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Post by noplaysoff on Jan 16, 2011 22:59:05 GMT -6
No Plays Off So many have given such great advice! I love to see a young coach hungry to learn our craft. It truly is a craft & should be respected as such. One thing I haven't seen posted is to go & watch practices. Find a college close, call & ask(usually most schools will accommodate you) & go watch spring practice. You will be amazed at how helpful this can be. I have visited many schools & watched practice( everything from JUCO to Division1), usually one or more of the coaches will be kind enough to talk to you when they are free. Joe I appreciate the advice, Joe. I'm around a few colleges now and I'll be sure to contact them about spring ball. Thank you.
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Post by noplaysoff on Jan 16, 2011 23:02:19 GMT -6
Thanks to all the coaches that responded. I'm copying and pasting the advice into a word document. This will be good to review and look back on. Thanks.
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Post by coachcb on Jan 17, 2011 19:41:47 GMT -6
I am surprised at the HC's advice as I always tell my assistants the opposite. I have to refocus them and emphasize fundamentals and get away from the Xs and Os talk. But, I don't know if you should take it as criticism; the HC might be telling you that you're solid in the most important areas and now you can focus on the offense and defense. But, here's my two cents any way:
1. I'll repeat what others have said; learn the blocking schemes and rules. 2. What is the offensive philosophy? 3. Figure out how the run game meshes together. What are the base running schemes? What are the compliments, PAs and counters off of them? 4. Take a look at the passing game and learn how those schemes tick. How do you guys use each facet (quick game, screens, five-step) and how do they fit into the offense? For example, one of the most difficult offenses I have ever defended had a very simple three step game that was basically just designed to keep defenses out of a 3-4 Eagle/4-3 Under front. 5. What kind of formations does the offense utilize and why? For example, we run three splits with our slot: one an apex between the EMLOS, one is 3x1 yards off of him, and the other is tight. How a defense adjusts to these different alignments helps us determine our play calling.
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Post by dazzleox on Jan 17, 2011 19:59:38 GMT -6
I reallly dont know how someone is supposed to "read all the threads". Yes - everything and every possible question has already been asked on this board, but that sounds like a Mr Miagi task. When you're just starting out yeah its great to find a focus, but to gain a quicker understanding of scheme and the game, one really needs to take a step BACK I think Chris Brown does this really well where he can give you a perspective without drowning you in details. How many guys do you know that coud tell you a dozen ways to block power but never understand how a formation affects front/coverage? How many guys do you know that have 100 LB drills in their arsenal but.have no idea of gap support? Get a grasp WHY formations and coverages exist, thay will flesh out the concepts used with them. Once you can understand the difference between a 2 man surface and a 3 man surface against cover 3, then you can really have a foundation and security to technique and drills Rely HEAVILY on the coaches on your staff and dont be in a hurry to start calling the shots This is all very well said! There is plenty of rote learning (and route tree learning) in football, but I feel like I'm starting to learn it's at least as important to understand why things work, more of a sort of process that you become a part of through more like the popular education that is simply engaging yourself in it all. One of the most useful experiences I ever had was going on a scouting trip with a very seasoned coach. As he talked (rambled really) about his last 40 years in football, much of which isn't the kind of stuff written that much about that much, I understood better WHY his goal line and short yardage defenses were so different. I never understood it looking at it on paper.
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Post by shocktroop34 on Jan 18, 2011 9:35:21 GMT -6
Good responses. Let me add something from personal experience as a current head coach. I didn't know (and still don't know) the x's and o's as well as a lot of guys. However, I'm better than I was when I first started. But do you know what my greatest learning tool was?...time.
My point is...just stay around the game. Read, watch, listed, etc. It will start to soak in. Stay around people that are smarter than you.
Some of these veteran guys will tell you, it's not necessarily about learning systems, but more importanly learning concepts of the game. Every system is trying to accomplish something. Once you learn that, it really doesn't matter what the system is, you just learn to defeat the concept.
Remember this though...in your quest to learn more football knowledge, don't forget to build relationships with players along the way. The fire you build in a teams heart will win you more games than any scheme you can draw up.
Take what your HC said with a grain of salt. x's and o's are a small part of the game. In short, there is no greater teacher than time itself.
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Post by M4 on Jan 18, 2011 9:49:19 GMT -6
I would think that if this was me I would look at the offense my team runs and then try and identify other places that run offenses that look similar to what my ream runs and talk to or study then (ie I wouldn't read alot of double wing articles if my team is a spread team).
Clinics are great, they can be a bit diverse, maybe try and find a college close by that runs a similar style and go down to spring camp, I don't think theres a place in America where you can't find a spread running college within 3 hours drive.
The other thing I would do is ask the head coach what are the base plays in this offense we run, what are the complimentary plays. Learn the base plays first then learn the other stuff after that. Example if my teams runs the wing-t theres a good chance buck sweep might be our base.
Process of elimination really, focus on what you guys do before expanding to the big picture of football. Many concepts in football are similar just run from different sets with different focus.
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Post by noplaysoff on Jan 18, 2011 23:11:14 GMT -6
We had our banquet last night and we had a RB coach resign for family reasons. I feel like calling our HC and telling him I want the job and I'll spend the next 6 months learning the position. Should I do it?
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Post by blb on Jan 19, 2011 6:52:37 GMT -6
Yes.
Why does your program wait so long afte season is over to have banquet? I can't wait to get ours out of the way (do it 10 days after end of regular season regardless if we're still playing or not).
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Post by phantom on Jan 19, 2011 7:07:28 GMT -6
I would think that if this was me I would look at the offense my team runs and then try and identify other places that run offenses that look similar to what my ream runs and talk to or study then (ie I wouldn't read alot of double wing articles if my team is a spread team). Clinics are great, they can be a bit diverse, maybe try and find a college close by that runs a similar style and go down to spring camp, I don't think theres a place in America where you can't find a spread running college within 3 hours drive. The other thing I would do is ask the head coach what are the base plays in this offense we run, what are the complimentary plays. Learn the base plays first then learn the other stuff after that. Example if my teams runs the wing-t theres a good chance buck sweep might be our base. Process of elimination really, focus on what you guys do before expanding to the big picture of football. Many concepts in football are similar just run from different sets with different focus. I don't agree with this. I think that it's good for a young coach to be exposed to a lot of different systems. Certainly he should concentrate of learning his own team's system and technique but it has to help to hear a variety of ideas.
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Post by blb on Jan 19, 2011 8:43:58 GMT -6
I think that it's good for a young coach to be exposed to a lot of different systems. Certainly he should concentrate of learning his own team's system and technique but it has to help to hear a variety of ideas. True, but a young-beginning coach needs to have good grasp of his team's own stuff (numbering system, terminology etc.) first to have a frame of reference for processing others.
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Post by brophy on Jan 19, 2011 11:51:18 GMT -6
Yes. Why does your program wait so long afte season is over to have banquet? I can't wait to get ours out of the way (do it 10 days after end of regular season regardless if we're still playing or not). most seasons won't end until the 2nd week of december.....so putting together a banquet would have to take place after the Christmas break (we have ours at the end of Jan) I feel like calling our HC and telling him I want the job and I'll spend the next 6 months learning the position. Should I do it? are you going to be okay if he says "no"? Yes, you should go for it, but don't take it personal
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Post by blb on Jan 19, 2011 12:05:30 GMT -6
Yes. Why does your program wait so long afte season is over to have banquet? I can't wait to get ours out of the way (do it 10 days after end of regular season regardless if we're still playing or not). most seasons won't end until the 2nd week of december.....so putting together a banquet would have to take place after the Christmas break (we have ours at the end of Jan) Our last regular season game is around third Friday in October. Even if we went to state finals, last game would be Thanksgiving weekend. We have Banquet first Monday in November. Why does your season run so late brophy, or are you perennial state champions?
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Post by coachwoodall on Jan 19, 2011 12:35:45 GMT -6
I would suggest a little different route. There is nothing wrong with learning the 'why', but I would just stick to the 3 Ws: who, what, where. And maybe the 'how'. The why will come.
Unlike some others, I think the rote memorization is essential to building the foundation for be able to more intricately understanding the whys later. We don't do enough of that in schools today.
I am a global thinker. I see the big picture and how all that stuff works in tandem with each other. that is the only reason I was worth a dip of snuff when I played. But more importantly the execuation of specific technique is what make the fundamental difference.
For example. I have coache DBs for 14 years. I am by no means an expert, but I have a pretty good grasp on the ins and outs of the secondary. This off season, I spent 85% of my study/research on 1 thing: the back pedal. The other 10% was spent on the alternatives to the back pedal, and maybe 5% on scheme.
I think you should approach from the part to whole method. If you are going to coach TEs, then start with the stance. Learn all you can about just this one thing. I.E. how wide should the feet be, angle of the hips/back, how much to stagger the feet, where to place the hand, what should the weight distribution be for each foot, and hand.
Then progress to the first step, how big, what do the hands do, angle of step, how do the hips/back respond.
Then so forth...
I would want you to become an expert on the TE and base blocking. Then the down block, then reach block, etc.... Most managers want entry level people to really know 1 - 2 things and specifically how that can help the team get better. The other stuff will come along.
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Post by noplaysoff on Jan 19, 2011 12:44:54 GMT -6
Yes. Why does your program wait so long afte season is over to have banquet? I can't wait to get ours out of the way (do it 10 days after end of regular season regardless if we're still playing or not). most seasons won't end until the 2nd week of december.....so putting together a banquet would have to take place after the Christmas break (we have ours at the end of Jan) I feel like calling our HC and telling him I want the job and I'll spend the next 6 months learning the position. Should I do it? are you going to be okay if he says "no"? Yes, you should go for it, but don't take it personal Our season ended when we missed the playoffs on Thanksgiving day. I talked to him, I told him that I wanted a larger responsibility such as wagging the plays in (I did formations, but know all the plays), that I'd study hard to be the best RB coach I could be, and I'd take on JV responsibilities as well. He basically said it was too soon to make a decision but we're going to a Nike clinic in a couple weeks, so we'll talk more then. He's still in the process of holding individual coaching meetings. I told him it sounds great and that I'm excited to start back up again.
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Post by phantom on Jan 19, 2011 14:04:53 GMT -6
I don't agree with this. I think that it's good for a young coach to be exposed to a lot of different systems. Certainly he should concentrate of learning his own team's system and technique but it has to help to hear a variety of ideas. [/quote] Football's a wide open topic with many languages. To dive in and just start learning would probably confuse someone. If you were to learn about cars you might want to start off by learnin how to drive your own car before you start trying to learn how to repair the engine of someone elses Ferrari. Then when you learn that "your car has a gas, brake, clutch, parking brake etc" it will be alot easier for you to transition the information when someone else starts talking about their car. If you go up to someone and they say "oh i have a problem with my parking brake" and then the other person says "gee my emergency brake is broken" and your sitting there thinking "what the hell is a parking brake, what's an emergency brake" your gonna be screwed... but if you learn about your car then when someone says "gee my emergency brake is broken" and you say "what the hecks an emergency brake... is that like the parking brake on my car" you have some common ground...[/quote] I still disagree and I don't get your analogy at all. When I started out I attended clinics and sat in on every lecture that I could. I think that it helped me get a general idea about a lot of football. I really don't see what harm it would do and it could help.
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hawke
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Post by hawke on Jan 19, 2011 15:59:59 GMT -6
Football is not a difficult game in its basic principles. Where it is very complex is in preparation and execution. If you are looking for football philosophy it is not very hard to find. Just about all the great coaches have something printed up as to their philosophy. But there is more to it than that. To be a football coach you have to be willing to put 100% of yourself into the job and you must be ambitious to the best job where you are. Your first sacrifice starts in the having long days and short nights (complete dedication); you must communicate properly; don't overcoach; most of all be yourself; be loyal to your school; be decisive. Do your job where you are and you'll find others looking for you. The Xs and Os are the easiest part of coaching.
Hawke
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Post by M4 on Jan 19, 2011 20:34:09 GMT -6
it means that you need a basic idea of what you wnana learn before you start to learn, a GPS doesn't work if you don't put an address in, know what i mean
if your coaching in the spread and you go to 4 double wing speakers your not really coming out with much useful knowledge in terms of scheme... they dont really match up on too much, sure you might learn how to make a kick out block or how to wedge but... you don't see many airraid teams running wedge from the gun with 5 linemen and 4 receivers
in my opinion you'd probably get alot more if you started off learning about the spread and then expand from there,
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Post by phantom on Jan 19, 2011 20:56:43 GMT -6
it means that you need a basic idea of what you wnana learn before you start to learn, a GPS doesn't work if you don't put an address in, know what i mean if your coaching in the spread and you go to 4 double wing speakers your not really coming out with much useful knowledge in terms of scheme... they dont really match up on too much, sure you might learn how to make a kick out block or how to wedge but... you don't see many airraid teams running wedge from the gun with 5 linemen and 4 receivers in my opinion you'd probably get alot more if you started off learning about the spread and then expand from there, I certainly wouldn't advise a spread coach going to 4 DW sessions. I don't see why he shouldn't go to one. I also don't see attending one or two clinics that do not directly pertain to the immediate job impedes a a coaches ability to prepare for his immediate job. If a coach stays in it for a career he'll probably coach in a number of systems. If he's going to coach offense he needs to understand defenses and vice-versa. I think that expecting a young coach to focus only on the job he has to do right now is short-sighted.
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Post by M4 on Jan 20, 2011 8:26:14 GMT -6
I don't think I'm saying that. The poster seemed to be a young guy who was starting off. He talked about getting up to speed to contribute to his team right away. Learning a vast array of topics isn't going to help that out. Learning about the system he runs right now is.
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Post by phantom on Jan 20, 2011 9:19:04 GMT -6
I don't think I'm saying that. The poster seemed to be a young guy who was starting off. He talked about getting up to speed to contribute to his team right away. Learning a vast array of topics isn't going to help that out. Learning about the system he runs right now is. It's January. How does going to a 3 day clinic and spending time there at sessions other than his immediate responsibility (which, BTW, he doesn't know yet)? He has plenty of time to focus on his job in the other months before he'll be required to actually coach.
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