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Post by WolvesHC on Jul 17, 2017 6:25:12 GMT -6
Does anyone display a weekly depth chart for the kids to see? I have always posted team goals, statistics, press clippings and things like that. We always discuss two deep but I have never posted before.
The reason I ask is for your younger players that would be listed as 3, 4 or 5 on the depth chart. I don't know if that would discourage them or not. We always had depth chart posted in college that could have up to 7 deep. I know that is college but just wasn't sure what all of you do. We are a small rural school typically have 35-40 9-12.
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Post by blb on Jul 17, 2017 6:36:31 GMT -6
I posted a depth chart (including Special Teams) every week beginning first day, sometimes more often if we had changes.
Kids were told that where they were on first day would be based at least in part on what they had done that summer and how they scored on our Physical Fitness Test. Once practice started it could change even daily, especially after we put pads on.
Perhaps biggest value was organizational - kids knew when we called out "First defense!" or "Punt team!" who should come a'running and we didn't waste time counting heads, figure out who was missing.
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Post by aceback76 on Jul 17, 2017 6:49:08 GMT -6
Does anyone display a weekly depth chart for the kids to see? I have always posted team goals, statistics, press clippings and things like that. We always discuss two deep but I have never posted before. The reason I ask is for your younger players that would be listed as 3, 4 or 5 on the depth chart. I don't know if that would discourage them or not. We always had depth chart posted in college that could have up to 7 deep. I know that is college but just wasn't sure what all of you do. We are a small rural school typically have 35-40 9-12. We do not DISPLAY the depth chart, but the Coaches have a copy. Everybody gets "coached", of course, and MOST of our reps go to (using QB, WR, & TE in a typical "Pro-Set" as an example): 3 QB's 2 Split Ends 2 Tight Ends 2 Flankers 2 deep at other positions as well. This is as close as we come to a "Depth Chart".
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Post by coachscdub on Jul 17, 2017 21:05:24 GMT -6
We had a depth chart posted when i played and i remember it becoming a "distraction" at least for myself. However last year we told the kids that we as coaches had a depth chart that we altered weekly and they could ask about their spot whenever, and i was amazed at how many kids wanted to see a physical copy of it. I think we might post one but it depends on some things.
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Post by coachscdub on Jul 17, 2017 21:07:20 GMT -6
We had a depth chart posted when i played and i remember it becoming a "distraction" at least for myself. However last year we told the kids that we as coaches had a depth chart that we altered weekly and they could ask about their spot whenever, and i was amazed at how many kids wanted to see a physical copy of it. I think we might post one but it depends on some things.
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Post by s73 on Jul 17, 2017 21:31:50 GMT -6
We do not post a written depth chart.
With that said, our depth chart is demonstrated daily in practice. In the summer, we NEVER call a 1st group. We always say "give me an offense out here" meaning it's up to them to be responsible for their reps. You'd be surprised how fast the team develops it's own pecking order.
Then on the 1st day of the season we call out who we feel has proven themselves to be the 1's so far. Usually the kids have it 90% correct already.
Then we kind of tell the rest of the team they are battling for that spot. Small school so not many more than 2 deep per spot.
We also tell them that it can change but its' up to them to change it. GIVE US A REASON to play you.
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Post by coachd5085 on Jul 17, 2017 21:36:21 GMT -6
I posted a depth chart (including Special Teams) every week beginning first day, sometimes more often if we had changes. Kids were told that where they were on first day would be based at least in part on what they had done that summer and how they scored on our Physical Fitness Test. Once practice started it could change even daily, especially after we put pads on. Perhaps biggest value was organizational - kids knew when we called out "First defense!" or "Punt team!" who should come a'running and we didn't waste time counting heads, figure out who was missing. Coach, did you ever run into some issues with someone who was clearly one of your best 11 not putting in the time in the weight room, or not doing particularly well on the Fitness test and being on the 2nd/3rd string? I could see some issues arising with the concept if everyone knows he is going to be a starter regardless of where he starts day one. A prime example is Earl Cambell was notorious for not being able to finish the mile run.
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Post by blb on Jul 18, 2017 4:56:41 GMT -6
I posted a depth chart (including Special Teams) every week beginning first day, sometimes more often if we had changes. Kids were told that where they were on first day would be based at least in part on what they had done that summer and how they scored on our Physical Fitness Test. Once practice started it could change even daily, especially after we put pads on. Perhaps biggest value was organizational - kids knew when we called out "First defense!" or "Punt team!" who should come a'running and we didn't waste time counting heads, figure out who was missing. Coach, did you ever run into some issues with someone who was clearly one of your best 11 not putting in the time in the weight room, or not doing particularly well on the Fitness test and being on the 2nd/3rd string? I could see some issues arising with the concept if everyone knows he is going to be a starter regardless of where he starts day one. A prime example is Earl Cambell was notorious for not being able to finish the mile run.
A few times we had kids who felt overly entitled, that they didn't have to do the work or compete for starting position. So they started off down the depth chart.
After that, best players played based on performance.
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Post by rudyrude9 on Jul 18, 2017 8:18:18 GMT -6
Post the 2 deep every week. Guys need to know where they are at.
I wouldn't post 7 deep though.
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Post by Coach Vint on Jul 18, 2017 9:09:08 GMT -6
We post our depth chart every single week. We also coach them on it as a living document. It can change at a moment's notice. Just because you are first doesn't mean you will stay there. Just because you are third doesn't mean you shouldn't fight to be number 1. We remind the #2's they are one play from being a starter, so prepare accordingly. Don't wait until you are a starter to work like one. And if you are a starter, compete like you are hungry. If you don't like where you are, talk to your position coach and he will tell you what you need to do to improve. If you are good enough to play, you will play.
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Post by coachd5085 on Jul 18, 2017 10:07:38 GMT -6
Coach, did you ever run into some issues with someone who was clearly one of your best 11 not putting in the time in the weight room, or not doing particularly well on the Fitness test and being on the 2nd/3rd string? I could see some issues arising with the concept if everyone knows he is going to be a starter regardless of where he starts day one. A prime example is Earl Cambell was notorious for not being able to finish the mile run.
A few times we had kids who felt overly entitled, that they didn't have to do the work or compete for starting position. So they started off down the depth chart.
After that, best players played based on performance.
So did the kids that felt overly entitled stay down on the depth chart? I am not trying to argue for or against, but I am genuinely curious if you ever had some of your best players start day one of camp low on the depth chart (wink, wink) but everyone in the program (teammates, assistant coaches, yourself) knew they would be starting. If so, how long did it take for them to move up?
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Post by blb on Jul 18, 2017 10:16:21 GMT -6
So did the kids that felt overly entitled stay down on the depth chart? I am not trying to argue for or against, but I am genuinely curious if you ever had some of your best players start day one of camp low on the depth chart (wink, wink) but everyone in the program (teammates, assistant coaches, yourself) knew they would be starting. If so, how long did it take for them to move up?
I can remember one kid a few years ago who never earned a starting position after blowing off the summer when he thought he was going to be guaranteed a spot because he was a Senior. BOE president's kid too.
We weren't being disingenuous or dishonest. Kids knew and expected best players to play. They wanted to win too.
But if someone didn't "pay the price" in the summer there would be consequences too.
As far as how long, we did not revise original depth chart (unless we had some kids quit, injured, or position changes) until after Intra-Squad Scrimmage Saturday morning of first week, when we had been in pads enough to evaluate who could run and hit some.
And again after outside scrimmage the following week as we began prep for first game.
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Post by wingtol on Jul 18, 2017 17:10:19 GMT -6
Does anyone display a weekly depth chart for the kids to see? I have always posted team goals, statistics, press clippings and things like that. We always discuss two deep but I have never posted before. The reason I ask is for your younger players that would be listed as 3, 4 or 5 on the depth chart. I don't know if that would discourage them or not. We always had depth chart posted in college that could have up to 7 deep. I know that is college but just wasn't sure what all of you do. We are a small rural school typically have 35-40 9-12. Being at a school similar in size I have to ask if a depth chart is really necessary? We have on average maybe 14 guys who actually should be on the field at any given time. We have second teamers and then we have the guys who are the real back ups. Maybe at a place with 70-80 plus a depth chart might be good but at small schools the pecking order is pretty clear to everyone.
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Post by WolvesHC on Jul 18, 2017 17:41:10 GMT -6
Does anyone display a weekly depth chart for the kids to see? I have always posted team goals, statistics, press clippings and things like that. We always discuss two deep but I have never posted before. The reason I ask is for your younger players that would be listed as 3, 4 or 5 on the depth chart. I don't know if that would discourage them or not. We always had depth chart posted in college that could have up to 7 deep. I know that is college but just wasn't sure what all of you do. We are a small rural school typically have 35-40 9-12. Being at a school similar in size I have to ask if a depth chart is really necessary? We have on average maybe 14 guys who actually should be on the field at any given time. We have second teamers and then we have the guys who are the real back ups. Maybe at a place with 70-80 plus a depth chart might be good but at small schools the pecking order is pretty clear to everyone. I'm starting to think same way and maybe just post special teams once regular season starts. We too project to have 14 playing the 22 o/d positions with possibly two others we could plug in if we had too. If I posted a two deep it wouldn't be accurate as my backup safety is a starting corner not Jimmy in 9th grade who shows up on 2 deep. The same goes for multiple positions.
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Post by coachd5085 on Jul 18, 2017 20:32:59 GMT -6
Being at a school similar in size I have to ask if a depth chart is really necessary? We have on average maybe 14 guys who actually should be on the field at any given time. We have second teamers and then we have the guys who are the real back ups. Maybe at a place with 70-80 plus a depth chart might be good but at small schools the pecking order is pretty clear to everyone. I'm starting to think same way and maybe just post special teams once regular season starts. We too project to have 14 playing the 22 o/d positions with possibly two others we could plug in if we had too. If I posted a two deep it wouldn't be accurate as my backup safety is a starting corner not Jimmy in 9th grade who shows up on 2 deep. The same goes for multiple positions. For organizational purposes (not really for the kids) you could always make a 2 deep to reflect those multiple back up roles.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2017 5:38:01 GMT -6
We post starters pre-game (2 deep for STs) but we don't publish depth charts. Positional coaches have their own depth charts and will manage reps in game depending on the situation.
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Post by coachjm on Jul 19, 2017 6:12:10 GMT -6
Being at a school similar in size I have to ask if a depth chart is really necessary? We have on average maybe 14 guys who actually should be on the field at any given time. We have second teamers and then we have the guys who are the real back ups. Maybe at a place with 70-80 plus a depth chart might be good but at small schools the pecking order is pretty clear to everyone. I'm starting to think same way and maybe just post special teams once regular season starts. We too project to have 14 playing the 22 o/d positions with possibly two others we could plug in if we had too. If I posted a two deep it wouldn't be accurate as my backup safety is a starting corner not Jimmy in 9th grade who shows up on 2 deep. The same goes for multiple positions. We also are at a small school and we don't even define who the starters are. Tell all the kids to get reps early in the season, let them figure it out, about a week in I have conversations with some kids that they are only going to take reps on one side of the ball as they aren't going to be in the mix on the other side and I feel it helps our team for them to focus on the one position. Ultimately, we feel it has been a good thing as it creates some competition despite us having a smaller roster. With that stated we always have a depth chart for special teams in order to ensure us being efficient moving kids in an out on that unit, however, not all of our kids are in our special teams groups so typically we only have 15 or so kids that involves.
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Post by wingtol on Jul 19, 2017 7:17:33 GMT -6
I'm starting to think same way and maybe just post special teams once regular season starts. We too project to have 14 playing the 22 o/d positions with possibly two others we could plug in if we had too. If I posted a two deep it wouldn't be accurate as my backup safety is a starting corner not Jimmy in 9th grade who shows up on 2 deep. The same goes for multiple positions. For organizational purposes (not really for the kids) you could always make a 2 deep to reflect those multiple back up roles. If I had to write that out it would be longer than War and Peace! Lol If our center got hurt it was like alright tell Matt to goto center now tell Logan to go from Te to Lt put Jake at Te and make sure Logan put the extra lineman jersey on. Now if someone gets dinged up after that look out!!! Lol Great quote about small school ball "you lose one guy to injury you lose five cause everyone is moving around"
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Post by 50slantstrong on Jul 19, 2017 10:22:14 GMT -6
We don't post it for the kids to see. We keep a live excel sheet that all the coaches can edit.
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Post by The Lunch Pail on Jul 19, 2017 20:41:30 GMT -6
We post depth charts. We have 1v1, up-front and honest meetings with all of the players to tell them where they are on the depth chart and what they can do to improve
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coachZL
Sophomore Member
Posts: 150
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Post by coachZL on Jul 27, 2017 15:41:54 GMT -6
We post a full depth chart for offense and defense every kid is on at least one of those pages. We also post 2 deep on all special teams and our scout offense and defense. Sometimes the depth charts stay the same all week, sometimes they change once or twice a week. On Thursdays after practice we go through all of the depth charts which is 95% set at that time. Have to save some wiggle room in case a kid decides to do something dumb that gets them in trouble.
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Post by Chris Clement on Jul 29, 2017 11:56:15 GMT -6
I tried writing an algorithm to figure out the problem of dealing with shuffling guys due to injury, among other things. It's a nasty permutations problem.
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Post by carookie on Jul 29, 2017 12:16:10 GMT -6
I tried writing an algorithm to figure out the problem of dealing with shuffling guys due to injury, among other things. It's a nasty permutations problem. I coached for a guy who always wanted his best cover guy at the nickelback when he went sub or 3-2 (to allow him to matchup on the opponent's best receiver). Problem was we were a small school of only about 37 on the varsity, of which only 22-24 were legit varsity players. We had our starting Nickel go down once, and then another injury mixed in, and before you know it we had all kinds of guys playing out of position. Our depth chart went minimum 4 deep at every spot, problem was some guys were listed at multiple spots (small school); so while we were able to get 11 on the field and each with the correctly designated position it wasn't what the DC thought it would be.
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