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Post by coachwoodall on Sept 22, 2017 22:46:07 GMT -6
Thanks as always for the response fellas. We ended up scoring 11 TDs in the first half and one more (by the JV) during the running clock in the second half. My last starter scored with 8:13 left in the 2nd quarter making the score 51-6. We started subbing our 2s and 3s early. Our starters only played 16 minutes or so of the game. We had 2 sophomores score 2 TDs a piece. 9 guys carried the ball, the second half was entirely JV so was the last 3 minutes of the first half. We called only one pass the whole game (for a TD) and ran basic formations with Buck Sweep and FB Trap from the 8 minute mark of the second quarter. The score ended up 83-14. They also had six turnovers inside of their own 20 plus attempted and failed a punt fake on their own 21 yard line. We scored off of each of those plus we had a kick returned and a punt retuned for TDs. Of course the other team's coaches were upset. They left their starters in and blitzed like crazy agains our JVs and even on-side kicked and recovered it against our JVs. They thought we were trying to run it up but we were definitely not. If we had been we'd have scored triple digits with ease. I just never want that to happen again. Not because I care about how their coaches feel, but for their players. It's not the players fault they weren't properly prepared for our game and I hate to think we may have turned one of their kids off of football because of a ridiculous sore like that. Thanks again coaches for your advice and experience. If their coaches were as bad as your describe, I seriously doubt your team and how many it scored would be THE deciding factor for any of their kids giving up the ghost. I'm sure if any of them did, they had the idea long before your game b/c of their coaches. You saw (maybe foresaw) the outcome as it was unfolding. You made the honorable attempt to show sportsmanship. Their coaches chose to see it otherwise and use it for their own purpose. You did no wrong.
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Post by Defcord on Sept 22, 2017 23:02:16 GMT -6
Thanks as always for the response fellas. We ended up scoring 11 TDs in the first half and one more (by the JV) during the running clock in the second half. My last starter scored with 8:13 left in the 2nd quarter making the score 51-6. We started subbing our 2s and 3s early. Our starters only played 16 minutes or so of the game. We had 2 sophomores score 2 TDs a piece. 9 guys carried the ball, the second half was entirely JV so was the last 3 minutes of the first half. We called only one pass the whole game (for a TD) and ran basic formations with Buck Sweep and FB Trap from the 8 minute mark of the second quarter. The score ended up 83-14. They also had six turnovers inside of their own 20 plus attempted and failed a punt fake on their own 21 yard line. We scored off of each of those plus we had a kick returned and a punt retuned for TDs. Of course the other team's coaches were upset. They left their starters in and blitzed like crazy agains our JVs and even on-side kicked and recovered it against our JVs. They thought we were trying to run it up but we were definitely not. If we had been we'd have scored triple digits with ease. I just never want that to happen again. Not because I care about how their coaches feel, but for their players. It's not the players fault they weren't properly prepared for our game and I hate to think we may have turned one of their kids off of football because of a ridiculous sore like that. Thanks again coaches for your advice and experience. Who the heck fakes a punt from -21 and then complains about getting the score ran up on them?
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Post by agap on Sept 23, 2017 22:24:21 GMT -6
Run your base plays no matter what they are. We never got upset at a team that won big by simply running their base plays. At the end of the day, the defense has to stop them; if ours doesn't, than it's not the other teams fault. what if their base is 4 verts? Serious question. If 4 verts was one of their base plays, it wouldn't bother me if I was coaching against them. We were down big against a team that threw hitches all the time; they threw hitch late in the game when they were up by 40+ and scored after a missed tackle. That was fine with me because it was one of their top plays. If 4 verts was a top play and we didn't stop it, then that's not the other team's fault.
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Post by tippecanoe41 on Sept 24, 2017 0:50:26 GMT -6
Gentelmen, We are fortunate this year in that we are a loaded team. Even our back-ups are better than a lot of the the teams we play starters. Last week we were attempting to speed the end of the game and prevent injuries at the same time and even our JV kept scoring on basic trap plays. What strategies/tactics do you coaches employ to keep the score from becoming ridiculous Madden scores? Don't get me wrong we still wanna beat teams thoroughly but we don't want to embarrass them with an 80 point game and a 70 point spread. As usual, thanks ahead of time for your advice. I'll just say this is a great problem to have.
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Post by badtotheflexbone on Sept 24, 2017 10:25:16 GMT -6
Imitate the greats "What do you want me to do? Kick a field goal?" - Bill Belichick (2007) on why he went for on 4th and 2 when leading by 30+ points (just kidding)
Side question: What happens when you score triple digit? Does the scoreboard break (serious question!)
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Post by carookie on Sept 24, 2017 10:27:28 GMT -6
This may seem like an odd one, but you can give them the 2nd half kickoff, even if you are due to receive it. Played a team a couple weeks ago and were up 30-0 by the end of the 1st qtr. I have a very limited roster so everyone starts on one side or the other (can't really put in any backups).
I spoke to refs at half about trying to keep it classy and they suggested this, I thought at first it might be a little insulting but he said he'd talk to the other team's coach and they were up for it. I think it at least established in everyone's mind that we are doing all we could not to run up the score- although it freaked out our players for a moment.
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Post by jg78 on Sept 24, 2017 14:24:37 GMT -6
On the flip side of this, I get aggravated with teams that leave their starters in the game after we've pulled ours and start scoring garbage TD's on our worst eleven and then kicking onside kicks when the game is far out of reach.
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Post by carookie on Sept 24, 2017 14:30:14 GMT -6
On the flip side of this, I get aggravated with teams that leave their starters in the game after we've pulled ours and start scoring garbage TD's on our worst eleven and then kicking onside kicks when the game is far out of reach. I don't mind that as much, they are free to try to come back to the best of their abilities and MOV shouldnt be an issue. I don't like it when they line up everyone in the box and don't respect our receivers and then get upset when we complete a pass to keep them honest. I am not going to run my backup RB behind a backup OL into a meat grinder- that is a player safety concern.
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Post by jg78 on Sept 24, 2017 14:55:18 GMT -6
We're free to do whatever we want within the rules. We're free to win 100-0 if we want to. But just as the team with the huge lead should show some class and mercy, the team on the receiving end shouldn't go crazy against the subs. They should sub themselves. And kicking an onside kick when it's 49-6 with 2:00 left in the game is just stupid.
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famar
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Post by famar on Sept 24, 2017 19:25:41 GMT -6
It's a no win situation. You try try do the right thing and not embarrass the other team, yet there's always some jackass coach who will accuse you of running up the score when you have 3rd string kids in running dive and they can't stop it.
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Post by MICoach on Sept 25, 2017 6:37:24 GMT -6
We had this happen several times when I coached at the youth and middle school level.. We beat one team 70-6 and all we called was Buck trap and Belly Iso during the second half, without any of our more athletic kids in. We just kept popping off big runs because their defense was so poorly coached. The idiot across the way kept his studs in all game long and then had the nerve to b-tch at me at the end of the game. I told him he had more pressing things to worry about than whine at me when his starters couldn't stop our 3rd stringers. We had a similar situation on our hands two weeks later and the league commissioner actually asked us to start taking a knee in the middle of the fourth quarter. I refused to do so and got dragged into a meeting with him and some other league officials the next week. I told them that we absolutely wouldn't be taking a knee. It wasn't fair to our kids as they have every right to actually play the entire game and shouldn't be denied that because the opposing coaches don't know sh-t about football. And, I then went on a tirade over the fact that I was getting chewed out and asked to make accommodations when the opposing coaches were leaving their starters in all game long. It's really a no-win situation. As has been pointed out, all you can do is get your younger guys in early and keep plugging away. It's the opposing defense's job to stop you and it's on them if they can't do it. We got the sh-t kicked out of us at the HS level a few years back by an Air Raid team that threw screens, draws, and a few short passes with their freshmen and sophs out there. We didn't stop them and our HC complained that they were running up the score by throwing the ball. Our DC looked at him and said "it's on us if we can't stop a freshman WR from getting 7 yards on a bubble screen..." This is a throwback, but way back in the lawless 1990's when I was in middle school, my dad was our head coach. We had a team with I believe 14 total players. Within those 14 players were a future Division II player, two future Division III players, another kid who could've played DII, and 1-2 college baseball players. So when we were up we had to pull out guys for breaks and move people to new positions, but no matter what we could only pull three guys out of the game at any given time. Our league was just a shootout between us and another team with a similar makeup of players, but against the middle-of-the-pack teams we could usually keep the score respectable by running up the middle with replacement players (guard becomes fullback, tight end becomes running back, center becomes tight end, etc.). Unfortunately against one of the weaker teams in the league we ended up winning by 68 or something and the opposing head coach wanted to fight my dad at midfield after the game. Like you said, it's a no-win situation sometimes. I only remember this example because my dad still talks about feeling bad about it, but when it comes down to it you can't fault your worst players for scoring against someone's starters.
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Post by bigmoot on Sept 25, 2017 6:53:48 GMT -6
On the flip side of this, I get aggravated with teams that leave their starters in the game after we've pulled ours and start scoring garbage TD's on our worst eleven and then kicking onside kicks when the game is far out of reach. I understand, but sometimes my starters are about the same as your 2nd stringers and we need to get better. We might go a couple of series with our 1's still in, then begin to empty the bench.
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Post by blb on Sept 25, 2017 7:15:01 GMT -6
On the flip side of this, I get aggravated with teams that leave their starters in the game after we've pulled ours and start scoring garbage TD's on our worst eleven and then kicking onside kicks when the game is far out of reach.
Some coaches just don't know when to surrender.
Would think it causes them morale problems with their backups when they realize they aren't going to play even when getting blown out.
I have been tempted to leave our 1s in when faced with the situation you describe, jg78 . We're blowing somebody out, sub, and the other guy blitzes the he11 out of our 2nd Offense, leaves his 1st offense in to build their stats against our 2nd Defense, onside kicking.
I.e., we're not going to sub until you surrender. You want to continue to play the game as if it hasn't been decided? Fine. Then the final score is on you.
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Post by coachfrankc on Sept 25, 2017 7:15:12 GMT -6
I'm on the receiving end of these at the freshman level with most of my kids being first year players. We lost 62-6 our first game which was fine because the opposing coach took his starters out and ran up the middle most plays. We just couldn't stop it. Last year we played teams that kept their starters in all game, throwing the ball up 50-0 and that's when I lose respect for those programs.
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Post by fantom on Sept 25, 2017 7:22:43 GMT -6
It's a no win situation. You try try do the right thing and not embarrass the other team, yet there's always some jackass coach who will accuse you of running up the score when you have 3rd string kids in running dive and they can't stop it. You can't please everyone so you gotta please yourself. Rick Nelson.
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Post by coachwoodall on Sept 25, 2017 7:35:27 GMT -6
I know a guy that was up in a game 77-0 at halftime. He punted on 1st down the entire second half.
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Post by StraightFlexin on Sept 25, 2017 7:48:21 GMT -6
Ran into this problem a lot being a veer team. If you can't stop midline in the first half, chances are you are not going to be able to stop it in the 2nd with back ups. I remember many years ago taking a knee in the 2nd quarter up 49-0. Worst part was the opponent kept throwing and turning the ball over non stop.
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Post by hunhdisciple on Sept 25, 2017 8:32:42 GMT -6
I knew a guy a few years ago who chose to start every drive in the second half with a penalty. They were dominating so heavily and were significantly deeper, so he kept calling trap and ISO. But he said he figured it would at least make it look a little less bad. They won by almost 80, and ended up having kids slide down on long runs. It's a great problem to have, but aside from taking a knee or committing repeated penalties, there's not much you can do. I know a guy who won 77-0 that punted on 1st down the entire second half. Geez. I'm not even sure how I would describe that.
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Post by coachthomason on Sept 25, 2017 11:52:21 GMT -6
This may seem like an odd one, but you can give them the 2nd half kickoff, even if you are due to receive it. Played a team a couple weeks ago and were up 30-0 by the end of the 1st qtr. I have a very limited roster so everyone starts on one side or the other (can't really put in any backups). I spoke to refs at half about trying to keep it classy and they suggested this, I thought at first it might be a little insulting but he said he'd talk to the other team's coach and they were up for it. I think it at least established in everyone's mind that we are doing all we could not to run up the score- although it freaked out our players for a moment. We've done this a few times.
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Post by tribepride on Sept 25, 2017 13:14:06 GMT -6
We have asked and had officials call us for holding if we broke long runs with the 3rd string. Also, we have told the quarterback to hit the fullback in the knees on the handoff so we fumble. We cant change our schedule and a team on our schedule was amazingly horrible. If we were to not do those things we would of scored 100+ points. No need to be on Good Morning America!
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Post by cqmiller on Sept 25, 2017 13:24:17 GMT -6
If you put in your 2nd or even 3rd string... I won't get pissed even if you call a pass play. You have "called off the dogs" when you put your 2s and 3s in. If you call a hitch with your backup QB because I have 9 dudes in the box, that is what you are supposed to do.
I'm not a crazy "score means you ran it up" guy... If my varsity dudes are not good enough to stop your 3rd string RB, let him score a TD or 2... it may be the only ones he scores all season. Our job to try and get better. If you are still running with your "DUDES" I'll probably get pissed, but for the love of God... you took you rbest player out of the game and your scrubs are scoring on my dudes... that isn't running it up. I'm not gonna tell a 15 year old kid to not score because he doesn't want to run it up... you are the 3rd string RB... SCORE DUDE!!!
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Post by Defcord on Sept 25, 2017 18:03:09 GMT -6
We have asked and had officials call us for holding if we broke long runs with the 3rd string. Also, we have told the quarterback to hit the fullback in the knees on the handoff so we fumble. We cant change our schedule and a team on our schedule was amazingly horrible. If we were to not do those things we would of scored 100+ points. No need to be on Good Morning America! We scored 25 in the top of the first inning against a team one year in baseball. In between inning the plate umpire came over and said "Coach if it doesn't hit them it's a strike." I said fair enough. I think you bring up a valid point in that officials definitely can help out. I guess down side is that 3rd stringer loses stats and the coach that is actually running it up probably still freaks out on the officials for the fantom calls.
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Post by olcoach53 on Sept 26, 2017 6:36:49 GMT -6
Happened last night AGAINST us. In our JV game, the opposing team was throwing fade balls on us while they were up 35 in the fourth quarter. I assured my JV coaches that we will just tuck it away in the memory banks for the next time we play them.
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Post by bigdog2003 on Sept 26, 2017 10:03:45 GMT -6
I was the OC for the middle school one year and we were beating a team pretty bad at halftime, up like 42-0 with 8 minute quarters and a running clock from the start, I started putting kids in positions they had never played before just to let them have a chance to do something they may never do again. Had our 2nd string center playing FB with whoever we had on the OL, he breaks a long TD run. We run nothing but FB dives the entire second half with linemen playing FB, and end up winning 54-0.
After the game the other coach gets in my face calling me all kinds of names for running the score up, fans from that school call our AD to complain (he was there coaching the JV and knew we weren't running up the score), and fans from our school were yelling at me for calling the same play over and over in the second half. The varsity HC came up and told me I did nothing wrong and laughed that in a 54-0 win, I still found a way to make our fans upset at my playcalling.
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Post by rosey65 on Sept 28, 2017 11:36:20 GMT -6
On the flip side of this, I get aggravated with teams that leave their starters in the game after we've pulled ours and start scoring garbage TD's on our worst eleven and then kicking onside kicks when the game is far out of reach. I don't mind that as much, they are free to try to come back to the best of their abilities and MOV shouldnt be an issue. I don't like it when they line up everyone in the box and don't respect our receivers and then get upset when we complete a pass to keep them honest. I am not going to run my backup RB behind a backup OL into a meat grinder- that is a player safety concern. This is my concern, too. We platoon as much as possible, so our "backups" are really 3rd or 4th string guys. During garbage time, it is really hard to sub in our OL for fear of getting one of the backs hurt. They usually dont get more than 1 drive, especially since our backup (see: 3rd string) defense cant ever get off the field. As has been said, it is a good problem to have!!
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Post by mdunham on Sept 30, 2017 18:40:05 GMT -6
Your only responsibility after the game is decided is to substitute. You keep running your offense so that your backups get valuable game experience. I would not blitz the heck out of an inferior team that couldn't handle it, though. Just play your "base" and let your backups get game experience doing that. I get pi$$ed off when a coach puts his backups in on offense and the other coach leaves his starters in on defense and just starts teeing off...11-man run blitz every play. And then they start whooping and hollering when they are crushing these poor kids in the backfield. $hit like that is just BEGGING for a naked boot or halfback pass. Had a game this year where it happened to us. Went up 30pts early in 4th so after we stopped them we put in JV O. They leave their 1's in and blitz 9-10 guys. We can barely get the snap off as it is, we fumble one and they house it from 30. Come out on O after KO and still they blitz the house. We ended up QB sneaking a couple of times just to run the clock. They go on O and continue no huddle (although they weren't very urgent with it all game anyways) but they're chucking the ball around with their 1's on JV D and understandably they score. Point being for me, was it necessary to keep your 1's in against our JV who can barely get a snap off or keep chucking passes on DB's that are like 5'3?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2017 17:49:07 GMT -6
Where do you guys draw the line of "running up the score" and "playing to win?
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Post by coachwoodall on Oct 1, 2017 17:50:23 GMT -6
guys, there's a story about shoes and walking.... something about a distance, maybe a mile or 2
I try to never assume something about a program or what they're trying to do b/c I'm not in the locker room everyday
then again some guys are just feminine hygiene products
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Post by coachwoodall on Oct 1, 2017 17:51:44 GMT -6
Where do you guys draw the line of "running up the score" and "playing to win? most will say, do what you need to insure you win; then sub as needed.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2017 17:53:27 GMT -6
Yeah I gotcha its kind of a feel thing you know it when you see it type of thing
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