rooster
Sophomore Member
Posts: 246
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Post by rooster on Apr 18, 2017 7:56:20 GMT -6
Coaches,
I've recently just taking a HC position and WANT to practice the JV and varsity together. To me, the pro's far outweigh the con's: The JV player is getting coached by that coach for 3 years, which to me equals better player development over the long haul. I intend to have 4 coaches on both sides of the ball who specialize in coaching their position group for the entire practice.
Now comes the dilemma: We don't have the depth to platoon - I hope that comes within a couple years, but our numbers are down and kids will have to go both ways. Does anyone have any suggestions or practice plan examples on how to make this the most efficient practice for both sides of the ball. Thanks!
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Post by coachd5085 on Apr 18, 2017 8:05:16 GMT -6
Just off the top of my head:
1) organize program with a "lead" positional coach, and an asst. So your DC might be the "lead" LB coach, and his asst might be the RB coach. Your WR guy, would be the LEAD WR coach, and his asst would be the DB coach. Then when you practiced defense, the DB guy is in the lead, and the WR is the asst.
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Post by carookie on Apr 18, 2017 10:00:53 GMT -6
If you don't have the depth to platoon, then you don't platoon.
I was at a small private school that had about 35 kids in the whole program- like you wanted we had 8 coaches so everyone just coached one side of the ball. But, as I stated, we didnt have the numbers to platoon- why would I have my FBS stud CB not play WR too when the next best option would be a 130 lb sophomore who is new to the sport.
In the end, your growth and learning for either given side of the ball will be limited by the fact that you cannot platoon. But that should not stand in the way of running an efficient practice (utilizing the same efficiency principles you always use).
Now, efficiency would dictate to have an offensive day and a defensive day (to spend less time in transition). However, this can be detrimental on two counts- 1) if a player misses one day of practice, for any given reason, he misses an entire side of the ball. 2) chunking principle would dictate that this could lead to stagnation in learning and possibly have some players zoning out. If efficiency is imperative then having an offensive day and defensive day would be the way to go, but be wary if you are the type to install a lot week to week.
As stated above, the lead coach idea could be helpful; this would also work by having position coaches work directly with their position on the scout team. Of course, this depends on how similar a look the scout team is giving you to what you do and how similar your keys, reads, and reactions are to what your opponent can do. As is, there should really be no waste for time taken to set up drills (as there should always be a few coaches handy).
Really, efficiency in practice is not the burden you will be having to overcome; the burden is not having the numbers to two platoon in general.
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Post by blb on Apr 18, 2017 10:08:29 GMT -6
What do you do with Freshmen (9th graders)?
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rooster
Sophomore Member
Posts: 246
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Post by rooster on Apr 18, 2017 10:53:43 GMT -6
What do you do with Freshmen (9th graders)? The plan is to have them practice separate, unless it would be best to practice the entire high school together?
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Post by coachddwebb on Apr 18, 2017 11:10:06 GMT -6
Do you film parts of practice? If so how are you going to handle film review?
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Post by **** on Apr 18, 2017 12:21:01 GMT -6
When Varsity practices offense, JV practice defense.
Individual, Group, Team, etc.
Then flip.
I wish we could do that but we don't have enough coaches.
Basically in a 2.5 hour practice you have special teams for .5 hour, everybody does offense for 1 hour, and defense for 1 hour. They are just done at different times.
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Post by blb on Apr 18, 2017 15:05:48 GMT -6
What do you do with Freshmen (9th graders)? The plan is to have them practice separate, unless it would be best to practice the entire high school together?
I would never practice Freshmen with kids who are several years older, more mature, been in weight room more (hopefully),
In my experience the vast majority of Sophomores aren't physically-emotionally ready to do so either.
And a lot of them don't want to.
They'd rather play Freshman, then JV with their "buds" until they're Junior year.
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Post by carookie on Apr 18, 2017 15:27:50 GMT -6
When Varsity practices offense, JV practice defense. Individual, Group, Team, etc. Then flip. I wish we could do that but we don't have enough coaches. Basically in a 2.5 hour practice you have special teams for .5 hour, everybody does offense for 1 hour, and defense for 1 hour. They are just done at different times. If you have the numbers this would be good
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Post by Party@QB on Apr 18, 2017 16:04:00 GMT -6
The plan is to have them practice separate, unless it would be best to practice the entire high school together?
I would never practice Freshmen with kids who are several years older, more mature, been in weight room more (hopefully),
In my experience the vast majority of Sophomores aren't physically-emotionally ready to do so either.
And a lot of them don't want to.
They'd rather play Freshman, then JV with their "buds" until they're Junior year.
You don't have to throw freshmen into the fire vs varsity players. By practicing them all together the 9th graders would get the same coaching for 4 years. Assuming the coaches remain. You could still do most drills and non-low contact with entire team. Also might help 9th graders to mature faster. Watching older guys and being around older guys. By the time they are 11th and 12th graders they know the system as good as a coach, ok maybe a little exaggeration there.
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Post by Party@QB on Apr 18, 2017 16:05:08 GMT -6
When Varsity practices offense, JV practice defense. Individual, Group, Team, etc. Then flip. I wish we could do that but we don't have enough coaches. Basically in a 2.5 hour practice you have special teams for .5 hour, everybody does offense for 1 hour, and defense for 1 hour. They are just done at different times. I forgot to say that Anders stole my original response. I would go this route.
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Post by aceback76 on Apr 18, 2017 17:39:11 GMT -6
Coaches, I've recently just taking a HC position and WANT to practice the JV and varsity together. To me, the pro's far outweigh the con's: The JV player is getting coached by that coach for 3 years, which to me equals better player development over the long haul. I intend to have 4 coaches on both sides of the ball who specialize in coaching their position group for the entire practice. Now comes the dilemma: We don't have the depth to platoon - I hope that comes within a couple years, but our numbers are down and kids will have to go both ways. Does anyone have any suggestions or practice plan examples on how to make this the most efficient practice for both sides of the ball. Thanks! Individual & Small Group = yes!!! Large Group & Team = no!!!
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eagleoc
Sophomore Member
Posts: 208
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Post by eagleoc on Apr 19, 2017 6:02:59 GMT -6
Coaches, I've recently just taking a HC position and WANT to practice the JV and varsity together. To me, the pro's far outweigh the con's: The JV player is getting coached by that coach for 3 years, which to me equals better player development over the long haul. I intend to have 4 coaches on both sides of the ball who specialize in coaching their position group for the entire practice. Now comes the dilemma: We don't have the depth to platoon - I hope that comes within a couple years, but our numbers are down and kids will have to go both ways. Does anyone have any suggestions or practice plan examples on how to make this the most efficient practice for both sides of the ball. Thanks! We do pretty much the exact thing. We have an offensive and defensive staff who only coach on one side of the ball. Our team is split up into JV and varsity. JV for us is freshman and sophomores who do not play varsity o or d. When we are doing install and early year stuff (spring ball where we don't hit and June) we have everyone together. This allows us to evaluate the players. Our OL coach will help out with DL during defensive practice and vice versa. The assistants from the other side of the ball may not be "experts", but can definitely help with fundamentals, especially for the young guys. Starting in July and throughout the season we have jv and varsity split up during practice. For example Monday was whole team scouting report, game plan install, formation recognition, fixing problems, etc , Tuesday was Varsity D and JV O, Wednesday was flipped and Thursday was pre game walk through. We would start practice with special teams, using our jv as scout team, while the people not involved in special teams would do position specific agilities. We would then break up and JV and Varsity would practice separate. If we needed some of the JV guys for varsity scout team because of numbers, we would keep the some of the JV guys and send the other guys home. This allows us to really work on individual technique with the young guys.
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Post by Coach Bennett on Apr 19, 2017 6:18:25 GMT -6
We are going to do at least indy periods together during the start of our season in August.
Since we don't do much contact during team specials, we may have our punt team line up against our JV punt return so that both groups are getting quality reps and so on. Would help in not having to constantly get scout squads together for specials. When our varsity extra point team is getting reps, our JV defense can get their alignments and assignments squared away.
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rooster
Sophomore Member
Posts: 246
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Post by rooster on Apr 19, 2017 6:35:42 GMT -6
Coaches, I've recently just taking a HC position and WANT to practice the JV and varsity together. To me, the pro's far outweigh the con's: The JV player is getting coached by that coach for 3 years, which to me equals better player development over the long haul. I intend to have 4 coaches on both sides of the ball who specialize in coaching their position group for the entire practice. Now comes the dilemma: We don't have the depth to platoon - I hope that comes within a couple years, but our numbers are down and kids will have to go both ways. Does anyone have any suggestions or practice plan examples on how to make this the most efficient practice for both sides of the ball. Thanks! We do pretty much the exact thing. We have an offensive and defensive staff who only coach on one side of the ball. Our team is split up into JV and varsity. JV for us is freshman and sophomores who do not play varsity o or d. When we are doing install and early year stuff (spring ball where we don't hit and June) we have everyone together. This allows us to evaluate the players. Our OL coach will help out with DL during defensive practice and vice versa. The assistants from the other side of the ball may not be "experts", but can definitely help with fundamentals, especially for the young guys. Starting in July and throughout the season we have jv and varsity split up during practice. For example Monday was whole team scouting report, game plan install, formation recognition, fixing problems, etc , Tuesday was Varsity D and JV O, Wednesday was flipped and Thursday was pre game walk through. We would start practice with special teams, using our jv as scout team, while the people not involved in special teams would do position specific agilities. We would then break up and JV and Varsity would practice separate. If we needed some of the JV guys for varsity scout team because of numbers, we would keep the some of the JV guys and send the other guys home. This allows us to really work on individual technique with the young guys. Coach, In your example, the varsity D goes Monday and the varsity O on Tuesday. Do you not do any offense on Monday, or defense on Tuesday? Just looking for clarification. Thanks!
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rooster
Sophomore Member
Posts: 246
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Post by rooster on Apr 19, 2017 6:37:48 GMT -6
When Varsity practices offense, JV practice defense. Individual, Group, Team, etc. Then flip. I wish we could do that but we don't have enough coaches. Basically in a 2.5 hour practice you have special teams for .5 hour, everybody does offense for 1 hour, and defense for 1 hour. They are just done at different times. I forgot to say that Anders stole my original response. I would go this route. Coach, does your school practice this way? If so, would you mind sharing specifics? Thanks!
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Post by hammer66 on Apr 19, 2017 6:47:28 GMT -6
Our program is 9-12 JV-V. We have about 40 kids normally. We practice everyone together. Individual periods we will split the JV, V and do the same drills. If there is a standout JV we put him with the older kids to compete and get better. All coaches coach both sides of the ball. We do O and D every practice. When we do team periods and if they are LIVE we put the best 11 on Scout regardless of grade. It honestly has not been an issue. We have found that the 9th graders actually grow much faster this way. They are generally more prepared to actually contribute as Sophomores doing it this way. For a few years we had the option of leaving 9th graders down on the Middle School team and honestly the kids we left down to develop had great seasons at that level but did not transition well to the JV level and in most cases did not even come out as Sophomores. Just be smart and it will work out.
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eagleoc
Sophomore Member
Posts: 208
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Post by eagleoc on Apr 19, 2017 9:09:06 GMT -6
We do pretty much the exact thing. We have an offensive and defensive staff who only coach on one side of the ball. Our team is split up into JV and varsity. JV for us is freshman and sophomores who do not play varsity o or d. When we are doing install and early year stuff (spring ball where we don't hit and June) we have everyone together. This allows us to evaluate the players. Our OL coach will help out with DL during defensive practice and vice versa. The assistants from the other side of the ball may not be "experts", but can definitely help with fundamentals, especially for the young guys. Starting in July and throughout the season we have jv and varsity split up during practice. For example Monday was whole team scouting report, game plan install, formation recognition, fixing problems, etc , Tuesday was Varsity D and JV O, Wednesday was flipped and Thursday was pre game walk through. We would start practice with special teams, using our jv as scout team, while the people not involved in special teams would do position specific agilities. We would then break up and JV and Varsity would practice separate. If we needed some of the JV guys for varsity scout team because of numbers, we would keep the some of the JV guys and send the other guys home. This allows us to really work on individual technique with the young guys. Coach, In your example, the varsity D goes Monday and the varsity O on Tuesday. Do you not do any offense on Monday, or defense on Tuesday? Just looking for clarification. Thanks! I should have clarified a little better. Monday is kind of a catch all. Scouting Report, Lifting, Sometimes a JV game, Formation recognition and tweaks for defense, offense works on issues from last weeks game, kind of knocks the rust off. Very Mental day, Helmets only, maybe helmets and shoulder pads.. Tuesday- Special Teams, Varsity D, JV O Wednesday- Special Teams, JV D, Varsity O Thursday, Special Teams, Varsity focus Friday Game Day Saturday- Maybe a jv game, run, lift, film sunday off.
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Post by mholst40 on Apr 19, 2017 11:39:28 GMT -6
We've practiced our JV team and our Varsity team together the past two seasons. Our Varsity/JV staff coaches one side of the ball (except for myself as Varsity Head Coach and our JV Head Coach). We hybrid platoon at the Varsity level. Some of our kids play both ways, but the majority only play a position on one side of the ball. When we schedule practice, JV does offense when Varsity does defense and vice versa. This allows our position coaches to remain on one side of the ball. The down side to this is our JV team has a limited staff on game days. But, my emphasis is not on winning at the JV level, it's on developing those players and getting them ready for the Varsity level.
A normal weekly practice schedule for us would be: Monday: Review for both Varsity and JV (Offense and Defense) (ST: Varsity Punt/Punt Block, JV Punt/Punt Block) Tuesday: Varsity Defense/JV Offense (ST: Varsity KO/KOR, JV FG/FG Block) Wednesday: Varsity Offense/JV Defense (ST: Varsity FG/FG Block, JV KO/KOR) Thursday: Review for both Varsity and JV (Offense and Defense)
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Post by coachthomason on Apr 20, 2017 12:32:31 GMT -6
We're at a small school (about 220 total students in the HS) we get a little less than 40 out for both JV/Varsity combined, and we only have had three total coaches (JV/Varsity combined). We have always combined JV/Varsity players in practice. For drills we try to split in to two groups during position work, more experienced/older players and a less experienced/younger players groups. Same position coach, just the same drill being worked in two groups. In team sessions we have the best of the rest work the scout teams but we NEED the JV to help out the scout team in order to get a good look. We tell our guys, like mentioned above, that the JV guys need to work on their defensive play when the Varsity is working on their offensive play and vice versa. This has worked out well. Injuries have been minimal, but they can/do happen.
Our week looks kinda like this:
Monday: Film review, practice in "shells" work through offensive/defensive issues from the previous week. It's a short practice and the JV are usually gone playing a game.
Tuesday: Defensive day. Work defensive position, defensive group work (pass/run defense), team defense.Then we transition to a small team offensive period where the JV and Varsity will work by themselves against any extra players, trash cans or air if none of that is available. Also, when we transition from defense to offense we plug in a Special Teams session (punt/punt return). Then film for the varsity (JV can come but are not required to).
Wednesday: Offensive day. Work offensive position, offensive group work (pass/run), team offense. Then we transition to a small team defensive period to brush up and polish our game plan for the week. Also, when we transition from offense to defense we plug in a Special Teams session (Kick-Off/Kick Return). Then film for the varsity (JV can come but are not required to). Kind of the mirrored image of the previous day.
Thursday: Pre-game. Pregame walk through for all teams, film. No more than an hour on the field.
With only three coaches between the JV/Varsity this set up has worked well. This up-coming seasons I might get a coach or two more! So we'll have to wait and see if any changes can/will be made.
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Post by jgordon1 on Apr 22, 2017 23:37:56 GMT -6
Just off the top of my head: 1) organize program with a "lead" positional coach, and an asst. So your DC might be the "lead" LB coach, and his asst might be the RB coach. Your WR guy, would be the LEAD WR coach, and his asst would be the DB coach. Then when you practiced defense, the DB guy is in the lead, and the WR is the asst. this is exactly what we have been doing for years
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fugulookinat
Junior Member
"Eye see DEAD people!"
Posts: 437
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Post by fugulookinat on Apr 23, 2017 9:06:21 GMT -6
I forgot to say that Anders stole my original response. I would go this route. Coach, does your school practice this way? If so, would you mind sharing specifics? Thanks! This is exactly how we practice. Varsity works offense while JV works defense, then flip. Shoot me an email and I'll send you a weeklong practice schedule when I get back in the office Monday.
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Post by coachd5085 on Apr 23, 2017 9:20:19 GMT -6
Coach, does your school practice this way? If so, would you mind sharing specifics? Thanks! This is exactly how we practice. Varsity works offense while JV works defense, then flip. Shoot me an email and I'll send you a weeklong practice schedule when I get back in the office Monday. What do you do for scout looks? How deep is "varsity" compared to JV?
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fugulookinat
Junior Member
"Eye see DEAD people!"
Posts: 437
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Post by fugulookinat on Apr 23, 2017 21:41:07 GMT -6
When we go team, our varsity #1 offense will go against our JV #1 defense, which is running our opponents defense. At the same time on the opposite end of the field, our JV 2 offense will scout for our JV 2 defense. When our varsity #2 offense gets their reps, they go against the JV 2 defense, also running our opponents defense. At the same time on the opposite end of the field, our JV 1 offense will scout for our JV 1 defense. After team, we do special teams, then flip to varsity defense. Indy, group, then repeat the team format.
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Post by coachchambers on Apr 24, 2017 7:14:56 GMT -6
What do you do with Freshmen (9th graders)? Practice them all together up untill team sessions, then move them over to have their own team sessions so that they are still getting reps. That is a win win to me.
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Post by 3rdandlong on Apr 24, 2017 7:47:15 GMT -6
When Varsity practices offense, JV practice defense. Individual, Group, Team, etc. Then flip. I wish we could do that but we don't have enough coaches. Basically in a 2.5 hour practice you have special teams for .5 hour, everybody does offense for 1 hour, and defense for 1 hour. They are just done at different times. We practice this way. We do have 1 period toward the beginning of practice where the best goes against the best in team while the JVs have at it on the other end of the field. Pretty much, the JVs & varsity practice individual & group period separately and come together during ST's, inside run, 7 on 7 and team. Many of the JV players may be back ups in varsity game and/or special teams players. On Monday the varsity works offense while JV is defense. On Tuesday switch, on Wednesday, it's a half and half practice and on Thursday it is JV game/varsity walk through. The biggest issue is that in season, the JV team serves as Scout during team periods therefore it's important that their time together is used appropriately.
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smcauliffe54
Sophomore Member
Wisconsin 2018 Division 4 State Champions 14-0
Posts: 188
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Post by smcauliffe54 on Apr 25, 2017 10:34:19 GMT -6
We have JV Varsity practice together. make sure jv guys go against jv guys during any 1v1 drills. Have non starters play scout d/o during team practice. varsity guys go on scout for the jv guys for a few min everyday as well. Varsity guys become coaches and are now teaching the basic techniques and getting closer as a team. this year we have enough players to 2 platoon and keep freshman varsity apart but might not have enough coaches to do it.
Hardest thing about practice is the ability to find coaches that are available 5-6 days a week.
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Post by knightfan64 on Apr 25, 2017 11:32:14 GMT -6
The way we are going to try to set it up next year (I am hoping to have a staff of 10-12)
Defensive Staff and Offensive Staff.
First Part of Practice Is Indy....when Varsity is on O JV is D Second Section Special Teams: JV on Defensive Special Teams (Punt Return/Block, Kickoff) Offense on O ST (KOR, PUNT) Third: Inside Run/Pass Skel Varsity O JV: D Fourth: Team (Me as Head Coach and Defensive Coordinator go up to see our Varsity on O) our JV HC who is the JV DC would be expected to do the same when they have O Team Fifth: Opposite Team Varsity now has 15 Minute D Refresher vice versa for JV.
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