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Post by idrive on Aug 7, 2015 9:38:30 GMT -6
I am the father of an 8 year old, soon to be 9, student athlete. This is my son's first year of tackle football. I coached him for two seasons in Grid Iron flag, where in the first season he rotated from QB to WR to RB. Our team made it to the championship game in the first season and lost. The following season, we returned all but one player, making it simple to establish regular positions for our players, and with great success. We came away with the championship. We decided as well as my son, to move him into the tackle game as he was at the top of the field regarding talent in the flag game and was getting somewhat bored. Iwill try and make this as short as possible as I know you've all seen it and heard it before. During his flag seasons and the off seasons as well, I had him in a skills camp, where he learned speed, agility and ball skills. He's was in this camp with players ranging from 7 to 17 years old, and some very talented players I might add. The attendants came from leagues and schools all over the city. There were coaches from 3 different youth leagues around town that were all recruiting him. I got a little nervous about this so I signed him up with Pop Warner. The team he's on is in its 3rd year, and while there are many talented kids on the team, there are also a few that struggle, both athletically and with their football IQ. My son has been killing it in practice, running circles around 80% of the other players, does everything correctly the first time, never gets yelled at other than accolades, and gives 110% at all times. Pone coach in particular, the O.C., seems to be favoring a couple of players that are performing well below what my son is doing, and my son is noticing. It's pretty blatant, I've noticed too, but have kept my mouth shut. Yesterday, this coach sends me a text, as I'm a volunteer for the team filming the games, telling me what a great job my song is doing and that he will be working with the first team as a wide receiver tonight. Well I shared that with my son and he lit up and couldn't wait for practice. So after calisthenics, the break the positions up. He goes with the QB and 2 other receivers to run routes. He goes on to run perfect routes, catches every ball thrown took him with perfect 8 year old technique. Other parents were commenting on his skill level. Then the coaches break into offense and proceed to put my son with the second team. When they started running full offensive plays,, they put him on defense to stand there in one place so the offense could work on blocking assignments. When he walked off the field after practice, though he never showed in on the filed, his disappointment was heartbreaking. He said "Coach K lied to me". I tried my best to encourage him and tell him there's a lot of time left for home to win the starting job and that he shouldn't let this get him down, but inside, I have trouble believing that myself. I want to be clear, that I told my son at the beginning of camp, not to expect anything, that everything had to be earned in this game. My concern is that once he's lost trust in his coach, this being his first year, is it will damage him moving forward. I am doing all I can to keep him encouraged and really biting my tongue trying to stay away from talking to his coach about this. I do t want to be one of those Dads that thinks his kid "deserves" or is entitled to anything. My question is, how patient should I be with this coach?
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Post by rsmith627 on Aug 7, 2015 10:25:28 GMT -6
Pick up some of this chit for the both of you and tell him to keep putting in work. Let the coaches do the coaching. It is your job to cheer for the team.
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Post by idrive40 on Aug 7, 2015 11:47:35 GMT -6
rsmith. First of all, it's not about tears, it's about building trust between the kid and the coach. That's the first thing I as a coach ask for both from the parents and the players, then continue to earn it. I'm not worried about him putting in work, he's got that covered. Pretty douschey response to someone looking for legit advice by the way. Congratulations,
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Post by 33coach on Aug 7, 2015 12:15:16 GMT -6
Let the coaches coach.
If you arnt on the field, you have no idea why decisions are being made.
It sounds like you need to take a step back and realize that these guys know what they are doing. And let them do it.
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Post by 33coach on Aug 7, 2015 12:18:36 GMT -6
Y'all need to learn that in life. What's promised to you, doesn't always happen.
Keep working.
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Post by rsmith627 on Aug 7, 2015 12:21:26 GMT -6
rsmith. First of all, it's not about tears, it's about building trust between the kid and the coach. That's the first thing I as a coach ask for both from the parents and the players, then continue to earn it. I'm not worried about him putting in work, he's got that covered. Pretty douschey response to someone looking for legit advice by the way. Congratulations, It's not about douchey. Sometimes parents are douchey and need to hear it like it is. That's all there is to it. Maybe the coaches who are trying to field the best team possible don't view your little superstar as "running circles" around everybody else, but who knows? Did you ask them? Any good coach is always willing to help a kid who wants to know what he can do to get better.
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Post by 33coach on Aug 7, 2015 12:26:26 GMT -6
rsmith. First of all, it's not about tears, it's about building trust between the kid and the coach. That's the first thing I as a coach ask for both from the parents and the players, then continue to earn it. I'm not worried about him putting in work, he's got that covered. Pretty douschey response to someone looking for legit advice by the way. Congratulations, It's not about douchey. Sometimes parents are douchey and need to hear it like it is. That's all there is to it. Maybe the coaches who are trying to field the best team possible don't view your little superstar as "running circles" around everybody else, but who knows? Did you ask them? Any good coach is always willing to help a kid who wants to know what he can do to get better. It could even be simpler then that coach. The kid might be the best on the field, but not the best fit for a coaches strategy. I'll give an example. I've got a hotshot QB on my team right now. Goes to all the camps, trainers everything. You know where he is playing right now? Tight end, because I don't need a drop back QB, I need a sprinter who doesn't mind running inside as well. So while by far, he's the best QB...but not for my team.
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Post by 33coach on Aug 7, 2015 12:39:10 GMT -6
And another thing. As a coach. I'm pretty petty. And I know alot of others are.
If a parent ever discussed their kids playing time or position or my philosophy , itd probably change for the wose.
Another example: last year a parent (dad / NFL bro) told me to widen my splits we run 8 inch splits. From that moment on, We spent the rest of the year foot to foot.
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Post by rsmith627 on Aug 7, 2015 12:48:28 GMT -6
It's not about douchey. Sometimes parents are douchey and need to hear it like it is. That's all there is to it. Maybe the coaches who are trying to field the best team possible don't view your little superstar as "running circles" around everybody else, but who knows? Did you ask them? Any good coach is always willing to help a kid who wants to know what he can do to get better. It could even be simpler then that coach. The kid might be the best on the field, but not the best fit for a coaches strategy. I'll give an example. I've got a hotshot QB on my team right now. Goes to all the camps, trainers everything. You know where he is playing right now? Tight end, because I don't need a drop back QB, I need a sprinter who doesn't mind running inside as well. So while by far, he's the best QB...but not for my team. This is a good point and could be true. This year I have two athletic JV QBs. Both can throw, but can run. We run a spread offense. I need to find a way to get both on the field because the best 11 play, but depending on what kind of system these coaches are running, I think you make a valid point.
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Post by idrive40 on Aug 7, 2015 13:46:22 GMT -6
33. Thank you for the Constructive advice. I have always been coach or player, first time as just a parent, so I'm fighting instinct to get involved. I agree with you about approaching the coach as a parent & don't ever want to do that to my kid. I keep telling my kid to let it play out & keep working hard. He will get noticed for the right reason. Stay classy.
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Post by idrive40 on Aug 7, 2015 14:13:03 GMT -6
And to further clarify, it's not about playing time, that'll come, I've been there before. The point I'm trying to get across and maybe didn't convey it correctly is that I tell him constantly to work hard and good things will come to him. But when he says it doesn't mean anything, which I know it does, he just doesn't understand it yet, what advice is there for him? I can totally see why he would think that. I don't view my son as a "superstar", but just want him to learn that hard work has rewards.
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Post by 33coach on Aug 7, 2015 14:26:31 GMT -6
And to further clarify, it's not about playing time, that'll come, I've been there before. The point I'm trying to get across and maybe didn't convey it correctly is that I tell him constantly to work hard and good things will come to him. But when he says it doesn't mean anything, which I know it does, he just doesn't understand it yet, what advice is there for him? I can totally see why he would think that. I don't view my son as a "superstar", but just want him to learn that hard work has rewards. the advice you give him, is that no one gets anything for free. in my real job, do you know how many contracts were "promised" to me, but fell through? thats life. and all you can do is work harder or work smarter. if there is alot of competition in that position, maybe go for another one? there are 22 positions in football, and if the kid is an athlete he will get one of them....
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Post by fballcoachg on Aug 7, 2015 14:39:37 GMT -6
And another thing. As a coach. I'm pretty petty. And I know alot of others are. If a parent ever discussed their kids playing time or position or my philosophy , itd probably change for the wose. Another example: last year a parent (dad / NFL bro) told me to widen my splits we run 8 inch splits. From that moment on, We spent the rest of the year foot to foot. Seriously? You are petty and may need to develop thicker skin...
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Post by 33coach on Aug 7, 2015 14:43:47 GMT -6
And another thing. As a coach. I'm pretty petty. And I know alot of others are. If a parent ever discussed their kids playing time or position or my philosophy , itd probably change for the wose. Another example: last year a parent (dad / NFL bro) told me to widen my splits we run 8 inch splits. From that moment on, We spent the rest of the year foot to foot. Seriously? You are petty and may need to develop thicker skin... its not that i need thicker skin, its more about the parent understanding their role. if they want to coach, there is an application, clinic, fingerprinting, and time commitment that needs to happen. if they want to be a parent, they need to be supportive regardless if what i do is the opposite of what the NFL announcer says. you cant be both.
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Post by coachklee on Aug 7, 2015 15:27:53 GMT -6
Sorry my previous post sucked.
2 questions:
1-Did he get reps during group with any offensive #1s?
2-How much did the offense run/pass during team?
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Post by 19delta on Aug 7, 2015 16:28:09 GMT -6
It was wrong for the coach to tell your boy he would be working with the 1s and then didn't carry through on that. That's BS. My question would be..."Why did you text me about my son getting time with the 1s but then didn't follow through with that in practice?" I think that is a legitimate question.
Quite honestly, it sounds like you have a bunch of slappys as coaches. Probably a bunch of dads who are more concerned with taking care of their own kids than they are of putting the right kid in the right position.
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Post by 44dlcoach on Aug 7, 2015 16:52:15 GMT -6
How long has practice been going on? Because I have to assume it's been a few weeks tops? I would tell my son that the saying "hard work pays off" is true but the saying also doesn't include the word "immediately" in it. Be patient, keep working at it.
It may be that you're caught in the middle of some daddy ball coaching but the OP doesn't really make it sound like that's your impression of thsee guys. If you haven't seen anything to make you think it's blatant favoritism then give these guys the benefit of the doubt and try to keep juniors spirits up.
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Post by 33coach on Aug 7, 2015 17:01:50 GMT -6
It was wrong for the coach to tell your boy he would be working with the 1s and then didn't carry through on that. That's BS. My question would be..."Why did you text me about my son getting time with the 1s but then didn't follow through with that in practice?" I think that is a legitimate question. Quite honestly, it sounds like you have a bunch of slappys as coaches. Probably a bunch of dads who are more concerned with taking care of their own kids than they are of putting the right kid in the right position. or, maybe it wasnt right to share privilaged information with the kid? i mean, knowing how football goes, and how coaches are, why tell your son at all? the coach didnt lie to your son, he lied to you, then you lied to your son.
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Post by 19delta on Aug 7, 2015 17:40:32 GMT -6
It was wrong for the coach to tell your boy he would be working with the 1s and then didn't carry through on that. That's BS. My question would be..."Why did you text me about my son getting time with the 1s but then didn't follow through with that in practice?" I think that is a legitimate question. Quite honestly, it sounds like you have a bunch of slappys as coaches. Probably a bunch of dads who are more concerned with taking care of their own kids than they are of putting the right kid in the right position. or, maybe it wasnt right to share privilaged information with the kid? i mean, knowing how football goes, and how coaches are, why tell your son at all? the coach didnt lie to your son, he lied to you, then you lied to your son. The lie started with the coach. Coaches shouldn't lie. Sounds like a {censored} organization. Glad my kids don't play in it.
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Post by idrive40 on Aug 7, 2015 18:51:10 GMT -6
I think the organization is good. They've produced State, Westcon and National champs. 3 out of the 4 coaches are as solid as they come. We've been with this team for about 1-1/2 months including OTAs this summer. If the takeaway from this conversation is that somehow I lied to my son, I feel terrible for you and your view of things. And "knowing how coaches are? As stated, I was a coach and no way in hell I believe this to be true about any coach. Coaches build character, so how can you build any of you lack it yourself. Pretty skewed view of things IMO.
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Post by fballcoachg on Aug 9, 2015 6:55:02 GMT -6
It was wrong for the coach to tell your boy he would be working with the 1s and then didn't carry through on that. That's BS. My question would be..."Why did you text me about my son getting time with the 1s but then didn't follow through with that in practice?" I think that is a legitimate question. Quite honestly, it sounds like you have a bunch of slappys as coaches. Probably a bunch of dads who are more concerned with taking care of their own kids than they are of putting the right kid in the right position. or, maybe it wasnt right to share privilaged information with the kid? i mean, knowing how football goes, and how coaches are, why tell your son at all? the coach didnt lie to your son, he lied to you, then you lied to your son. Don't share information about your son with your son? How did the dad lie to the son, by repeating what the coach said? So if I get information, repeat it, and it comes out that the base information was a lie I am a liar not the person that told me? Completely logical As far as "how coaches are," without getting all high and mighty, why would coaches go out of their way to say something and then not follow through with it. If you want your team to trust you than say what you will do and do what you will say or keep your mouth shut, you don't get a free pass because that's "how football goes."
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Post by fballcoachg on Aug 9, 2015 7:07:00 GMT -6
Seriously? You are petty and may need to develop thicker skin... its not that i need thicker skin, its more about the parent understanding their role. if they want to coach, there is an application, clinic, fingerprinting, and time commitment that needs to happen. if they want to be a parent, they need to be supportive regardless if what i do is the opposite of what the NFL announcer says. you cant be both. Maybe coaches need to understand their role as well, and it isn't to stick it to loud mouth parents. It is to best prepare your team and teach some lessons along the way. You can be frustrated or annoyed by parents as much as any of us but the fact you let them dictate what you do to show them up really is petty in your words and shows a lack of comprehending the bigger picture. So if a dad yells run the ball more you are going to throw it every down? If he yells that his kid should be playing more you are going to bench him? The fact that you say and claim many other coaches hold parents words and opinions against kids shows a complete lack of maturity and gives all of the paranoid parents rationality behind their claims. These are kids, you are an adult/coach, they are not responsible for those that raise them. Maybe it's time to take a look at your priorities because an attitude and approach like that (where parents opinions and chatter impacts their kids experience because the coach didn't like it) has no place in football or sports in general. Maybe instead of being vindictive, have a conversation with parents before hand and address them when these issues arise instead of taking it out on kids.
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Post by coachklee on Aug 9, 2015 8:18:39 GMT -6
Sorry my previous post sucked. 2 questions: 1-Did he get reps during group with any offensive #1s? 2-How much did the offense run/pass during team? ^^^ I meant to post this last time, but the quote feature didn't work correctly.
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Post by idrive on Aug 9, 2015 9:26:18 GMT -6
Sorry my previous post sucked. 2 questions: 1-Did he get reps during group with any offensive #1s? 2-How much did the offense run/pass during team? ^^^ I meant to post this last time, but the quote feature didn't work correctly. Thanks Coach, Actually, that evening no, but after Friday night's practice, the coaches pulled me aside, keep in mind I've said nothing to them, and gave very high praise for my son. They told me they're in a quandary because they don't know where to put him. They love is pace (same pace at the end of practice as the beginning: 110%), say he has too many tools to pigeon hole him in one position, and love his attitude. They are going to use him as the "X" and want him to learn 5 positions for the Wing Tee: 2,3,4, TE and WR. As stated by the HC; "he's our homerun threat". So,now the real work begins. Thanks for all of the constructive advice gang.
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Post by coachd5085 on Aug 9, 2015 9:52:46 GMT -6
idrive Bottom line, as with ALL professions/jobs some people do them well, some do not. There is a good chance your son will encounter coaches who are unorganized,illogical, and misguided throughout his life. He will also encounter teachers that are less than stellar, doctors who are lacking, and future bosses that are self-serving and dishonest. The one good thing about youth football as opposed to other youth sports is that with the exception of a youth coach putting a kid as a WR and just telling him to run deep as a decoy every play, every other position gives a kid the chance to "win that play" regardless of any coaching asshatery.
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Post by silkyice on Aug 9, 2015 11:12:16 GMT -6
And another thing. As a coach. I'm pretty petty. And I know alot of others are. If a parent ever discussed their kids playing time or position or my philosophy , itd probably change for the wose. Another example: last year a parent (dad / NFL bro) told me to widen my splits we run 8 inch splits. From that moment on, We spent the rest of the year foot to foot. Don't get this Coach. Which were the better splits for your team, 8 inches or none? If foot to foot was better then you should have been that to begin with. If 8 inches was better, then you should have stayed 8 inches. No matter what, you did exactly what you thought you weren't doing. You let a parent dictate a coaching decision for you.
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Post by 33coach on Aug 9, 2015 11:35:07 GMT -6
And another thing. As a coach. I'm pretty petty. And I know alot of others are. If a parent ever discussed their kids playing time or position or my philosophy , itd probably change for the wose. Another example: last year a parent (dad / NFL bro) told me to widen my splits we run 8 inch splits. From that moment on, We spent the rest of the year foot to foot. Don't get this Coach. Which were the better splits for your team, 8 inches or none? If foot to foot was better then you should have been that to begin with. If 8 inches was better, then you should have stayed 8 inches. No matter what, you did exactly what you thought you weren't doing. You let a parent dictate a coaching decision for you. Better for us? Foot to foot. But as a staff we were attempting to do something a little different, so it was more that was the tipping point for me to make the call to go back. And here is maybe something I didn't explain, the Dad is a Dbag the kind of guy who wears his Letterman jacket to his son's games...he complained daily that we weren't doing it how "they did it when he was playing....".
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Post by 33coach on Aug 9, 2015 11:36:06 GMT -6
^^^ I meant to post this last time, but the quote feature didn't work correctly. Thanks Coach, Actually, that evening no, but after Friday night's practice, the coaches pulled me aside, keep in mind I've said nothing to them, and gave very high praise for my son. They told me they're in a quandary because they don't know where to put him. They love is pace (same pace at the end of practice as the beginning: 110%), say he has too many tools to pigeon hole him in one position, and love his attitude. They are going to use him as the "X" and want him to learn 5 positions for the Wing Tee: 2,3,4, TE and WR. As stated by the HC; "he's our homerun threat". So,now the real work begins. Thanks for all of the constructive advice gang. That's a dangerous spot to be in for your son. How is he supposed to master 4 positions in youth football?
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Post by silkyice on Aug 9, 2015 11:42:54 GMT -6
Don't get this Coach. Which were the better splits for your team, 8 inches or none? If foot to foot was better then you should have been that to begin with. If 8 inches was better, then you should have stayed 8 inches. No matter what, you did exactly what you thought you weren't doing. You let a parent dictate a coaching decision for you. Better for us? Foot to foot. But as a staff we were attempting to do something a little different, so it was more that was the tipping point for me to make the call to go back. And here is maybe something I didn't explain, the Dad is a Dbag the kind of guy who wears his Letterman jacket to his son's games...he complained daily that we weren't doing it how "they did it when he was playing....". As usual, a little more back story changes my perception.
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Post by coachd5085 on Aug 9, 2015 12:07:27 GMT -6
Thanks Coach, Actually, that evening no, but after Friday night's practice, the coaches pulled me aside, keep in mind I've said nothing to them, and gave very high praise for my son. They told me they're in a quandary because they don't know where to put him. They love is pace (same pace at the end of practice as the beginning: 110%), say he has too many tools to pigeon hole him in one position, and love his attitude. They are going to use him as the "X" and want him to learn 5 positions for the Wing Tee: 2,3,4, TE and WR. As stated by the HC; "he's our homerun threat". So,now the real work begins. Thanks for all of the constructive advice gang. That's a dangerous spot to be in for your son. How is he supposed to master 4 positions in youth football? Its youth football coach. "Mastery" won't happen. I think the bigger issue is that this mindset would worry me since they are 8 years old, this sounds an awful lot like coaches who draw up plays instead of coaching offensive football.
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