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Post by John Knight on Jan 17, 2012 8:13:08 GMT -6
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Post by k on Jan 17, 2012 9:35:06 GMT -6
Just being a homer for my alma mater. =) |
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Post by emptybackfield on Jan 17, 2012 9:37:33 GMT -6
Just being a homer for my alma mater. =) Gotcha. I was just confused. I thought for a second, Jim Calhoun might be posting on the board. ;D If the kid knew he was going to have to pay his own way going in, that's much different than what Saban has done. Quite frankly, I see this as a prime example of what's wrong with big time college athletics; what's good for the student-athlete is no longer the top priority. |
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Post by gdoggwr on Jan 17, 2012 11:14:07 GMT -6
I'm curious about what bama's message was to the kid in August when he first hurt his knee. Did they tell him then don't worry, you still have a spot, or did they say lets see how the rehab goes? It seems like there could be a lot unsaid about this situation.
That said, I think dcohio is on the money. The injury puts a question mark on the kid, and Alabama doesn't need to give schollies to question marks. Whether that is right or wrong is another story entirely, but it is reality.
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Post by ajreaper on Jan 18, 2012 8:52:12 GMT -6
He was offered a scholarship and accepted the offer in good faith and now they are saying well next year (maybe) and we'll sign a paper and you sign it- what official NCAA paperwork is there that assures a scholarship next year? Saban is playing games with this kids future and if I was him or his parents I would take being lied to once as enough of a clear sign that I should not trust what you say and move on. Honesty and ethics are not priorities for Saban and the University of Alabama- they are options available at the buffet that they pick and choose as it suits them.
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Post by veertackle on Jan 18, 2012 10:33:08 GMT -6
Let's look at it from the other side. If a student athlete signs a letter of intent and commits to a university and then decides he wants to go play at a different university can he just tell the first school that he got a better offer and not go? To me that is what Alabama is saying. They wanted him until they found a better player and now they want out the scholarship offer they gave him. I guess I'm asking why the scholarship offer and letter of intent are binding for the student athlete buy not the university?
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Post by fantom on Jan 18, 2012 10:37:29 GMT -6
Let's look at it from the other side. If a student athlete signs a letter of intent and commits to a university and then decides he wants to go play at a different university can he just tell the first school that he got a better offer and not go? To me that is what Alabama is saying. They wanted him until they found a better player and now they want out the scholarship offer they gave him. I guess I'm asking why the scholarship offer and letter of intent are binding for the student athlete buy not the university? Huh? There was no LOI. |
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Post by John Knight on Jan 18, 2012 10:44:09 GMT -6
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Post by John Knight on Jan 18, 2012 10:45:31 GMT -6
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Post by John Knight on Jan 18, 2012 11:11:17 GMT -6
once you get a written offer though
He said he was going to sign me with the next class. But he also said he would sign a piece of paper to show that they are keeping their word – they are going to sign it and they want me to sign it to make sure I know I still have my scholarship.”
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Post by emptybackfield on Jan 18, 2012 11:15:59 GMT -6
Let's look at it from the other side. If a student athlete signs a letter of intent and commits to a university and then decides he wants to go play at a different university can he just tell the first school that he got a better offer and not go? To me that is what Alabama is saying. They wanted him until they found a better player and now they want out the scholarship offer they gave him. I guess I'm asking why the scholarship offer and letter of intent are binding for the student athlete buy not the university? It's a whole different issue, but this is why they need to have an early signing period in football like they do other sports. It will prevent kids (like in this case) and schools from being put in bad situations. |
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Post by John Knight on Jan 18, 2012 11:23:07 GMT -6
sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/andy_staples/01/17/taylor-alabama/There is nothing wrong with making such a deal as long as other schools are still allowed to present the prospect with an alternative -- going on scholarship immediately. Now, other schools can recruit grayshirted players. (In Saban's defense, there has never been a story of him not having a scholarship available for a grayshirted player. Not all coaches can make that claim.)
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Post by veertackle on Jan 18, 2012 11:51:39 GMT -6
Dcohio did a good job of answering my question of Why is it only binding to the player and not the university? I don't like the practice of over signing but I understand that if one university does it then all universities must do it or be at a competitive disadvantage.
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Post by John Knight on Jan 18, 2012 12:15:04 GMT -6
NLI is the worst contract in American sports. In plain English, it is a one-year deal with a club option for the next three (or four) years. Except in some cases, it isn't even a one-year deal. In return for prospects signing away all their leverage -- no other school may recruit them once they have signed -- a school is supposed to guarantee a scholarship and a roster spot for a year. But it doesn't always work that way. When LSU had two more qualified signees than it had available scholarships in 2010, those players were not allowed to play football on scholarship at LSU. They had signed away their right to be recruited and received nothing in return. This is par for the course in a system tilted in favor of the millionaire coaches over the 18- to 22-year-olds, but at least some of the grown-ups have attempted to help the prospects by allowing them to hold on to their leverage.
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Post by blb on Jan 19, 2012 7:42:08 GMT -6
I finally get what you mean! |
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Post by John Knight on Jan 19, 2012 9:10:26 GMT -6
Agreed DC. I just get the feeling this particular kid really wants to go to Alabama. We had a QB go the redshirt route to NMSU. He had plenty of FCS and D2 full rides but wanted to be DI. His parents sent him to NMSU as a grayshirt and he paid for his first semester and went part time. Coach Mumme got fired and this QB should have left but stuck it out because he loved the school and fell in love and has since married and plays TE and holds for EP and does take some reps at QB when injuries cause a need.
He is very happy and is on a DI scholly. So it worked for him. If he was my son it would have not played out like that.
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Post by veerman on Jan 19, 2012 10:56:55 GMT -6
I agree this kid does not want to just play D1 college ball, he has his heart set on playing ball at Alabama. He does not care how long he has to wait (which I'm in the opinion also that he will never make it on campus after a 1 year layoff), he wants Bama. Now we keep asking were are the parents, what if that's what he wants to do?? Your going to make the decision on where your kids is going to college? I have mixed feelings on this, after my experiences I have seen with this when I was in college in a situation when parents decided on where kid went, I would probably let him make his own decision.
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Post by jrk5150 on Jan 19, 2012 15:14:43 GMT -6
Very fine line between imparting wisdom and pushing/overly influencing a decision.
And if anyone knows where that line is, I'd love to know, LOL.
I had pretty much no adult guidance in my college choice - was all left up to me. While I'm okay with where I ended up, that was just blind luck. There were a lot of options out there that I knew nothing about, and it would have been valuable to have someone - be it coach or parent or teacher or whoever - sit me down and explain what was what.
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Post by fantom on Jan 19, 2012 15:28:56 GMT -6
I wouldn't say that he'll never get to Bama just because he has to sit out for a year. As I've said, we had a player get greyshirted. Of course, we weren't thrilled because there really is no guarantee. We had a good relationship with the college coaching staff, though, so we were pretty sure they'd follow through on their end. I've heard of a number of kids who had the same deal and ended up OK.
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Post by John Knight on Jan 19, 2012 17:44:05 GMT -6
If I am paying for it I have a say in it. If it is a full scholly and the kid has options he can make his own mind up.
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Post by deaux68 on Jan 19, 2012 22:00:16 GMT -6
nice to see nick saban is engaging in over singing again. in the SEC recruiting classes of 30+30+30+30=85 scholarships must be new southern math. Now a conference like the big ten would have rules against this crap. Actually the SEC is the first conference to set a hard line rule against it. 25 is 25 starting this year. |
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Post by coachd5085 on Jan 21, 2012 10:17:32 GMT -6
I wouldn't say that he'll never get to Bama just because he has to sit out for a year. As I've said, we had a player get greyshirted. Of course, we weren't thrilled because there really is no guarantee. We had a good relationship with the college coaching staff, though, so we were pretty sure they'd follow through on their end. I've heard of a number of kids who had the same deal and ended up OK. How did the kid end up in the situation fantom? The negative in the situation is the danger that the lack of structure that he may now face. |
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Post by fantom on Jan 21, 2012 11:42:42 GMT -6
I wouldn't say that he'll never get to Bama just because he has to sit out for a year. As I've said, we had a player get greyshirted. Of course, we weren't thrilled because there really is no guarantee. We had a good relationship with the college coaching staff, though, so we were pretty sure they'd follow through on their end. I've heard of a number of kids who had the same deal and ended up OK. How did the kid end up in the situation fantom? The negative in the situation is the danger that the lack of structure that he may now face. Our kid's problem was academics. They wanted him but by signing day he was close but no cigar. Instead of just moving on they offered the greyshirt and it worked out. The lack of structure was our biggest worry. |
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Post by John Knight on Jan 21, 2012 13:29:39 GMT -6
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Post by coachd5085 on Jan 21, 2012 13:39:37 GMT -6
How did the kid end up in the situation fantom? The negative in the situation is the danger that the lack of structure that he may now face. Our kid's problem was academics. They wanted him but by signing day he was close but no cigar. Instead of just moving on they offered the greyshirt and it worked out. The lack of structure was our biggest worry. While the end result appears to be the same (greyshirt) the reasons behind are obviously different. In your kids case, he COULDN't go anywhere else other than a JC correct? Both situations are related, and I think together they show how "greyshirting" works on each side for those who were asking. Your kid couldn't become qualified in time... so there was room for another students offer to be taken. Had your kid qualified, then most likely ANOTHER commit would have been left out..and possibly greyshirted. |
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Post by fantom on Jan 21, 2012 13:48:08 GMT -6
Our kid's problem was academics. They wanted him but by signing day he was close but no cigar. Instead of just moving on they offered the greyshirt and it worked out. The lack of structure was our biggest worry. While the end result appears to be the same (greyshirt) the reasons behind are obviously different. In your kids case, he COULDN't go anywhere else other than a JC correct? Both situations are related, and I think together they show how "greyshirting" works on each side for those who were asking. Your kid couldn't become qualified in time... so there was room for another students offer to be taken. Had your kid qualified, then most likely ANOTHER commit would have been left out..and possibly greyshirted. Sorry if I left the impression that he wasn't qualified by the signing period. He was but since it was getting close the school signed another kid. He could have signed elsewhere but his options would have been limited. |
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Post by coachd5085 on Jan 21, 2012 14:00:12 GMT -6
While the end result appears to be the same (greyshirt) the reasons behind are obviously different. In your kids case, he COULDN't go anywhere else other than a JC correct? Both situations are related, and I think together they show how "greyshirting" works on each side for those who were asking. Your kid couldn't become qualified in time... so there was room for another students offer to be taken. Had your kid qualified, then most likely ANOTHER commit would have been left out..and possibly greyshirted. Sorry if I left the impression that he wasn't qualified by the signing period. He was but since it was getting close the school signed another kid. He could have signed elsewhere but his options would have been limited. Thanks for the clarification. Do you happen to know if the other kid was ALSO a commit though? Meaning..was this still an example of how oversigning leads to greyshirting? |
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Post by fantom on Jan 21, 2012 14:27:08 GMT -6
Sorry if I left the impression that he wasn't qualified by the signing period. He was but since it was getting close the school signed another kid. He could have signed elsewhere but his options would have been limited. Thanks for the clarification. Do you happen to know if the other kid was ALSO a commit though? Meaning..was this still an example of how oversigning leads to greyshirting? Don't know. |
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