coach40
Probationary Member
Posts: 7
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Post by coach40 on May 24, 2007 10:36:32 GMT -6
Putting points on the board is the measure of a head coach in the community. if you lose 10-9 no one cares if you only gave up 10 points but they do care that you only scored 9. the pressure of the program and the reponsibility of the out come are directly coroalted to the success of the offense. you still need to score points. I am a first year HC and i tell you what, if we dont score points I want the blame to come down on me not my staff for calling a lousy game or making dumb calls. also even if your DC does not do a good job game planning he can still guess corect if he watched any film. this makes it easier to call a game.
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Post by coachd5085 on May 25, 2007 6:30:57 GMT -6
"calling a lousy game...making dumb calls.....easier to call a game...."
Those are the phrases that reflect exactly what I am talking about. The feeling that everything hinges on calling counter instead of power at exactly the right time because the "football gods" instinctively put that call in my brain, or because I am "in the zone" or have the other team "Dialed up"
That is what I mean when I say i believe coaches over estimate their influence on Friday nights, and under estimate their influence Sat-Thurs.
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Post by phantom on May 25, 2007 6:52:39 GMT -6
"calling a lousy game...making dumb calls.....easier to call a game...." Those are the phrases that reflect exactly what I am talking about. The feeling that everything hinges on calling counter instead of power at exactly the right time because the "football gods" instinctively put that call in my brain, or because I am "in the zone" or have the other team "Dialed up" That is what I mean when I say i believe coaches over estimate their influence on Friday nights, and under estimate their influence Sat-Thurs. I'll second that.
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Post by brophy on May 25, 2007 7:29:27 GMT -6
That is what I mean when I say i believe coaches over estimate their influence on Friday nights, and under estimate their influence Sat-Thurs. I would agree with that. Friday night is just your time in the spotlight to dance.......Sat - Thurs is the time you get to learn the new dance. If one guy is teaching the tango on Sat - Thurs, and you turn around on Friday and think you're going to Waltz......you've got another thing coming. Like I said, you don't work all week on offense on your 4 min offense because you know your defense is going to blow the doors off your opponent. You play to score points. Defense would like to pitch shut-outs and stay a step ahead of the offense, but 8 times out of 10, the offense WILL hold the chalk last on Friday night.......MEANING, (imo) defense wins championships, but Offense is how you win (gotta score points for someone to win....unless you're the Chicago Bears, of course).
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Post by coachcb on May 25, 2007 10:23:31 GMT -6
I know HCs that take over both the offense and the defense. The last HC I worked under was the OC, but had the DC running his defensive philosophies.
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Post by coachjim on May 29, 2007 3:08:01 GMT -6
I became HC because it was my dream to be. Who hasn't. Being a DC was fun but it can be frustrating when you know what you are doing and don't get to go with the plan on gameday that you practiced all week. You begin to crave being in control of your own destiny.
Of course, none of that means I will be a good HC/OC. You have to have done both, to be good at either.
When people jump out of a 50 story building during a fire on the news and you ask, "How can they get themselves to do that?" The answer is, because the choices are: Be killed by fire or die by your own destiny. Your mind makes the decision for you. You jump and control your own destiny rather than let destiny control you. It's almost a subconscious decision to do so.
Me, I'm gonna jump. The heat just gets too hot and the flames hurt.
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Post by pegleg on May 29, 2007 5:58:17 GMT -6
i have no problem with the hc being the oc. dodge at southlake was his oc, briles at stephenville/u of houston is his own oc.......................the list goes on. those guys are brilliant offensive guys and very successful.
the problem i have is a guy who spent his whole career on defense thinking he is qualified to call plays just because he sits in the big office. if all your training/experience is in one area, why would you switch gears just because you can?
that would be like being a heart surgeon for your whole career and then being named boss of the surgical ward and deciding your were going to switch to ortho. sure your a good doctor and know how to operate on knees, but you have very little practical knowlede and you expereince was early in your career as an intern (sub varsity).
am i the only one who thinks this makes no sense at all?
(well, apperently i am, because football coaches do it everyday. lol)
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Post by coachd5085 on May 29, 2007 8:14:18 GMT -6
peg leg..exactly my thoughts. Offensive guys who become HC's, well, should they choose to also be a play caller or coordinator (TWO HUGELY DIFFERENT THINGS in my opinion) that is fine. But guys who have been coaching defense, or a mixture seem to always gravitate to the O side of the ball.
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Post by wingman on May 29, 2007 10:38:09 GMT -6
I have done both for a long time. I definately don't think you can blink your way through playing defense. If you're playing good well-coached teams, they are throwing something new at you every game,so in addition to getting ready for what they have shown, you have to make adjustments on the sideline for what is new. I think the difference between a good game coach and an average one is how well they adjust. Plan A isn't working and what do you do for plan B. I think offense and defense are about equally difficult in that way. I took over the offense on becoming HC because you can dictate more on offense. We stemmed, stunted, attacked and did a bunch of stuff on defense, but certain offenses still made you reduce your package. On offense you can do about anything including running one of those offenses.
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Post by wingman on May 29, 2007 11:32:20 GMT -6
Another point is guys who have been DCs for a long time know what is difficult to defend.
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crl
Junior Member
Pick me , pick me... I want to be on the RNC location scout team.
Posts: 476
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Post by crl on Jun 1, 2007 12:55:34 GMT -6
Your Name is now on the Label...Trust, is this what I want? If he is a DC, then maybe you have a beef, but if he is also a OC then its his call. Personaly, I want this; show me what you have, if I agree then its yours. CRL
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Post by 3rdandlong on Jun 1, 2007 14:26:50 GMT -6
If (or i should say when) i become a HC, I'm gonna call the defense and bring in someone who runs an offense that I like. Just because the HC isn't the OC doesn't mean that he can't control the tempo. The OC has to listen to the boss so if the boss says "Hey it's time to run that no huddle you've been working on," or "have a play ready to go in case we don't get the 1st down because we're going for it," the OC has to listen. Also, if I'm a head coach I'm going to soak myself into our offense whether it be a spread or a double wing and learn it just as much as the OC if not more. I also see nothing wrong with the head coach hiring an OC and DC to run the systems that he believes in. When it comes down to it the HC's name is the one that goes along the dotted line so if I'm the HC I want my offensive and defensive philosophies implemented. That's just this young, inexperienced, ignorant coach's opinion.
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Post by coachjim on Jun 3, 2007 8:54:45 GMT -6
"the problem i have is a guy who spent his whole career on defense thinking he is qualified to call plays just because he sits in the big office. if all your training/experience is in one area, why would you switch gears just because you can?" - Pegleg Not "can".... "have to," Peg. There are only two of us and it is 8-10 year olds. Mwahaha. But... regardless, I would still want total control. I prefer defense and know it better then offense but have no choice. My lone assistant hasn't previously been either a DC or OC, so just call me "everything." Can't wait for the long cruel season to begin... it's just us Dads, sorry if I gave the impression I had five assistants, I'll be lucky to get five kids. If in three years, I go 1-25 like the last coach did, i'll go back to defense and stay there. Promise. But for now, the reins are mine!
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Post by pegleg on Jun 3, 2007 15:57:19 GMT -6
"the problem i have is a guy who spent his whole career on defense thinking he is qualified to call plays just because he sits in the big office. if all your training/experience is in one area, why would you switch gears just because you can?" - Pegleg Not "can".... "have to," Peg. There are only two of us and it is 8-10 year olds. Mwahaha. But... regardless, I would still want total control. I prefer defense and know it better then offense but have no choice. My lone assistant hasn't previously been either a DC or OC, so just call me "everything." Can't wait for the long cruel season to begin... it's just us Dads, sorry if I gave the impression I had five assistants, I'll be lucky to get five kids. If in three years, I go 1-25 like the last coach did, i'll go back to defense and stay there. Promise. But for now, the reins are mine! fair enough, i wasn't really refering to youth coaches or even small schools with only a couple coaches. i was talking about mid to large texas high schools who have staffs 8-15 professional coaches. this is where my experience lies and therefore the context of my response.
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Post by coachjim on Jun 4, 2007 1:30:14 GMT -6
Man, what I wouldn't give for 8-15 coaches! These towns like the one I am from, that don't support their youth programs nor have football programs to move onto in their schools systems are tough. The kids suffer, mostly. And yeah, totally agree, totally different worlds between college and youth. Including pay. I'm surpised that hasn't come up on this thread yet? I'm sure there is a difference in pay scale too, between an OC/DC/and HC.
Although, this doesn't seem to get mentioned. The conversation seems to revolve more around what people would like to do, rather than what pays better, which shows me that coaching isn't about the money, always, even at your level. It's good to hear, it sounds like a job that most people love doing, which Karl Marx said was the key to happiness (when your work and job are one and the same.)
Most of the advice I get here, I have to simplify into youth terms, but I still take it... you guys are the experts (what do we have, 10,000 combined years of experience if you counted it up among the coaches on this site?)
I doubt i'll move on beyond youth, I can't imagine the stress you guys go through, whether HC/OC/DC or even the bottle boy. Which is probably what I would be, at your level of play and experience...
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