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Post by StraightFlexin on Feb 8, 2017 7:44:39 GMT -6
Looking for any thoughts or idea. Im a HC in a program that has been a playoff team over the past 3 years even though we have not had the best athletes in the school. Our graduating seniors were a good number of try-hard kids which allowed us to be successful. The next group of kids )upcoming Srs & Jrs) are some of the most entitled kids I have ever met. We are really in trouble for next season if they continue on this track. We run after school lifting Mon-Thurs and morning sessions at least 3 days a week. We are really struggling with buy in from some of the "better athletes" in the group (Not saying much at all/very average). They think they are 5'8 D1 baseball players with no offers that daddy coaches.
Any advice in this situation. I am just about to the point of breaking some eggs and only playing the most dedicated.
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Post by petej83 on Feb 8, 2017 8:55:34 GMT -6
We have a core group of kids every year mainly because we have a lot of kids do different sports and sort of take the rest of the school year off from football until the summer. We've tried to play the kids with the best attendance but a lot of times those kids don't really cut it. If you have a core group, rely on those guys. Its kind of been the same since 2002 and we've won 4 in row and 7 in a row conference championships and 3 state appearances. As long as kids are well coached and enjoy playing you'll usually be fine.
We won state in 2013 and some of the returning players thought it would just happen again and thought we were working them too hard in the weight room.
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Post by bigmoot on Feb 8, 2017 8:58:19 GMT -6
you may need to make an example out of one of them.
also remember, kids need time to be kids.
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Post by fantom on Feb 8, 2017 9:09:46 GMT -6
Looking for any thoughts or idea. Im a HC in a program that has been a playoff team over the past 3 years even though we have not had the best athletes in the school. Our graduating seniors were a good number of try-hard kids which allowed us to be successful. The next group of kids )upcoming Srs & Jrs) are some of the most entitled kids I have ever met. We are really in trouble for next season if they continue on this track. We run after school lifting Mon-Thurs and morning sessions at least 3 days a week. We are really struggling with buy in from some of the "better athletes" in the group (Not saying much at all/very average). They think they are 5'8 D1 baseball players with no offers that daddy coaches. Any advice in this situation. I am just about to the point of breaking some eggs and only playing the most dedicated. Now that you've vented, you can probably get more specific answers if you give us more specific information. What are they doing that makes you call them entitled? What actions are they doing that makes you think that they're not buying in? The AM/PM lifting sessions, who do you expect to be there, who isn't there, and why aren't they there? |
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Post by StraightFlexin on Feb 8, 2017 9:19:53 GMT -6
Any advice in this situation. I am just about to the point of breaking some eggs and only playing the most dedicated. Now that you've vented, you can probably get more specific answers if you give us more specific information. What are they doing that makes you call them entitled? What actions are they doing that makes you think that they're not buying in? The AM/PM lifting sessions, who do you expect to be there, who isn't there, and why aren't they there? The entitled are players that feel like they should not have to workout, attend any bit of athletic sessions, attend out of season meetings. They are not buying in because they are not doing anything above. I know this is not an uncommon problem, I am curious about how other coaches handle similar situations. |
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Post by fantom on Feb 8, 2017 9:21:52 GMT -6
Now that you've vented, you can probably get more specific answers if you give us more specific information. What are they doing that makes you call them entitled? What actions are they doing that makes you think that they're not buying in? The AM/PM lifting sessions, who do you expect to be there, who isn't there, and why aren't they there? The entitled are players that feel like they should not have to workout, attend any bit of athletic sessions, attend out of season meetings. They are not buying in because they are not doing anything above. I know this is not an uncommon problem, I am curious about how other coaches handle similar situations. What do they say when you ask where they are? |
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Post by lions23 on Feb 8, 2017 12:00:44 GMT -6
1. They don't care what you know until they know how much you care. You have to build relationships and you have to go out of your way to do that. They do not have to play. In other words what are you doing intentionally to build relationships? They will follow the leader first. Then they will follow the vision.
2. Make everything earned. Equipment, helmet stickers, numbers, locker, gear, first in line to eat team dinner. Build a system of rewards. You are not punishing kids who don't show up. You are just rewarding kids who are doing the things that you expect. (Do not make it impossible for kids in other sports to earn these things.-You do not want to be the coach that makes athletes choose. That coach will eventually lose to the other coaches in the building. The coach that makes athletes choose will eventually be viewed as self interested and that is not good for building teams.) This also builds in small successes all of the time that you can celebrate and count "wins."
3. Figure out a way to reward the values and characteristics and values you are trying to establish in the weight room. T shirts for 1000 pound club. Take pictures and hang them or put out on twitter of kids making 1000 pound club.
4. Make part of the weight room fun. Build competition. Our last 25 minutes each day starts with a game. Losers have to do the last part of the workout (which they hate), but there is a way out of it if you win the competition. You can build the competition however you like. You can do things real physical or real cerebral. You find out who fights, who can think, who can outlast. You are also teaching them to compete. You are teaching them that things are earned.
5. I don't know if this is you but I find that when teachers/coaches feel this way they are generally exaggerating the amount of kids that are being a pain. They start saying "all" of the kids are acting up or entitled. It is usually just a couple. Often those couple cause us a lot of energy from disruptions in the classroom or to the best athlete not buying in. It feels bigger than it actually is. Take stock of who is there. Love the heck out of those kids. Work on them helping you get buy in from others. Urban Meyer calls it the 10-80-10 percent principle. You are always going to have 10 percent you dont have to worry about. They always do what you want and then there is the middle and then there is the bottom 10 percent who are going the wrong direction. Focus on the top 90 and pull them in. That doesn't mean you have to forget about the bottom 10. Have the top 10 help you recruit all the middle kids. Get them separated from the bottom 10. Eventually the bottom 10 takes care of themselves. They will get lonely and buy in. They will want the gear and buy in. They will want the relationships and buy in. If they don't they'll generally go away on their own.
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Post by StraightFlexin on Feb 8, 2017 12:18:54 GMT -6
1. They don't care what you know until they know how much you care. You have to build relationships and you have to go out of your way to do that. They do not have to play. In other words what are you doing intentionally to build relationships? They will follow the leader first. Then they will follow the vision. 2. Make everything earned. Equipment, helmet stickers, numbers, locker, gear, first in line to eat team dinner. Build a system of rewards. You are not punishing kids who don't show up. You are just rewarding kids who are doing the things that you expect. (Do not make it impossible for kids in other sports to earn these things.-You do not want to be the coach that makes athletes choose. That coach will eventually lose to the other coaches in the building. The coach that makes athletes choose will eventually be viewed as self interested and that is not good for building teams.) This also builds in small successes all of the time that you can celebrate and count "wins." 3. Figure out a way to reward the values and characteristics and values you are trying to establish in the weight room. T shirts for 1000 pound club. Take pictures and hang them or put out on twitter of kids making 1000 pound club. 4. Make part of the weight room fun. Build competition. Our last 25 minutes each day starts with a game. Losers have to do the last part of the workout (which they hate), but there is a way out of it if you win the competition. You can build the competition however you like. You can do things real physical or real cerebral. You find out who fights, who can think, who can outlast. You are also teaching them to compete. You are teaching them that things are earned. 5. I don't know if this is you but I find that when teachers/coaches feel this way they are generally exaggerating the amount of kids that are being a pain. They start saying "all" of the kids are acting up or entitled. It is usually just a couple. Often those couple cause us a lot of energy from disruptions in the classroom or to the best athlete not buying in. It feels bigger than it actually is. Take stock of who is there. Love the heck out of those kids. Work on them helping you get buy in from others. Urban Meyer calls it the 10-80-10 percent principle. You are always going to have 10 percent you dont have to worry about. They always do what you want and then there is the middle and then there is the bottom 10 percent who are going the wrong direction. Focus on the top 90 and pull them in. That doesn't mean you have to forget about the bottom 10. Have the top 10 help you recruit all the middle kids. Get them separated from the bottom 10. Eventually the bottom 10 takes care of themselves. They will get lonely and buy in. They will want the gear and buy in. They will want the relationships and buy in. If they don't they'll generally go away on their own. Lions23 I totally agree with you. We do a 1000 pound club with t-shirts and giant display board I had created. We also reward players with off-season gear for weight room attendance (not lift marks). Our program equipment is also selected off attendance. We have had two pretty bad athletes wear #1 the past 2 years because they showed up the most. We had a heavyweight belt made that kid and hold competitive drills. I provide daily lunch study support for any players that need assistance in classes. We just graduated 26 of the most hardest working seniors I have ever coaches. Our young kids (9th graders and incoming 9th graders) are going crazy, the work ethic is incredible. For some reason, this current upper level group is not on board (much smaller class in numbers). |
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Post by **** on Feb 8, 2017 13:11:51 GMT -6
Now that you've vented, you can probably get more specific answers if you give us more specific information. What are they doing that makes you call them entitled? What actions are they doing that makes you think that they're not buying in? The AM/PM lifting sessions, who do you expect to be there, who isn't there, and why aren't they there? The entitled are players that feel like they should not have to workout, attend any bit of athletic sessions, attend out of season meetings. They are not buying in because they are not doing anything above. I know this is not an uncommon problem, I am curious about how other coaches handle similar situations. Might be a stupid question but these kids aren't already playing a sport after school right? If you have numbers tell the lazy ones to phuk off. |
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Post by **** on Feb 8, 2017 13:16:26 GMT -6
4. Make part of the weight room fun. Build competition. Our last 25 minutes each day starts with a game. Losers have to do the last part of the workout (which they hate), but there is a way out of it if you win the competition. You can build the competition however you like. You can do things real physical or real cerebral. You find out who fights, who can think, who can outlast. You are also teaching them to compete. You are teaching them that things are earned. Should try the Jim Harbaugh method and let the winners get to do the extra conditioning. Still blows my mind. |
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Post by StraightFlexin on Feb 8, 2017 13:22:23 GMT -6
Might be a stupid question but these kids aren't already playing a sport after school right? If you have numbers tell the lazy ones to phuk off. No they are not playing any winter sports thats the frustrating part. I wish we had the numbers just to do that. We may end up making an example, playing a ton of Sophomores and call it a "rebuilding year". |
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Post by **** on Feb 8, 2017 13:38:17 GMT -6
Might be a stupid question but these kids aren't already playing a sport after school right? If you have numbers tell the lazy ones to phuk off. No they are not playing any winter sports thats the frustrating part. I wish we had the numbers just to do that. We may end up making an example, playing a ton of Sophomores and call it a "rebuilding year". If the younger kids are better, play them. Gotta be careful with "rebuilding years" you don't want to be building for the next coach. You still have to win some games. I told my all conference FS yesterday he's not going to be good enough to play FS next year as a senior because he has dropped out of weights class and his back up will surpass him by the time the season starts. Will he get back in weights? Idk. Will he end up playing corner instead? Probably. Kid knows he's going to have to earn a spot on the field though. |
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Post by carookie on Feb 8, 2017 13:42:46 GMT -6
Couple questions:
1) Can you mandate, or kinda mandate attendance? I was at a school once where you had to reach 'X' amount of offseason workouts to be a part of the team. Even if you can't mandate, maybe you can sort of mandate it- publicly track the attendance and openly reward those who are attending.
2) How much are you asking of the kids right now? I used to coach with a guy who was always upset by the alleged lack of buying in from the players, but the truth was they were very dedicated to success; he was just a helicopter coach who was constantly wasting their time. On average there would be 2+ mandatory lunch time meetings per week in the offseason- you know the kind that were announced over the intercom at the start of lunch. They would be scheduled for only 10 minutes but almost always go the whole period, mostly they were complaint sessions about lack of buy in or a chance to show videos. Weightroom was scheduled for 1 hour after school, but usually went 90+ minutes because we kept wanting to add things on. 24 hours a week in the summer were the norm.
Now I am not writing this is you, but it would be helpful to hear what exactly your plan is, to see what exactly they are not doing.
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Post by fantom on Feb 8, 2017 14:06:02 GMT -6
Might be a stupid question but these kids aren't already playing a sport after school right? If you have numbers tell the lazy ones to phuk off. No they are not playing any winter sports thats the frustrating part. I wish we had the numbers just to do that. We may end up making an example, playing a ton of Sophomores and call it a "rebuilding year". So what do they tell you when you ask where they've been? |
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Post by bigmoot on Feb 8, 2017 14:20:17 GMT -6
OP...you said you had a large senior class, 26? How much did the current upper class contribute? Have they ever had to be the "man" before? I recently had a class of talented by underacheiving seniors. They had been overshawdowed there entire career (in all sports). They didn't really know how to be the top dogs.
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