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Post by larrymoe on May 12, 2015 9:01:49 GMT -6
At one of my previous stops, the HC said to me at a 7on7 "I love these. I'd rather we play these than actual games!".
I knew we were {censored} right then and there.
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Post by larrymoe on May 12, 2015 9:03:11 GMT -6
On a sidenote- We've won something at a 7on7 tournament exactly twice in my time as a HC here. Those years we went 3-6 and 4-5. One year, I don't think we won even half our 7on7s. Ended the year 11-1.
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Post by John Knight on May 12, 2015 9:08:09 GMT -6
I know these rules because they piss me off!! Plus the danged officials do not call them the way they are written but they sure as hell will call holding on some fat kid trying to block a 19 year old man child on a play that is toss sweep for a touchdown!! I can't help it the little fat kid is too dumb to not hold on a play where he doesn't even need to touch his man! Illegal use of hands is 10 yards, unnecessary roughness is 15 but your Mike could get sent to the showers for 2 games if the Officials thinks it is FLAGRANT!!! LOL!!!! It is about to this point!!
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Post by John Knight on May 12, 2015 9:17:49 GMT -6
Show of hands...who knew Knightrider would have the d@mn rule book out?
"A defender may legally contact an eligible receiver beyond the neutral zone before the pass is in flight" - exactly. No change.
However, if the receiver is not attempting to block or has gone past or is moving away, it is illegal for the defender to use hands in the manner described
You gotta read the entire passage!! and that is from the Casebook BTW!!!
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Post by fantom on May 12, 2015 9:26:12 GMT -6
We won a 7-on-7 a few years ago. The field consisted of:
1. Team A: a state power from an hour and a half away, with several D.1 players, well coached, and they cared about 7-on-7. 2. Team B: Power from a neighboring state, about four hours away. They arrived on a chartered bus at the end of a tour of 7-on-7's. 3. A bunch of average teams, including us.
In the first game, Team A crushed us. We then beat a couple average teams. In the last pool game, right before lunch, Team B is in the process of handing us our a$$es when the sky opens up. They suspend the game and we go inside for lunch, waiting for the storm to pass but it doesn't. The torrential rain continues-the stadium stairs are waterfalls- and there's lightning. The lunch hour becomes two hours and there's no sign that it'll stop soon.
Team's A and B decide that they need to get on the road and they leave. For the "championship" game we're supposed to play another local team but a lot of kids from both teams have gone home. Since we have the best record of teams that are left, we're awarded the trophy.
WOO HOO! WE'RE NUMBER ONE!
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Post by powerfootball71 on May 12, 2015 11:04:23 GMT -6
as a line coach, I always hated 7 on 7s even though I coached LBs as well, it is not realistic for them at all! Was at one of those nfl high school development camps a few years ago. Keeping in mind I coach line this team is hooping and hollering during a 7 on 7 like it's the damn playoffs. I'm on the side line watching with the line. Are all league area guard who just won state in wrestling at 220 is a beyonde pissed about if they ran that little bs shallow he'd kill the crosser.So I tell the dc think Alex needs a few reps.1st time he about knocks the crosser out.Benches clear coach's are pissed. Well its game like but if you feel it's a penalty you can move the ball forward 15 yard or give your self 3 7on7 points whatever makes you feel better.
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2015 11:21:57 GMT -6
as a line coach, I always hated 7 on 7s even though I coached LBs as well, it is not realistic for them at all! We went to a 7 on 7 last year where there were to be "lineman competitions." No one told us anything about exactly what those were going to be, just to bring our whole team out. We got there and it was just the host team lining their front up and running their blitz package at our kids in shirts and shorts. Myself and the other OL coaches all stood around wondering WTF we were supposed to do. Since this was in the summer and we had just got a new OC with new terminology, we hadn't even installed any blocking schemes or pass pro yet. Talk about a waste of time.
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2015 11:24:42 GMT -6
Under the new POE blasting the crosser could be considered unnecessary and illegal! it's only 15 yards. They can't award 7 points and little Jimmy slot receiver will stay his @$$ out of the LB box from now on. Under the current rules, if he comes anywhere close to little Jimmy's head, it's targeting and he'll be thrown out. In our state, that means a suspension the next week. We had our best LB thrown out and suspended last year because a RB lowered his shoulder and led with his head in a goal line situation.
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Post by utchuckd on May 12, 2015 13:05:35 GMT -6
Last year we had opposing ball carriers in 2 different games get flagged for illegal contact because they lowered their head and trucked our FS and LB. I'm probably not long for this game.
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Post by natenator on May 12, 2015 13:36:03 GMT -6
Show of hands...who knew Knightrider would have the d@mn rule book out?
"A defender may legally contact an eligible receiver beyond the neutral zone before the pass is in flight" - exactly. No change.However, if the receiver is not attempting to block or has gone past or is moving away, it is illegal for the defender to use hands in the manner described You gotta read the entire passage!! and that is from the Casebook BTW!!! IMO - all this effort to make the game safer is all aimed at the defense and I do take some issue with that. IMO, there are some plays you don't run because of the safety factors involved. One example is mesh. IMO, that is a very dangerous play if you're concerned about safety. If those safeties stay home and catch those crossers...no matter what those receivers are defenseless. Even if they catch the ball they are defenseless. Meanwhile it is perfectly legal to cut defensive players in space... That right there is my complaint about the whole "safety" rule changes. NO MATTER WHAT, those kids are defenseless. Yet the play still gets called...because it's a good freakin play. Guys have come a long who have decided to run different routes in different ways and it puts their players at risk. All of it sounds more like trying to have your cake and eat it too and sometimes you just can't do that. I agree with this. Two years ago one of our players sent another to the hospital during a game because he completely destroyed a crosser that was getting the ball. Opposing team was up in arms about an "illegal" hit of course and words were definitely exchanged. I ask the OC outright why he had willful disregard for his player's safety by putting him in route that he KNEW was going to result in a bad situation. He had no such view that it was HIS actions that of installing such a play that led to the situation.
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Post by joelee on May 12, 2015 14:01:15 GMT -6
If you don't like 7 on 7 don't go. If you hospitalize someone on my team, we will have more than words about rules.
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Post by rsmith627 on May 12, 2015 18:37:55 GMT -6
If you don't like 7 on 7 don't go. If you hospitalize someone on my team, we will have more than words about rules. Don't put your players in chitty situations to get lit up. This crap is why I hate 7 on 7. And to be clear, I don't mean your comment. You're right to defend your players. 7 on 7 puts them at unnecessary risk, albeit minor, and I don't feel you get that much out of them.
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Post by joelee on May 12, 2015 19:13:02 GMT -6
Get lit up? In a 2 hand touch game? Wow! Macho man behind a keyboard. Don't go to 7 on 7 if you don't like it. You guys are talking about hurting kids in a touch game.
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Post by natenator on May 12, 2015 19:27:50 GMT -6
Get lit up? In a 2 hand touch game? Wow! Macho man behind a keyboard. Don't go to 7 on 7 if you don't like it. You guys are talking about hurting kids in a touch game. I was responding to DC's post where he was talking about football.
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Post by rsmith627 on May 12, 2015 19:51:11 GMT -6
Get lit up? In a 2 hand touch game? Wow! Macho man behind a keyboard. Don't go to 7 on 7 if you don't like it. You guys are talking about hurting kids in a touch game. Yeah you know me, a regular internet tough guy. In case you're illiterate I agreed with your post. I have seen kids get hurt in 7 on 7 countless times, that's all I was saying. I've seen a few season ending concussions happen, and never because I told a player to intentionally hurt somebody. If you feel like you need to have "more than words" with a coach if that happens to one of your kids in a competition, maybe you should stay home. Otherwise, chill out and understand what the risk is to your players..
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Post by John Knight on May 13, 2015 4:47:56 GMT -6
Hey DC, this is for that holding comment!
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Post by John Knight on May 13, 2015 6:20:01 GMT -6
Hey DC this was the video that was to be in that post above!!!
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Post by 3rdandlong on May 13, 2015 7:33:31 GMT -6
The worst thing about 7 on 7 tournaments is when teams do something they never do in a real game. There was once a team who was playing nothing but 2 man under against us in a tournament for the entire game. We've played this particular team before and know that this isn't really a part of the defense. So we motioned the back out to an empty set (which was illegal for this tournament) and ran QB draw (also illegal) onc the mike backer chased the back. it may have seemed childish but at least we were able to make the point.
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Post by coachphillip on May 13, 2015 7:47:20 GMT -6
Why would motioning to Empty be illegal?
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Post by coachphillip on May 13, 2015 7:51:05 GMT -6
I was accused of stealing the offense's plays and telling my defense because I like to coach my linebackers from behind the offense. I just stood back there so that I could watch their eyes to make sure they were looking at what I wanted them looking at. I saw a tight split by #2 so I pointed to him and made an out movement with my hand for my OLB and he gave me a head nod and picked off an arrow route. "He's cheating! He's relaying our plays!" Every damn defensive coach/player in the world knows that a tight split should alert an out breaking route or crack and a wide split should alert an in breaking route. Visor jockeys.
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Post by John Knight on May 13, 2015 8:03:34 GMT -6
That would be you JC!!
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Post by John Knight on May 13, 2015 8:07:32 GMT -6
if you read the Texas 7 on 7 rules, bump cover and all contact by the defense is illegal. www.scribd.com/doc/255220530/2015-Official-Texas-State-7on7-RulesG. Responsibility to avoid contact is with the defense. There will be NO chucking. Deliberate bumping or grabbing. These actions will result in a “tack on” penalty at the end of the play (5 yard penalty)
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Post by dg1694 on May 13, 2015 8:41:24 GMT -6
Back to the origin of the thread, I thought the NZone advertisement was amusing.
I also think 7 on 7 is very useful. At its best, It keeps kids working on skills that they use on Friday nights in the fall. We have a youth 7on7 league where I live, and it was great as kids got used to a full field (I had serious concerns about getting throws to all parts of the field) and the use of a different sized ball. Luckily, my guys proved me wrong.
In Texas, HS coaches cannot coach, so it calls on the QB to be a master of his system and asserts leadership.
At its worst, 7on7 is what is being described by some of you. It's not a place to hurt players and then blame the play call/ play caller, or to use things the team will never use during the regular season.
But- it was amusing to see the ad.
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Post by mariner42 on May 13, 2015 8:46:15 GMT -6
I was accused of stealing the offense's plays and telling my defense because I like to coach my linebackers from behind the offense. I just stood back there so that I could watch their eyes to make sure they were looking at what I wanted them looking at. I saw a tight split by #2 so I pointed to him and made an out movement with my hand for my OLB and he gave me a head nod and picked off an arrow route. "He's cheating! He's relaying our plays!" Every damn defensive coach/player in the world knows that a tight split should alert an out breaking route or crack and a wide split should alert an in breaking route. Visor jockeys. I get SOOOOO many dirty looks for standing behind the opposing offense during 7 on 7. I once had a coach refuse to run a play until I was a good 10 yards away from their huddle, which cracked me up.
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Post by fantom on May 13, 2015 8:54:07 GMT -6
if you read the Texas 7 on 7 rules, bump cover and all contact by the defense is illegal. www.scribd.com/doc/255220530/2015-Official-Texas-State-7on7-RulesG. Responsibility to avoid contact is with the defense. There will be NO chucking. Deliberate bumping or grabbing. These actions will result in a “tack on” penalty at the end of the play (5 yard penalty) That only matters if you're in Texas.
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Post by John Knight on May 13, 2015 9:19:50 GMT -6
That is true, fanthom!
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Post by oguru on May 13, 2015 10:27:17 GMT -6
When I was in college we hosted a passing league during the summer. One game I was refereeing. A kid blind sided another kid as he chased after the guy who caught the ball. Know grant it they were wearing pads, but a brawl ensued. I asked our OC what to do and he said let the coaches break it up. The problem was that the coaches were in the middle of it. We did call campus police and everything. The poor kid that got blindsided broke his leg as he landed weird. The kids coach was yelling and screaming at me like I was suppose to do something. It was a clean hit just not something you do in 7 on 7 whether your wearing pads or not. 7 on 7 is the most unrealistic drill there is from defenses just playing 2 man to teams running draws when the linebackers drop. Yes it's ok for timing but alot ot it is unrealistic.
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2015 11:15:31 GMT -6
I prefer to think of 7 on 7 as being the football equivalent of HORSE or a homerun derby. It's a fun exhibition, but that's about it. It's not even really practice.
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Post by fantom on May 13, 2015 11:27:13 GMT -6
I prefer to think of 7 on 7 as being the football equivalent of HORSE or a homerun derby. It's a fun exhibition, but that's about it. It's not even really practice. As much as I dislike tournaments I wouldn't say that they're completely useless. It does get the kids competing and defensively they get the kids used to communicating and playing the coverages under duress. The problem is that the juices do get flowing and sometimes winning becomes important and I don't like that much. I prefer "friendlies" against one other team. We've had two of them so far with a team whose coaches are friends of ours. We;ve run nothing but C.4 every snap and it's been very useful.
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Post by natenator on May 13, 2015 12:19:34 GMT -6
As much as I dislike tournaments I wouldn't say that they're completely useless. It does get the kids competing and defensively they get the kids used to communicating and playing the coverages under duress. The problem is that the juices do get flowing and sometimes winning becomes important and I don't like that much. I prefer "friendlies" against one other team. We've had two of them so far with a team whose coaches are friends of ours. We;ve run nothing but C.4 every snap and it's been very useful. absolutely. I'm like that with scrimmages also. Because we've had some "issues" in scrimmages as well. I hate 7 on 7 tournaments. I would 10 times over rather 7 on 7 vs someone I know, who I know their kids are well coached, who will line stuff back up and answer questions as I will for him. Because in July it's about getting better for the season, not winning. It's really practice and a learning time. Scrimmage wise - just run your chit. If you blitz a lot, then blitz. Just do what you do. But do NOT say "do whatever you want coach" and then b!tch when I do. It's not my fault your Oline is undisciplined and a walked up MIKE backer cuts the WILL backer loose through B gap...that's what we do asshat and we do it quite a bit. Just watch a game and you'd see that. It's true. They do lol
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