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Post by fshamrock on Mar 27, 2017 13:55:24 GMT -6
the thread asking how many hours guys put in got me thinking, and I didn't want to hijack that thread so here's a hypothetical...be interesting to see the responses. let's say that some outside entity forced you to cut back on the hours that you spend in-season on football related work. Let's say you got 15 extra hours a week with the team and coaching staff together (not counting game nights) so that's a little over two hours each to get in all the work you need to prepare for that week, including game planning, practice, film etc. etc.
What would you cut out?
my list off the top of my head:
1) keep it at 2-3 opponent films that get broken down, hudl has kinda screwed us on this one, I like having a ton of film to watch on an opponent.....but tagging 8 films is a bit much..that would go first
2) player meetings to watch film by position group
3) watching practice film (especially late in the season)
I'm sure I could come up with a few more, but those I think could save us a good 10 hours on a given week
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Post by Chris Clement on Mar 29, 2017 8:39:20 GMT -6
Ok lemme try.
7 hours go to practice 3 hours in positional meetings - 10 that's enough to go over the gameplan day 1, and then do practice review and review parts of the game plan on the other days 1 hour in full group meeting - 11
That leaves me 4 hours to plan. I need three games broken down. It takes about 45 minutes to prescout and 45 minutes to break down, so that won't work. I can cut out certain fields like hash and simplify my breakdown, get it down to about 1 hour each. That leaves me one hour to gameplan. If I don't change much week to week it's possible but tough. That's 15 but I need to be really organized. And who's importing practice film? And who's planning practice? Who's drawing cards?
So to fit the 15 hour timeframe I need to keep cards to a basic set. That'll take one hour to draw. Planning practice and scripting is maybe thirty minutes each day, so two hours a week. Now we're at 18. Dealing with film in the tech side is three hours a week, so 19. I need to steal back four hours.
I can maybe claw back one hour from positional meetings, and half an hour from the O/D meeting. If things are consistently organized I can save an hour dealing with film. If I keep a library of stock cards I can save another half hour.
So I'm now at 16 hours but I don't see where to cut without hurting myself.
Now, if I could delegate some stuff to quality staff...
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Post by gccwolverine on Mar 29, 2017 9:15:24 GMT -6
Ok lemme try. 7 hours go to practice 3 hours in positional meetings - 10 that's enough to go over the gameplan day 1, and then do practice review and review parts of the game plan on the other days 1 hour in full group meeting - 11 That leaves me 4 hours to plan. I need three games broken down. It takes about 45 minutes to prescout and 45 minutes to break down, so that won't work. I can cut out certain fields like hash and simplify my breakdown, get it down to about 1 hour each. That leaves me one hour to gameplan. If I don't change much week to week it's possible but tough. That's 15 but I need to be really organized. And who's importing practice film? And who's planning practice? Who's drawing cards? So to fit the 15 hour timeframe I need to keep cards to a basic set. That'll take one hour to draw. Planning practice and scripting is maybe thirty minutes each day, so two hours a week. Now we're at 18. Dealing with film in the tech side is three hours a week, so 19. I need to steal back four hours. I can maybe claw back one hour from positional meetings, and half an hour from the O/D meeting. If things are consistently organized I can save an hour dealing with film. If I keep a library of stock cards I can save another half hour. So I'm now at 16 hours but I don't see where to cut without hurting myself. Now, if I could delegate some stuff to quality staff... HASH is going to save you 45 minutes? {censored} its like 3 minutes to get hash done for a game.
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Post by carookie on Mar 29, 2017 9:46:02 GMT -6
I'll preface my answer by assuming my players can still lift in their wt training class without that counting against the coach who runs it. If weight training class counts against the 15 hours then you are really screwed.
So, in California we already have a similar rule that limits the amount of time you get to work with the kids to 18 hours a week. But that rule, unlike your example, does not limit the amount of time coaches can work without kids (meetings, film breakdown etc.) In any case, if I was only allowed 15 hours all told to work heres how I would do it:
PRACTICE AND WORKING WITH KIDS: 10 Hours Total (its what I do now anyways, no need to overload them) Monday- 1 Hour player meeting before practice 1.5 hour practice- half pads. (2.5 hours all told) Tuesday- 2.5 hour practice Wednesday 2.5 Hour Practice Thursday- 1 hour Walk thru pregame Saturday- 1.5 hours watch previous game film with kids
FILM & SCOUTING: 5 Hours Total Grade Out Previous Game- 1 Hour Film breakdown next week opponent- 1 hour. We do this now for 3 films (defensively), if you divide up the work and tell the coaches to tag there stuff first before they watch for tells it goes very smoothly. Watch Opponent Film again- 1.5 hours. Its already broken down, now I want to evaluate their talent Devise gameplan- 1.5 hours. We don't install new stuff all the time, so its just basically what we like and printing up the scouting report.
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Post by runitupthemiddle on Mar 29, 2017 9:48:21 GMT -6
the thread asking how many hours guys put in got me thinking, and I didn't want to hijack that thread so here's a hypothetical...be interesting to see the responses. let's say that some outside entity forced you to cut back on the hours that you spend in-season on football related work. Let's say you got 15 extra hours a week with the team and coaching staff together (not counting game nights) so that's a little over two hours each to get in all the work you need to prepare for that week, including game planning, practice, film etc. etc. What would you cut out? my list off the top of my head: 1) keep it at 2-3 opponent films that get broken down, hudl has kinda screwed us on this one, I like having a ton of film to watch on an opponent.....but tagging 8 films is a bit much..that would go first 2) player meetings to watch film by position group 3) watching practice film (especially late in the season) I'm sure I could come up with a few more, but those I think could save us a good 10 hours on a given week Need to delegate , delegate , delegate, If you don't have a big staff, might have to enroll in krossover or hudl breakdown for your own films And like one poster on the board said, start like a "hudl" class, then u basically have 10-15 GAs a year helping on film upload and tagging, U need to live tag your own to cut down on time as well.
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Post by natenator on Mar 29, 2017 9:50:40 GMT -6
Ok lemme try. 7 hours go to practice 3 hours in positional meetings - 10 that's enough to go over the gameplan day 1, and then do practice review and review parts of the game plan on the other days 1 hour in full group meeting - 11 That leaves me 4 hours to plan. I need three games broken down. It takes about 45 minutes to prescout and 45 minutes to break down, so that won't work. I can cut out certain fields like hash and simplify my breakdown, get it down to about 1 hour each. That leaves me one hour to gameplan. If I don't change much week to week it's possible but tough. That's 15 but I need to be really organized. And who's importing practice film? And who's planning practice? Who's drawing cards? So to fit the 15 hour timeframe I need to keep cards to a basic set. That'll take one hour to draw. Planning practice and scripting is maybe thirty minutes each day, so two hours a week. Now we're at 18. Dealing with film in the tech side is three hours a week, so 19. I need to steal back four hours. I can maybe claw back one hour from positional meetings, and half an hour from the O/D meeting. If things are consistently organized I can save an hour dealing with film. If I keep a library of stock cards I can save another half hour. So I'm now at 16 hours but I don't see where to cut without hurting myself. Now, if I could delegate some stuff to quality staff... HASH is going to save you 45 minutes? {censored} its like 3 minutes to get hash done for a game. Certain fields LIKE hash. Not just hash.
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Post by runitupthemiddle on Mar 29, 2017 9:52:41 GMT -6
And if you keep a yearly file on each opponent, you might have most your scout cards already done.
It would be real hard if weights was included in this time. Last school we did light lifting and running in Sat. And film, 8:00-10:30. And Monday and Wednesday mornings, one group at 6:30, Other group at 7, and this rotated each week to make sure the same kids weren't always having to be the early group.
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Post by Chris Clement on Mar 29, 2017 9:54:36 GMT -6
45 minutes over 3 games. So I only need to save 15 on each game. I could also cut out pass result, gain, penalty, series end, quarter.
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Post by natenator on Mar 29, 2017 10:17:52 GMT -6
45 minutes over 3 games. So I only need to save 15 on each game. I could also cut out pass result, gain, penalty, series end, quarter. Minus the pass result/penalty the other is already done for us. Unless you get Ottawa game video lmao
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Post by runitupthemiddle on Mar 29, 2017 10:20:54 GMT -6
Our conference has a rule, trade tapes need to already be odk when traded
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Post by Chris Clement on Mar 29, 2017 10:36:17 GMT -6
Poorly.
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Post by huddlehut on Mar 29, 2017 12:31:28 GMT -6
Do what you do best.
Run your stuff and stop out-coaching yourself.
More is not always better.
Stop watching so much film that you begin to second-guess everything. Again, more is not always better.
Ride the mule. You got something going, keep with it.
When you add something (a play, formation, practice segment) you must eliminate something.
Stop doing things because somebody else or some other staff does them.
One more time: Stop out-coaching yourself (and go home)!
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Post by mrjvi on Mar 29, 2017 15:15:41 GMT -6
My defensive coordinator puts in more time than me (head and OC) on HUDL. I agree with delegate if you can but I went from 3 varsity assistants (big school) to 1 (small school) so my non HUDL hours have gone up. Efficient practices and no long warmups get me at 1 1/2 hours to 2 per day. Play reps VERY fast. Use JV for scout O so I can run 2 against our D one right after another. (jv tends to be formation recognition and initial movement at least so still valuable) Good thread because I'm obsessed with efficiency.
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Post by carookie on Mar 29, 2017 15:18:56 GMT -6
My defensive coordinator puts in more time than me (head and OC) on HUDL. I agree with delegate if you can but I went from 3 varsity assistants (big school) to 1 (small school) so my non HUDL hours have gone up. Efficient practices and no long warmups get me at 1 1/2 hours to 2 per day. Play reps VERY fast. Use JV for scout O so I can run 2 against our D one right after another. (jv tends to be formation recognition and initial movement at least so still valuable) Good thread because I'm obsessed with efficiency. You have 1 varsity assistant?!?! So basically just two of you coaching the whole varsity team? Thats nuts
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Post by mrjvi on Mar 29, 2017 15:25:09 GMT -6
YUP. All the varsity sports have a varsity asst. My JV will suffer some since I'll have to utilize the JV coaches sometimes. This will be my 1st year at a school this small. It will be interesting.
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Post by carookie on Mar 29, 2017 16:21:39 GMT -6
YUP. All the varsity sports have a varsity asst. My JV will suffer some since I'll have to utilize the JV coaches sometimes. This will be my 1st year at a school this small. It will be interesting. WOW, I would strongly suggest having JV and V practice together and having all coaches work with both (ex. JV OL and V OL all work together with one OL coach).
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Post by Chris Clement on Mar 29, 2017 16:43:44 GMT -6
Do what you do best. Run your stuff and stop out-coaching yourself. More is not always better. Stop watching so much film that you begin to second-guess everything. Again, more is not always better. Ride the mule. You got something going, keep with it. When you add something (a play, formation, practice segment) you must eliminate something. Stop doing things because somebody else or some other staff does them. One more time: Stop out-coaching yourself (and go home)! That's a lot of platitudes. Obviously to do it in 15 hours you need to keep things simple but what does that actually mean? What are you doing in those 15 hours?
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Post by huddlehut on Mar 29, 2017 17:13:06 GMT -6
Platitudes... or philosophy?
Basically, if something doesn't have a direct correlation to your desired end result, don't do it. You want efficiency, cut out all of the BS that we all spend so much time doing. For example (and I stated this on another thread), look at how much energy people invest in academic study halls and grade checks and punishment for not turning in homework, etc... That is a lot of wasted time and energy (not to undermine the importance of academics, however).
More philosophy... Occam's Razor. Look it up. Coaches tend to make things more complex rather than less complex... Your pre-game warm-,up, for example, how long does it take? An hour, maybe? How long for you warm up for practice? 5-10 minutes? Why is there such a difference?
Coaches need to ask themselves "why" are they doing the things that they do. A lot of time and effort could be eliminated (in my opinion).
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Post by fantom on Mar 29, 2017 17:25:58 GMT -6
Platitudes... or philosophy? Basically, if something doesn't have a direct correlation to your desired end result, don't do it. You want efficiency, cut out all of the BS that we all spend so much time doing. For example (and I stated this on another thread), look at how much energy people invest in academic study halls and grade checks and punishment for not turning in homework, etc... That is a lot of wasted time and energy (not to undermine the importance of academics, however). I;m not sure how you can say that you don't want to undermine the importance of academics when you say that efforts to improve academics are a waste of time.
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Post by mrjvi on Mar 29, 2017 17:39:59 GMT -6
carookie. Same wave length. That's the plan.
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Post by huddlehut on Mar 29, 2017 17:56:49 GMT -6
Platitudes... or philosophy? Basically, if something doesn't have a direct correlation to your desired end result, don't do it. You want efficiency, cut out all of the BS that we all spend so much time doing. For example (and I stated this on another thread), look at how much energy people invest in academic study halls and grade checks and punishment for not turning in homework, etc... That is a lot of wasted time and energy (not to undermine the importance of academics, however). I;m not sure how you can say that you don't want to undermine the importance of academics when you say that efforts to improve academics are a waste of time. Have you read the thread about academics? Certainly, as a coach one should support academic efforts, but jeez. At what point does one expect the kids to put forth some effort - or should the coaching staff hold the players hands and do everything for them...? If a kid can't do his homework without a study hall, you have big problems! [br You want efficiency, don't spend hours of your team's time in a study hall cajoling kids to do what they ought to be doing themselves!
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Post by fantom on Mar 29, 2017 20:14:09 GMT -6
I;m not sure how you can say that you don't want to undermine the importance of academics when you say that efforts to improve academics are a waste of time. Have you read the thread about academics? Certainly, as a coach one should support academic efforts, but jeez. At what point does one expect the kids to put forth some effort - or should the coaching staff hold the players hands and do everything for them...? If a kid can't do his homework without a study hall, you have big problems! [br You want efficiency, don't spend hours of your team's time in a study hall cajoling kids to do what they ought to be doing themselves! How long have you been doing this?
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Post by huddlehut on Mar 29, 2017 20:48:46 GMT -6
35 years.
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Post by carookie on Mar 29, 2017 20:51:12 GMT -6
Platitudes... or philosophy? Basically, if something doesn't have a direct correlation to your desired end result, don't do it. You want efficiency, cut out all of the BS that we all spend so much time doing. For example (and I stated this on another thread), look at how much energy people invest in academic study halls and grade checks and punishment for not turning in homework, etc... That is a lot of wasted time and energy (not to undermine the importance of academics, however). More philosophy... Occam's Razor. Look it up. Coaches tend to make things more complex rather than less complex... Your pre-game warm-,up, for example, how long does it take? An hour, maybe? How long for you warm up for practice? 5-10 minutes? Why is there such a difference? Coaches need to ask themselves "why" are they doing the things that they do. A lot of time and effort could be eliminated (in my opinion). While I strongly agree with your overall premise of simplification, sometime the higher ups mandate certain things from us in regards to academic improvement (or at least demand that we contribute to academic improvement). Not writing that there is a direct correlation to study halls and kids grades improving. But I know many who have gone in for HC interviews who have been asked how they help improve academics.
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Post by huddlehut on Mar 29, 2017 20:59:59 GMT -6
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Post by fantom on Mar 29, 2017 21:05:17 GMT -6
So, I'm trying to figure out that why you'd say that monitoring academic pogress isn't important.
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Post by huddlehut on Mar 29, 2017 21:08:35 GMT -6
I have been asked that very thing in interviews myself. I told them what I said here. Kids will generally perform to the level of expectation. 26 years as a HC and never once had a study hall. My staff knows our faculty members and we know our kids. We stay on top of the grades as well as anyone. We do not lose kids to failing grades (ok...Maybe a freshman or two).
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Post by huddlehut on Mar 29, 2017 21:14:28 GMT -6
So, I'm trying to figure out that why you'd say that monitoring academic pogress isn't important. I never said that academics wasn't important! I said that there are a lot of staff's that waste time in the way that they handle academics. Read the thread. This thread that we are currently on is about EFFICIENCY. There are a lot of coaches on that thread who are making "academics" too time consuming and inefficient. It ain't that hard to get kids to do schoolwork. I would not have survived for almost three decades as an AD if my athletes were not having success in the classroom. Kids in Texas grow up knowing that they HAVE to pass their classes or become ineligible. Again, in my opinion, it comes down to expectations.
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Post by fantom on Mar 29, 2017 21:59:35 GMT -6
So, I'm trying to figure out that why you'd say that monitoring academic pogress isn't important. I never said that academics wasn't important! I said that there are a lot of staff's that waste time in the way that they handle academics. Read the thread. This thread that we are currently on is about EFFICIENCY. There are a lot of coaches on that thread who are making "academics" too time consuming and inefficient. It ain't that hard to get kids to do schoolwork. I would not have survived for almost three decades as an AD if my athletes were not having success in the classroom. Kids in Texas grow up knowing that they HAVE to pass their classes or become ineligible. Again, in my opinion, it comes down to expectations. Remind me how you get them to do the school work.
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Post by Chris Clement on Mar 29, 2017 23:38:27 GMT -6
But your philosophy is so abstract as to be meaningless. It's a really simple discussion. How would you use 15 hours of total prep in a week.
Yes. Obviously you need to be efficient. Truisms aren't philosophies. HOW will you be efficient? What things are important enough to make it into your 15 hours?
If the AD told you your budget was getting halved this season and wanted your plan on how to make it work I hope you'd give him something more substantial than "be efficient and focus on the important stuff."
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