 4, 2018 7:20:20 GMT -6
Ultimately, it comes down to how badly I need/want the job. If your out of work and need to find employment I'm not sure there are any deal breakers... If you are highly sought after you can set a list of specific criteria and ensure you get all of it to take the position. In the end your job is to make the most of the situation you inherit.
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Post by blb on Jul 4, 2018 7:31:14 GMT -6
If I'm going to be evaluated in large part by my players' performance on the field I want to be the one in charge of their development (Strength Training-Conditioning).
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Post by coachmanny on Jul 7, 2018 8:08:13 GMT -6
It's most important that a head football coach have complete autonomy when it comes to player development. I would steer away from any situation where you can't develop your players in areas outside of the actual practice times. You will spend more time in the weight room than you will on the practice field and the culture is developed year round in this setting.
It's also important to be able to promote your program and do some considerable fund raising so that your players can benefit from the money you are able to raise. If they don't let you raise money and be in charge of where it goes, that will make it difficult to optimize the program.
Interviewing current assistant coaches and having the final decision on their hiring would also be extremely important. I've seen too many new head coaches get undermined by an assistant who has a totally different agenda than the head coach.
Hope that helps.
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Post by joelee on Jul 7, 2018 9:45:55 GMT -6
One thing that people haven't mentioned but it happens here in my state. I'm not taking a job that doesn't have/contract a certified medical athletic trainer. If they don't have that the program is not important to the school and the welfare of the kids isn't important enough to the admin.
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Post by gccwolverine on Jul 7, 2018 13:18:24 GMT -6
One thing that people haven't mentioned but it happens here in my state. I'm not taking a job that doesn't have/contract a certified medical athletic trainer. If they don't have that the program is not important to the school and the welfare of the kids isn't important enough to the admin. We had 1 2 years ago we didn't this last season. Honestly, life is so much better with out her and its not even close.
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Post by blb on Jul 7, 2018 13:24:29 GMT -6
One thing that people haven't mentioned but it happens here in my state. I'm not taking a job that doesn't have/contract a certified medical athletic trainer. If they don't have that the program is not important to the school and the welfare of the kids isn't important enough to the admin. We had 1 2 years ago we didn't this last season. Honestly, life is so much better with out her and its not even close.
Maybe you had a bad one but that's on administration.
I wouldn't want to coach at a school that didn't have a certified ATC.
And the two best I had were both female.
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Post by gccwolverine on Jul 7, 2018 13:29:38 GMT -6
We had 1 2 years ago we didn't this last season. Honestly, life is so much better with out her and its not even close.
Maybe you had a bad one but that's on administration.
I wouldn't want to coach at a school that didn't have a certified ATC.
And the two best I had were both female.
every bruise was a sprain, strain, or possible break which resulted in the kid being out, every knick resulted in the kids flocking to her during practice, everyone all of a sudden had to be taped everyday was a nightmare. I would be all for a good ATC but all my experiences outside of my playing experience in college tell me that I haven't found 1 accept for when I was playing in college. Need an ATC that understands that there is a difference between banged up and injured. Sprains, Strains, Pulls, Breaks, Dislocations, Head injuries = injured. Bruises, knicks, discomfort = play on.
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Post by blb on Jul 7, 2018 13:36:41 GMT -6
every bruise was a sprain, strain, or possible break which resulted in the kid being out, every knick resulted in the kids flocking to her during practice, everyone all of a sudden had to be taped everyday was a nightmare. I would be all for a good ATC but all my experiences outside of my playing experience in college tell me that I haven't found 1 accept for when I was playing in college.
Sorry for you, but that was not my experience.
You would rather have your coaches (including you perhaps) have to tape ankles, diagnose kids with possible concussions-determine who should go through "Protocol" and when they can get back on the field?
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Post by CS on Jul 7, 2018 13:37:54 GMT -6
Maybe you had a bad one but that's on administration.
I wouldn't want to coach at a school that didn't have a certified ATC.
And the two best I had were both female.
every bruise was a sprain, strain, or possible break which resulted in the kid being out, every knick resulted in the kids flocking to her during practice, everyone all of a sudden had to be taped everyday was a nightmare. I would be all for a good ATC but all my experiences outside of my playing experience in college tell me that I haven't found 1 accept for when I was playing in college. Our trainer is great. She doesn’t baby them at all and will actually get pi$$ed at them for coming to her with boo boos.
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Post by blb on Jul 7, 2018 13:43:02 GMT -6
Our trainer is great. She doesn’t baby them at all and will actually get pi$$ed at them for coming to her with boo boos.
That was my experience as well.
No "owies" either.
But if they were legitimately injured they got great care-treatment-rehab and were back on the field ASAP.
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Post by gccwolverine on Jul 7, 2018 13:43:25 GMT -6
every bruise was a sprain, strain, or possible break which resulted in the kid being out, every knick resulted in the kids flocking to her during practice, everyone all of a sudden had to be taped everyday was a nightmare. I would be all for a good ATC but all my experiences outside of my playing experience in college tell me that I haven't found 1 accept for when I was playing in college.
Sorry for you, but that was not my experience.
You would rather have your coaches (including you perhaps) have to tape ankles, diagnose kids with possible concussions-determine who should go through "Protocol" and when they can get back on the field?
No I wouldn't I would prefer a good ATC. Haven't seen 1 yet at the HS level that has the ability to *differentiate* between serious injury and, get back out there. As far as concussions so we don't diagnose anyone. If the kid says my head hurts, or doesn't look right after a big hit he's just out and won't be back until he's symptom free.
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Post by blb on Jul 7, 2018 13:50:09 GMT -6
"disseminate"?
Again - you need to have your school-AD hire someone that is qualified and experienced.
Unless you are just going to disagree with whoever the trainer is about extent of injuries and "get back out there"?
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Post by gccwolverine on Jul 7, 2018 13:55:22 GMT -6
"disseminate"? Again - you need to have your school-AD hire someone that is qualified and experienced. Unless you are just going to disagree with whoever the trainer is about extent of injuries and "get back out there"? I'm not the header so It's not my conversation to have with the school or AD. I just know life was better this year without her. Baseball and basketball all say the same thing too.
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Post by blb on Jul 7, 2018 14:17:26 GMT -6
"disseminate"? Again - you need to have your school-AD hire someone that is qualified and experienced. Unless you are just going to disagree with whoever the trainer is about extent of injuries and "get back out there"? I'm not the header so It's not my conversation to have with the school or AD. I just know life was better this year without her. Baseball and basketball all say the same thing too.
I'm sure there are incompetent trainers just like there are bad coaches.
Would still rather have one to CYA and relieve coaches from having to assume those duties.
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Post by coachjm on Jul 7, 2018 14:32:06 GMT -6
I'm not the header so It's not my conversation to have with the school or AD. I just know life was better this year without her. Baseball and basketball all say the same thing too.
I'm sure there are incompetent trainers just like there are bad coaches.
Would still rather have one to CYA and relieve coaches from having to assume those duties.
There absolutely is and I have had both. However, I agree with blb the vast majority are a major asset to the program... They are medical experts that are hired from a local hospital or medical institution that provides first response services to student athletes. With experience they know the difference between someone "getting out of practice" and who has an injury. However, with that stated those who are "getting out of practice" likely not are helping the team much in the end.. I have worked with 8 certified athletic trainers and all have been tremendous assets.... I have worked with some student trainers who were working towards their certifications that weren't great but more were good then not in that program even and the vast majority of issues that arrised were more realated to immaturity issues then their understanding of student injuries..
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Post by freezeoption on Jul 8, 2018 15:13:00 GMT -6
In most cases around here, schools don't have a trainer. In the schools that had one it saved me a lot of work. In schools that didn't have one I did it.
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Post by coolhandluke on Jul 14, 2018 12:44:02 GMT -6
If you were considering taking a job in which you would be the HFC but not AD, what would be some dealbreakers for you that could exist if you're not in charge of the athletic program? For example, if you were offered a job as HFC but the AD (who is also, say, the b'ball coach) would run the weight room with your input being secondary? Would that be a dealbreaker? I know it would be for some. What about other plausible scenarios? The deal breaker for me right off the bat is that the basketball coach is the AD Or baseball. Just about as bad.
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