|
Post by spreadattack on May 2, 2007 9:25:14 GMT -6
In my mind, the reason that the "average" NFL coach is better than the "average" college coach who is better than the "average" HS coach has to do partly with rewarding the committed and talented, but the fact is that the environment makes you a better coach. Things are quicker, money rewards the effective coaches, you are surrounded and consistently face other talented coaches who make or force you to be better.
I'm pretty sure that if any of us on this board spent two years in a serious position with an NFL team we would be better coaches than we were on the day we left. (At least to the extent of what we were exposed to. The NFL is also specialized, so yes, if you were a head coach in HS coaching OL and LBs and you hypothetically just coached OL at the NFL there would be other skills that might atrophy, but you also could have more perspective.).
|
|
|
Post by coachcalande on May 2, 2007 9:55:29 GMT -6
Id love to see a list of former nfl coaches that did lousy at college or hs. id also love to see former hs guys that did well at the college level, former college guys that excelled on the pro level...
coaching is coaching. Just my thoughts on it, its about passion, dedication, commitment, preparation and communication...a guy can be great at all of those things on any level...the knowledge of the game comes from study, all of us at any level can study...I wonder if the average hs state champ coach studies any less hard than say a pro position coach?...
|
|
|
Post by brophy on May 2, 2007 10:03:24 GMT -6
typical scenario, who would be the 'better' coach? the olympic gymnast coach of the 1(0 year old tumbling instructor? ...I wonder if the average hs state champ coach studies any less hard than say a pro position coach?... plenty, I'd imagine....one is studying how he can teach his players how to become better in a general sense, another is trying to find ways to improve professionals (best of the best) as his livelihood and paycheck.
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on May 2, 2007 12:31:28 GMT -6
As the H.S. College, and Pro games are different...comparing "success" (I am assuming you mean by wins and losses) is pretty much irrelevant. It is also irrelevant since wins and losses are impossible to attribute to ANY coach other than a HC, (and that isn't very plausible anyway). .
We have been discussing (at least I thought we were) TEACHING the game, and I maintain that the NORM of the profession is that the best teachers of the game are college and professional coaches. Again, this is a generalization, but pointing out exceptionalities (I know this great H.S. coach, or I know this LOUSY college coach) does not dispute a generalization.
Being great teachers of the game, does not always translate to success at different levels. Is Bob Knight any less a teacher of the game than he was from '75-'88? However he is clearly not as successful.
Would John Wooden show the same W/L success in the NBA?
Did Nick Saban go from being a great teacher of the game, to a lousy one? Will he be a great one again should Bama get a crystal football within 2 years?
|
|
|
Post by coachcb on May 2, 2007 14:58:54 GMT -6
I never take anything the NFL analysts say very seriously. I have seen them take athletes and blow them out of proportion or knock them WAY down by just looking at their combine stats. The vast majority of them have fairly limited knowledge of the game in the first place.
They can trash college coaches all they want, they just sound like idiots everytime they do it. These are the same guys that got Ryan Leaf drafted over Peyton Manning.
|
|
|
Post by brophy on May 2, 2007 15:14:53 GMT -6
the longer I am a fan of the draft? the more convinced i am of the 'Jerry Maguire' element of hyping the athletes with PR stunts and rumors (just like REAL news).
an agent pumps up his buddy 'scoop' from the latest draft publication and they let the spin take a 6th round talent and turn him into a 2nd round pick during Feb - April.
|
|
|
Post by phantom on May 2, 2007 17:47:15 GMT -6
I wonder if the average hs state champ coach studies any less hard than say a pro position coach?... Yes, I do. I work hard at learning the game but not as hard as college and pro coaches. The reason is time. College and pro coaches have a lot more time to study cut-ups, etc.. I have five history classes to teach. It stands to reason that a guy who works football all day will learn more football than I can.
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on May 2, 2007 18:39:43 GMT -6
I never take anything the NFL analysts say very seriously. I have seen them take athletes and blow them out of proportion or knock them WAY down by just looking at their combine stats. The vast majority of them have fairly limited knowledge of the game in the first place. They can trash college coaches all they want, they just sound like idiots everytime they do it. These are the same guys that got Ryan Leaf drafted over Peyton Manning. CB--you are killing me. In another thread you dump on NFL analysts about not knowing anything...then you go ahead and rip into Brady Quinn based on your "expert" analysis of the player. Now you dump again on draft analysts about "not really knowing the game" and again put your foot in your mouth by stating that Leaf was drafted over Manning. (He wasn't, and I bet most of those analysts who know nothing know that)
|
|
|
Post by coachcb on May 2, 2007 18:43:31 GMT -6
Yeah, you're right, I was wrong about the leaf thing. And I would be really bothered by your other comments, if I gave a sh-t what you thought. Have a nice night.
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on May 2, 2007 18:57:50 GMT -6
You have a great night too. It is a wonderful night here in NON-HYPOCRIT world I don't have a problem with anything, and I was trying to keep it civil. And I am not "thinking" or making any opinion, I am just pointing out a cold hard fact. Lets call a spade a spade. You dumped on guys (who spend hours upon hours researching, watching tapes, watching workouts) for making opinions, but then you go AND MAKE AN OPINION based on ....how many hours of watching tapes, workouts, research, and NFL experience? This is irony at its finest I am not trying to start anything here...just pointing out the obvious. And here I thought us coaches had thicker skins.
|
|
|
Post by brophy on May 2, 2007 19:15:47 GMT -6
jimminy christmas, ladies....grow up from the 7th grade already I hear Jimmy is taking becky to the spring dance instead of Susie......
focus on the content of the posts instead of the personalities that post them - this isn't the place for Internet tough-guys.
google Walter Thomas Saints (6' 4" 375) FA pickup today....
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on May 2, 2007 19:36:59 GMT -6
Brophy...I have to take a little umbrage with your remarks there. I am simply calling a spade a spade. No ill will intended...nothing personal involved...just like in the coaches office. If a coach says "Hey guys, we don't work hard enough as a staff...I am going to go play golf"... you call it out. Nothing juvenille. Simply pointing it out.
As far as the original thread, I think the most poignant and clarifying point made was in reference to Jeff Tedford's position. That put it in perspective for me.
|
|